Interact with quality martial artists.

[drop bear]

what the hell is glassing

Where I hit you with something glass. Hoping to cut half your face off.

 

[Drose427]

What rules? switching off so we both learn? You can swipe, stab, and cut any part of the body. I said that, no size restrictions, no restrictions as to where I can strike you, or how I can take you down, I fail to see where you picking out rules from.

what the hell is glassing

Cutting with glass, whicccchhh correlates to knife Defense which most SD schools do.

 

[tshadowchaser]

wow I dont know of any place that lets one do that I have seen people put through glass door and windows but thats different. If anyone planning on using glass in my school all I would tell them at your own risk because if their are no rules then different things happen. I doubt anyone on this forum knows who or what my students are or their qualifications.
So I must ask have you pulled this glassing in any other school or is this something you dream of doing to someone if you can not win any other way or maybe just some sick dream you have had

but once again we are way off your OP this is your thread so if you do not care I certainly do not

 

[drop bear]

Neither is Sport Training. But according to what you told Chris, that makes them unsuccessful fighters. If people can defend themselves in street brawls, or when being attacked without sports training, its hard to call an emphasis on sport a necessity.

I would rather know I can defend myself against a 200 lbs man out for blood using what I've learned and drilled in SD, than hope I can break my Sports habits and fight someone considerably larger, which I may rarely do in a Sports Setting.

So you are saying what you do in training is the same as what a street fighting biker does?

Because people who do not train sport but have won a heap of street fights obviously are able to defend themselves. Somehow I just don't think of Chris as being the sort of biker enforcer being discussed.

I am certainly not one and have no wish to be. I have known a few and they live pretty terrible lives.

 

[drop bear]

What rules? switching off so we both learn? You can swipe, stab, and cut any part of the body. I said that, no size restrictions, no restrictions as to where I can strike you, or how I can take you down, I fail to see where you picking out rules from.

Cutting with glass, whicccchhh correlates to knife Defense which most SD schools do.

I don't get a real glass for one.

 

[drop bear]

wow I dont know of any place that lets one do that I have seen people put through glass door and windows but thats different. If anyone planning on using glass in my school all I would tell them at your own risk because if their are no rules then different things happen. I doubt anyone on this forum knows who or what my students are or their qualifications.
So I must ask have you pulled this glassing in any other school or is this something you dream of doing to someone if you can not win any other way or maybe just some sick dream you have had

but once again we are way off your OP this is your thread so if you do not care I certainly do not

I get off topic anyway but this is still interesting. I am still tying to make this point

In mma you don't glass people because rules yeah?

In tma you don't glass people because rules yeah?

in sd training you don't glass people because rules yeah?

So where does this idea that one system trains with rules and one doesn't. It would be insane to train without rules.

 

[Drose427]

So you are saying what you do in training is the same as what a street fighting biker does?

Because people who do not train sport but have won a heap of street fights obviously are able to defend themselves. Somehow I just don't think of Chris as being the sort of biker enforcer being discussed.

I am certainly not one and have no wish to be. I have known a few and they live pretty terrible lives.

No, but many of the situations I do train for are situations they;re most likely to see i.e. drunk bar brawl, swinging a weapon like a bottle or knife.

You've ignored this argument completely. So I'll ask again, if someone without Sports Training can defend themselves, how is it a necessity? This whole debate began from that argument.

I don't get a real glass for one.

No, but rubber knives still tear skin pretty easily, I have electric ones from FMA as well, and the same techniques for knife will work on glass. A difference in choice of weapon hardly constitutes a sport medium.

I get off topic anyway but this is still interesting. I am still tying to make this point

In mma you don't glass people because rules yeah?

In tma you don't glass people because rules yeah?

in sd training you don't glass people because rules yeah?

So where does this idea that one system trains with rules and one doesn't. It would be insane to train without rules.

Because SD rules, usually only apply to power delivered. Theres no restriction on movement, techniques, target areas, size of the people training. What you learn in a school isnt limited to what you can do in the sport setting. SD, you imitate glassing, many times using other painful method. Whereas in training for a sport, you most likely never will.

 

[drop bear]

No, but many of the situations I do train for are situations they;re most likely to see i.e. drunk bar brawl, swinging a weapon like a bottle or knife.

You've ignored this argument completely. So I'll ask again, if someone without Sports Training can defend themselves, how is it a necessity? This whole debate began from that argument.

It isn't necessary as all martial arts training is not necessary. But fighting quality guys is necessary. Which is the common ground between that street fighting biker and sports training.

 

[drop bear]

No, but rubber knives still tear skin pretty easily, I have electric ones from FMA as well, and the same techniques for knife will work on glass. A difference in choice of weapon

I have a set of padded gloves that we could use to simulate fighting pretty realistically as well.

What is the difference?

 

[Drose427]

It isn't necessary as all martial arts training is not necessary. But fighting quality guys is necessary. Which is the common ground between that street fighting biker and sports training.

I agree that working with quality instructors or training is important. But that was not the point in question

 

[drop bear]

Because SD rules, usually only apply to power delivered. Theres no restriction on movement, techniques, target areas, size of the people training. What you learn in a school isnt limited to what you can do in the sport setting. SD, you imitate glassing, many times using other painful method. Whereas in training for a sport, you most likely never will.

