Is there really anything you can't teach yourself?

[Aikicomp]

As far as martial arts go, is there really anything you can't learn on your own (alone in the sense that you don't have a proper instructor, not that you don't have a sparring partner) besides things like how to do a proper horse stance and silly things like that?

When I think about it, it just seems to me like most martial arts in general mainly teach people improve their reflexes, reaction time, and coordination, which are all things one can do if they use their common sense when training. Things like joint-locks and grappling techniques to me seem like they could be self-taught from either watching videos of others, reading a martial arts guide, or even just coming up with stuff on your own, provided you have a partner you can try your ideas on.

I guess theoretically it is possible, as that is how people come up with new styles of martial arts, but what do you think?

To your original question......to do so IMO would be wasteful. As others have said without an instructor to show you the little things you are doing wrong or right it would hinder you greatly.

I'm an Instructor of Ju-Jitsu in which we use joint-locks and grappling extensively these techniques are dangerous and are finely taught, tuned and applied and without proper instruction in joint manipulation you seriously run the risk of destroying much needed parts of your and your partners body.

My advice is do not do it, bad things will eventually happen.

Michael

 

[Bruno@MT]

.

4. Show up, listen up, and keep up. You won't get anywhere without going to class regularly. Listen to your instructors, you're paying them for a reason. Practice at home. They can tell who does and who doesn't.-Rob

Yes, they can.

Currently, ninpo is only 1 class per week. I try to practise at home 2 times per week, just repeating the same basic kihon and tai sabaki over and over. He notices such things, because he can tell which people improve faster than others, and which people have corrected some of their mistakes from one class to another.

But without a teacher to point out the little mistakes (e.g. toes down, not sideways) you will not get rid of the small yet basic and mistakes that will influence everything you will learn afterwards.

Even the founders of a new style didn't get their skills out of the blue. They were usually expert at one or more existing arts, had an insight and built it from there. They didn't sat around in the couch until they thought 'I am going to invent <insert style here>'

You cannot learn MA without a teacher. You can learn some things, and perhaps even learn to fight. But once your skills are checked / tested by someone who is an expert, he will find tons of mistakes.

 

[K-man]

I do look at books, magazines etc to get new ideas. What I have seen promoted in books, magazines and videos may look good in print or on the screen so that is the first test. The second test is take it to the dojo, train it against resistance and see if it works. Some do some don't.

Recently I borrowed a book from the local library purporting to teach women self-defence. I would defy even a trained martial artist to make a large number of the techniques work. Anyone believing that they were protected by anything they learned in that book would be dead in a minute on the street. Just there is no one to vet the garbage printed.

Best answer, unless you are a reasonably skilled martial artist, avoid the middle man, go straight to a good teacher. :asian:

 

[jarrod]

i compare self-teaching to tinkering around on a car. you can take things apart, put them back together, figure out how they work, & generally be wiser for it. but it just goes a lot smoother if you have a mechanic friend that can help you out.

i think self-teaching is a valuable supplement to regular instruction, but it's no replacement.

jf

 

[Tez3]

When sparring by yourself would you have to hit and kick yourself to make the training realistic?

 

[Carol]

When sparring by yourself would you have to hit and kick yourself to make the training realistic?

Or you could do what I do. Be really clumsy and smash in to things. It hurts, you get bruised, just like training

Someone on FMATalk awhile back was asking about the best part of training in the FMAs. One of the posters said the best part was sitting down for dinner with your teachers and/or classmates, because that's what real memories are made of.

 

[seasoned]

As far as martial arts go, is there really anything you can't learn on your own (alone in the sense that you don't have a proper instructor, not that you don't have a sparring partner) besides things like how to do a proper horse stance and silly things like that?

When I think about it, it just seems to me like most martial arts in general mainly teach people improve their reflexes, reaction time, and coordination, which are all things one can do if they use their common sense when training. Things like joint-locks and grappling techniques to me seem like they could be self-taught from either watching videos of others, reading a martial arts guide, or even just coming up with stuff on your own, provided you have a partner you can try your ideas on.

I guess theoretically it is possible, as that is how people come up with new styles of martial arts, but what do you think?

If it is an art you are talking about, no, books and video’s are to enhance someone who is already advanced in some type of formal training. Say I want to build a house, there are many ways I could begin, and many ways I could fail. I could perhaps buy all of the material after looking over my “how to do it book“. Doing it this way would be fine for a short while, but then, I might spend a lot of money and time for nothing. I could go to a trade school and learn parts of home building, but miss a lot of the finer points. My last choice could be to see if I could pick up a job working for a professional, established builder, and start at the bottom, and over many years of working along side experience people, and with the right attitude, become a home builder, and even own a business some day. Please keep in mind that anyone can build a kids tree house with little training, but to truly do it right, then the above is the method I would pursue. Seek out a qualified, dedicated, person who can mentor you, and who has the depth within any art of your choosing and do it the right way. Good luck.

