Cons & Ma

[DieRegteAdriaan]

Here in South Africa they have been teaching low and medium security criminals karate for a while now. They say it can help them becom better people I say it can get either way. Whats your thoughts on this?

 

[BrandonLucas]

I would go with something non-violent, myself, if I were doing the teaching, like Yoga. Yoga makes you feel wonderful after you do it, and doesn't teach you how to be more effective as a fighter.

 

[terryl965]

Makes sense give the cons a new way of hurting the innocent.

 

[JadecloudAlchemist]

I don't think it's a good idea. I would recommend Yoga as mentioned,meditation,Qigong,stress and anger management classes would all be better than Karate for those who are in jail.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Yoga or Qigong.... NOT karate or any other martial art.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

I'm fairly old school regarding convicts.

No television, no programs, nothing. Just bread and water and approved reading material. No physical training AT ALL! When they're out, they should be underweight and weak as kittens.

Needless to say, my idea of what convicts should be allowed would preclude any sort of martial arts training.

Daniel

 

[arnisador]

The discipline makes sense to me. They've already shown they're willing and able to hurt others. I'd object to teaching them knife-fighting or gunsmanship, but not an open-handed martial art. Anyone who sticks with it long enough to get good at it must surely have the self-discipline to change.

That having been said, tai chi might still have been my first choice.

 

[BrandonLucas]

The discipline makes sense to me. They've already shown they're willing and able to hurt others. I'd object to teaching them knife-fighting or gunsmanship, but not an open-handed martial art. Anyone who sticks with it long enough to get good at it must surely have the self-discipline to change.

That having been said, tai chi might still have been my first choice.

I don't quite agree with this. I have seen convicts that stick to a regimen of weight-lifting while in prison, and get in very good shape. Just because they have the ability to stick with a program to get into better shape doesn't mean that they have the self-discipline to change the person that they are.

I agree that the martial arts has this effect on some people. But, in my honest opinion, that is why the schools are offered to the public...if someone has serverd their time, then they are more than welcome to learn a martial art, since they have become part of the public again.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

The discipline makes sense to me. They've already shown they're willing and able to hurt others. I'd object to teaching them knife-fighting or gunsmanship, but not an open-handed martial art. Anyone who sticks with it long enough to get good at it must surely have the self-discipline to change.

While I can appreciate the logic of your post, I've known too many people in martial arts who were just plain horrible people without being convicted criminals to agree with you.

Also, self discipline isn't necesarilly the problem for criminals; criminals can be quite 'disciplined' in their criminal activity. Organized crime is quite disciplined in its approach, so the issue isn't discipline. It is moral compass, sometimes compounded by substance abuse and in some cases, psychological issues.

And until the moral compass is addressed and any substance abuse issues dealt with, they should not only not get martial training in prison, but should probably be prohibited from it upon release. I have a fairly low opinion of 'rehabilitation' of criminals in any nation's justice system, and dojo staff are ill equipped to deal with rehabilitating an ex con or dealing with substance abuse and psychological issues.

As you've observed, they've already shown a willingness to hurt others. Willingness to hurt others does not stem from lack of discipline; it stems from either anger, desperation, or being desensitized (for whatever reason) to violent behaviour. In some cases, they just plain enjoy it.

Daniel

 

[zDom]

Thunderdome: two convicts enter, one leaves.

Repeat till we have only one convict. Kind of fuzzy on what to do at that point.

 

[hkfuie]

I don't think the martial arts in and of themselves necessarily create better people. It's the martial artists who are seekers and continually striving to improve who they are and are open to lessons of ma and life that give ma it's great rep. Oh, and great people instructing. It's not the movements themselves that create the transformation, in my opinion.

As others have said, while I know lots of wonderful people who are martial artists, I know some not so wonderful ones, too.

Am I the only one, who when I was around green belt or so, looked up from my training and said, "Aw, shucks. Why isn't anyone attacking me so I can use all this cool stuff I am learning?" Luckily I outgrew this. But from the chuckles I get when I tell this story in class, I think I am not the only one to have had this thought.

 

[JBrainard]

Thunderdome: two convicts enter, one leaves.

Repeat till we have only one convict. Kind of fuzzy on what to do at that point.

I'm still waiting for "The Running Man" reality show to come out.

 

[shihansmurf]

Makes sense give the cons a new way of hurting the innocent.

Gotta agree with you 100%
Lets take people that have already shown a propensity to perform acts of violence and give them the tools to make them better at it. Perhaps we should be teaching them SWAT tactics as well.

I'm all for educating criminals while they are in jail so they can enter society with a better chance to be successfull without committing crime I don't think teaching them how to fight better is the right way to achieve that goal.

Mark

 

[BrandonLucas]

Thunderdome: two convicts enter, one leaves.

Repeat till we have only one convict. Kind of fuzzy on what to do at that point.

That's easy:

Feature him/her on every episode of "The Hills" from now on.

That'll teach people to break the law.

 

[shihansmurf]

Thunderdome: two convicts enter, one leaves.

Repeat till we have only one convict. Kind of fuzzy on what to do at that point.

Well, we have a bit of a recuiting problemin the Army. We could keep guys like the in glass cases with signs that read "In case of war break Glass"

Didn't Jean-Claude do some crappy movie like that?

Mark

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

Well, we have a bit of a recuiting problemin the Army. We could keep guys like the in glass cases with signs that read "In case of war break Glass"

Didn't Jean-Claude do some crappy movie like that?

Mark

Thought that was Stalone in Demolition Man, though with direct to video, VanDamme may have done it several times over.

Unless of course you're thinking of Universal Soldier, in which case Lundgren's character in the movie is a good illustration of why giving bad people more tools to use in commiting violence is a bad idea.

Daniel

 

[still learning]

Hello, One of major purpose of martial arts? .....is teach fighting back..self-defense skills and build a stronger body.

Hard to explain this...then one develops a different mind....By NOT WANTING TO FIGHT....because one can!

Sure like in real life...some will use it for the wrong reasons...hense so many martial art movies! good guys vs bad guys

Has something to do with "fight/flee"

Actully JUDO would be the better art to teach...lot more physcial and the intensity of workouts burns energy that needs to go somewhere!

Aloha, HUm?

 

[zeeberex]

Thunderdome: two convicts enter, one leaves.

Repeat till we have only one convict. Kind of fuzzy on what to do at that point.

fertilizer or dog food.