So we are breaking the fight quality guys rule. And so discounting our biker friend.

 

[tshadowchaser]

ok we are off topic
so I'll just say there was a gentleman in cal. that was an ex special forces person. He trained a few people. The rules of his school were drink before during and after class so you know what you can do under those condition. Only live blades are to be used or hatchets, spears. Bring your insurance papers and He must have a written paper with permission to get you to a hospital and authority to grant medical treatment till your family arrives.
It was a darn interesting class.. Don't know if he still has classes they where pretty private with only about a dozen student at any one and he would be in his 70's by now

Now he did not teach sport but he taught SD. He was trained in the military, in the Philippians, in Norway (I think his ancestors where vikings), and on an Indian reservation. Yes he had rules mainly stay alive and try what you think will work. And yes control was used but people still got hurt on occasion. BUT his rules are not what other would want in their training places

 

[Drose427]

I have a set of padded gloves that we could use to simulate fighting pretty realistically as well.

What is the difference?

Fake knives, look like and move like real knives. All the same techs apply. Gloves v not gloved, a grappler will say there are techs he cant do in terms of hand joints. Personally, doesnt affect me. We dont use gloves when doing SD, most of us have had the black eyes and shed the blood to be used to it.

So we are breaking the fight quality guys rule. And so discounting our biker friend.

I fail to see how any of that applies. You can do SD with quality partners and instructors just like anything else and have the same effect.

 

[tshadowchaser]

Folks I keep pulling this from the OP and your discussion so I am taking myself out of the thread for now I apologize for sidetracking the thread

 

[drop bear]

I agree that working with quality instructors or training is important. But that was not the point in question

The point in question is that a biker with no training. And that is no self defence. Or no sports training has either the natural ability or has learned by some method the ability to defend himself.

And we are trying to figure out what that element is. Now you seem to keep linking it to self defence training. But I don't see the link. Because he does not do self defence training.

I assume he does not practice with rubber weapons either.

He does fight people. There is a link.

 

[drop bear]

ok we are off topic
so I'll just say there was a gentleman in cal. that was an ex special forces person. He trained a few people. The rules of his school were drink before during and after class so you know what you can do under those condition. Only live blades are to be used or hatchets, spears. Bring your insurance papers and He must have a written paper with permission to get you to a hospital and authority to grant medical treatment till your family arrives.
It was a darn interesting class.. Don't know if he still has classes they where pretty private with only about a dozen student at any one and he would be in his 70's by now

Now he did not teach sport but he taught SD. He was trained in the military, in the Philippians, in Norway (I think his ancestors where vikings), and on an Indian reservation. Yes he had rules mainly stay alive and try what you think will work. And yes control was used but people still got hurt on occasion. BUT his rules are not what other would want in their training places

There is a law of diminishing returns a bit though. In that at some stage just copping the beating might be easier than training to avoid it.

There is a level i think where it can start to work against you a bit.

 

[drop bear]

Folks I keep pulling this from the OP and your discussion so I am taking myself out of the thread for now I apologize for sidetracking the thread

Well kind of because i think there is a definite link between biker guy fighting quality guys and thus gaining self defence skills.

I would have said that is a perfect example because that is all he has done.

The only place i would really argue there is he may be taking the concept a bit far out of what is good for you individually and what is generally acceptable in society. This would also apply to that live knife stuff. Which are factors most of us have to consider.

 

[drop bear]

I fail to see how any of that applies. You can do SD with quality partners and instructors just like anything else and have the same effect.

Except if you drop the contact to much you are not really fighting them.

 

[Drose427]

The point in question is that a biker with no training. And that is no self defence. Or no sports training has either the natural ability or has learned by some method the ability to defend himself.

And we are trying to figure out what that element is. Now you seem to keep linking it to self defence training. But I don't see the link. Because he does not do self defence training.

I assume he does not practice with rubber weapons either.

He does fight people. There is a link.

No, the point I called you out on in the beginning was in your conversation with Chris Parker. Where you were adamant about needing to physically fight. Added to some of your other posts, which showed (and you admitted earlier in our debate) that you very much believe sports training to be a necessity, which you just now admitted was false. You also claimed Chris was never a successful fighter, which is like saying the biker isn't although he can successfully defend himself.

Why should one Free Spar, when we can completely recreate someone twice your size, belligerent, Swinging at your face at full power thus recreating the scenario of your average street fight? Why are 5 minute rounds necessary when I can take him down in less than one?

Except if you drop the contact to much you are not really fighting them.

Thats the point. Full sparring isnt as important as simple recreation. Whens the last time a street fight went 20 minutes?
No, I dont need to break my partners knee or rib. But if theyre the attacker theyre still going to try to break my nose.

Working with and learning from quality people is far more important than just going out and "fighting" them.

Do I spar? Yeah, 4 times a week. 2 Traditional TSD medium contact (blood and bruises) and 2 days Full Muay Thai rules. But nothing I learned there I didnt see first in SD drills, aside from combinations, but many of those get used in our drills as well.

 

[Buka]

Glass, blood, bikers, bruising - gee willikers, fellas, that's a mouthful. Sure is a long way from interacting with quality Martial Artists.