 

[Hand Sword]

Alright, after reading all of these responses, I have only one question for all of you poo pooers....Who's going to pay for all the broken glass of my glass house that you ALL threw rocks through??????????

Oh yeah.....and clean up the mess?

 

[seasoned]

Alright, after reading all of these responses, I have only one question for all of you poo pooers....Who's going to pay for all the broken glass of my glass house that you ALL threw rocks through??????????

Oh yeah.....and clean up the mess?

That is a very good place to start the rebuilding process.

 

[bowser666]

Lol and now Deep Thoughts .............. By Jack Handy ... Anyone remember that skit on SnL ? The OP's posts really remind me of that skit. Anyways my 2 cents on thsi is , sure you can teach yourself whatever you want but dont expect it to work. Remember the Ki master? I have a feeling he was self taught and look what he got.

 

[Sukerkin]

You learn better and will go further when you stand on the shoulders of those who have gone before you.

get a teacher.

quit looking for the quick-fix or the instant gratification.

Stop fooling yourself.

Very important advice that bears repeating there.

Learning a martial art is a long road and without a teacher it is not only hard to get started on the road but it is also very hard not to wander off it and get lost.

My empty hand MA experience lasted more than a decade and was only curtailed by severe injury in a bike accident. After all those years, I had a feeling that I was pretty good but could see where others were better and how my teacher could guide me to get there.

In my current (sword) art, I am nidan, have six years or more training and am very well aware of how far I have to go and how easy it is to fall into bad habits and poor technique without the prescence of a talented teacher.

Teaching yourself something as complex and exacting as a Martial Art is in nearly all cases going to be an excercise in disappointment. Even if you manage to interpret the books and videos correctly and mimic the moves, it will still take longer than by 'proper' tuition and more than likely you will have not developed a full understanding of just what all those fancy motions are for.

 

[Flying Crane]

...besides things like how to do a proper horse stance and silly things like that?

wow, the level of arrogant ignorance is truly astounding.

 

[morph4me]

Sure you can. You can teach yourself to fly an airplane the same way, or to drive a car. The results will be the same, you go through the motions and get yourself hurt.

 

[clfsean]

As far as martial arts go, is there really anything you can't learn on your own (alone in the sense that you don't have a proper instructor, not that you don't have a sparring partner) besides things like how to do a proper horse stance and silly things like that?

Silly??? Oh ok... since you already know it all & obviously don't need the "silly things" to develop your foundation, why are you asking us?

When I think about it, it just seems to me like most martial arts in general mainly teach people improve their reflexes, reaction time, and coordination, which are all things one can do if they use their common sense when training. Things like joint-locks and grappling techniques to me seem like they could be self-taught from either watching videos of others, reading a martial arts guide, or even just coming up with stuff on your own, provided you have a partner you can try your ideas on.

Only thing "learned" by MA training is to improve

improve their reflexes, reaction time, and coordination, which are all things one can do if they use their common sense when training.

and techniques & skills could be learned from videos or making it up as you go.

Dude... do you actually believe this crap or are you just that moronic when it comes to MA training????????????

I guess theoretically it is possible, as that is how people come up with new styles of martial arts, but what do you think?

Chicken or egg???

 

[daoneplus2]

What if there are not Martial Art schools in your town or city?

What if you can not pay the funds required to see an instructor?

I can see how a lot of Martial Artist frown upon training without an instructor/teacher and confused by it as Martial Arts has been passed down from generation to generation, teacher to student.

But what about a time in darkness, lets say hypothetically there is an aggressive bully who treats you like scum and you want to learn Marital Arts to know what to do in these kind of situations. But the above situations apply? What do you do?

I agree that a student with a teacher could achieve more than a student without. But I haven't seen the most important question been ask?

What if it works? What if training by yourself works?

What if after two hours of practicing techniques with a friend you decide to go to the local bar and you get in a fight with an intoxicated sod and you defeat him using your Judo take-down or you Wing Chun trapping or Muay Thai kick or whatever you practiced with your friend early that day?

Whats to say you can't stop training by yourself? Who's to say? If it works why can't you use it?

'Absorb what is useful, discard what is useless, and add what is essentially your own.' - Bruce Lee

Just my opinion.

 

[bluekey88]

Self-teaching i slike sex. Sure, there's some stuff you can do by yourself, but it always leaves a mess and it's SOOOO much more fun when others are involved.

Peace,
Erik

 

[Sukerkin]

If it works, then it works. No great mystery there.

What it will not be, to a greater or lesser extent depending on the person, is the martial art being mimiced.
What it will also likely not be is as effective as if the person had been properly taught.

EDIT: FC followed me with a much more straight-talking and detailed response.

 

[Flying Crane]

What if there are not Martial Art schools in your town or city?

What if you can not pay the funds required to see an instructor?

then you are out of luck. you don't have any god-given right to learn martial arts. if there are no instructors that you can train with, then you don't get to train, plain and simple. Get over it. Life ain't fair.

What if it works? What if training by yourself works?

It doesn't. But a lot of people fool themselves into believing that it does. No sweat off my back if you wanna live in self-delusion. Do what you want.

What if after two hours of practicing techniques with a friend you decide to go to the local bar and you get in a fight with an intoxicated sod and you defeat him using your Judo take-down or you Wing Chun trapping or Muay Thai kick or whatever you practiced with your friend early that day?

Most likely you will get your *** handed to you unless you simply get lucky, in which case the two hours spent with your friend had nothing to do with it. Trying to apply poorly learned techniques is inviting disaster be rained down on your ***.

Whats to say you can't stop training by yourself? Who's to say? If it works why can't you use it?

Nobody can tell you that you can't. But knowledgeable advice has been generously handed out here. Choose to ignore it if you want. Darwin awards are given out yearly...

'Absorb what is useful, discard what is useless, and add what is essentially your own.' - Bruce Lee

Quoting Bruce Lee out of context and with no understanding of the martial arts is a very foolish thing to do. In fact, it's tantamount to blind stupidity.

 

[Thesemindz]

What if there are not Martial Art schools in your town or city?

What if you can not pay the funds required to see an instructor?

I can see how a lot of Martial Artist frown upon training without an instructor/teacher and confused by it as Martial Arts has been passed down from generation to generation, teacher to student.

But what about a time in darkness, lets say hypothetically there is an aggressive bully who treats you like scum and you want to learn Marital Arts to know what to do in these kind of situations. But the above situations apply? What do you do?

I agree that a student with a teacher could achieve more than a student without. But I haven't seen the most important question been ask?

What if it works? What if training by yourself works?

What if after two hours of practicing techniques with a friend you decide to go to the local bar and you get in a fight with an intoxicated sod and you defeat him using your Judo take-down or you Wing Chun trapping or Muay Thai kick or whatever you practiced with your friend early that day?

Whats to say you can't stop training by yourself? Who's to say? If it works why can't you use it?

'Absorb what is useful, discard what is useless, and add what is essentially your own.' - Bruce Lee

Just my opinion.

I'm not feeling patient enough for this today.

The short answer is no. You are wrong about everything. It doesn't work like that.

Every single experienced martial artist in this thread has said the same thing. Are you listening?

That's not how it works. You can't just read about a judo throw and go beat up the town bully. It doesn't work.

Go ahead. Fool yourself. Go buy a BJJ book or watch a kenpo video on youtube and tell everyone what a badass you are. I just hope for your sake you never meet a real one.

Am I the only one who sees red when someone throws out a Bruce Lee quote and thinks that lends even an ounce of credibility to their argument?


-Rob

 

[MJS]

What if there are not Martial Art schools in your town or city?

What if you can not pay the funds required to see an instructor?

I can see how a lot of Martial Artist frown upon training without an instructor/teacher and confused by it as Martial Arts has been passed down from generation to generation, teacher to student.

But what about a time in darkness, lets say hypothetically there is an aggressive bully who treats you like scum and you want to learn Marital Arts to know what to do in these kind of situations. But the above situations apply? What do you do?

I agree that a student with a teacher could achieve more than a student without. But I haven't seen the most important question been ask?

What if it works? What if training by yourself works?

What if after two hours of practicing techniques with a friend you decide to go to the local bar and you get in a fight with an intoxicated sod and you defeat him using your Judo take-down or you Wing Chun trapping or Muay Thai kick or whatever you practiced with your friend early that day?

Whats to say you can't stop training by yourself? Who's to say? If it works why can't you use it?

'Absorb what is useful, discard what is useless, and add what is essentially your own.' - Bruce Lee

Just my opinion.

It may be possible, however, the quality of that person will be poor. I don't care how long anyone trains, what DVDs you watch or what books you read, without a real, live teaching, standing in front of you, the skills that you do 'learn' will be minimal at best.

What if there are no schools around? In todays world, I find that very hard to believe. There may not be an art you want to train in, but no schools....I'm not sure I buy that. However, your options are:

1) Travel to the school you want to train at. If you want that art bad enough, you'll make a sacrifice. Nobody ever said training would be easy. So if it means, driving 1 1/2 hrs each way, so be it.

2) Travel to the school you're interested in, and take 1 or 2 day intensive private lessons. Lets say I wanted to train with the Dog Bros. I don't live in Ca., so I'd have to contact Marc Denny, tell him I am planning a 2 day trip, what I want out of the lesson, fly to Ca., train, tape my lesson, take notes, etc., fly back home and train my *** off on what I learned. You may not be able to make it out that often, but doing that is better than trying to figure something out from a tape.

3) Lets say you want to train in Kenpo, but there are no Kenpo schools and you dont want to travel. But, there is a TKD school. I'd rather see someone train TKD, if they wanted to train bad enough. At least they'd be learning from a live teacher. Then down the road, you may be able to train at a place that you had originally intended on.