TIG, testing and contributions to the art.

[Kong Soo Do]

We have many types of TKD represented here on the board. By 'types' I mean different organizational representation as well as independent, sport-focused as well as SD-focused etc. I thought it may be interesting to get a picture of the similarites and differences among them.

1. In reference to TIG (time-in-grade), is there an average and/or minimum time to be eligible for testing for a first Dan?
2. Once first Dan has been reached, is there a minimum TIG in place to proceed to the second, and then the third etc?
3. Is a physical skills test required for each and every Dan grade? If not, at what rank does a physical test cease?
4. If a physical skills test isn't required for a certain grade (and up), does anything replace it other than TIG?
5. What are considered acceptable contributions to your art, if used as the basis of a promotion.

Thank you.

 

[andyjeffries]

We have many types of TKD represented here on the board. By 'types' I mean different organizational representation as well as independent, sport-focused as well as SD-focused etc. I thought it may be interesting to get a picture of the similarites and differences among them.

1. In reference to TIG (time-in-grade), is there an average and/or minimum time to be eligible for testing for a first Dan?
2. Once first Dan has been reached, is there a minimum TIG in place to proceed to the second, and then the third etc?
3. Is a physical skills test required for each and every Dan grade? If not, at what rank does a physical test cease?
4. If a physical skills test isn't required for a certain grade (and up), does anything replace it other than TIG?
5. What are considered acceptable contributions to your art, if used as the basis of a promotion.

Thank you.

1. As far as I know the Kukkiwon doesn't set one. I haven't seen anyone get to 1st Dan (or 1st Poom) shorter than 3 years and more normally 4-5, but we aren't a full time club. If someone was training daily, I'd have no issue with a shorter time.

2. Yes, basically the number of years for the grade you are 1st-to-2nd is 1 year, 2nd-to-3rd is 2 years.

3. Yes

4. N/A

5. I haven't reached a rank yet where this is considered (I'm a 5th Dan), so I don't know if it does become more important when you get to be a senior grade.

Cheers,


Andy

 

[Cyriacus]

We have many types of TKD represented here on the board. By 'types' I mean different organizational representation as well as independent, sport-focused as well as SD-focused etc. I thought it may be interesting to get a picture of the similarites and differences among them.

1. In reference to TIG (time-in-grade), is there an average and/or minimum time to be eligible for testing for a first Dan?
2. Once first Dan has been reached, is there a minimum TIG in place to proceed to the second, and then the third etc?
3. Is a physical skills test required for each and every Dan grade? If not, at what rank does a physical test cease?
4. If a physical skills test isn't required for a certain grade (and up), does anything replace it other than TIG?
5. What are considered acceptable contributions to your art, if used as the basis of a promotion.

Thank you.

Im enjoying Your recent inquisitiveness.

1: 1-4 Years. 1 Year is if You have prior experience in MA, and pick things up easier. 2-4 for everyone else. But, 1st Degree isnt very important. It isnt a Pinnacle, its a Precipice. 2nd Degree though? Thats a whole different story. Let alone 3rd.

2: No. But, any less than a Year has yet to ever happen, and even a Year isnt common. Ive only seen one instance.

3: No. Physical Skills are a part of Training. Youd literally have to be not Training to not have them. Youre Tested based on Your Application, not Your Fitness.

4: Yeah. Your Understanding and Ability to Apply.

5: I have no idea what Youre talking about

 

[Twin Fist]

1. In reference to TIG (time-in-grade), is there an average and/or minimum time to be eligible for testing for a first Dan?
2. Once first Dan has been reached, is there a minimum TIG in place to proceed to the second, and then the third etc?
3. Is a physical skills test required for each and every Dan grade? If not, at what rank does a physical test cease?
4. If a physical skills test isn't required for a certain grade (and up), does anything replace it other than TIG?
5. What are considered acceptable contributions to your art, if used as the basis of a promotion.

1) four years. at least
2) TIG is the same as the next rank. 2nd dan is 2 years, 3rd dan is 3 years etc
3) tests for 1st dan-5th
4) TIG isnt enough, you have to be teaching and/or competing, contributions to the arts
5) i would love to see this approach:

for 5th dan you would have to have your own school, and at least one student to BB
for 6th dan the above and 5 students to BB
for 7th dan the above and have a students you promoted to BB have a student promoted to bb under them, so two generations
for 8th 3 generations
for 9th 4 generations

 

[Kong Soo Do]

Im enjoying Your recent inquisitiveness.

Thank you. With the diverse menu that we have in the same art it seems like a good way to glean information.

5: I have no idea what Youre talking about

For example, to reach a higher Dan level one could develop a new form, develop an application to an existing form or drill, develop new drills or some sort of teaching method. Perhaps write an article or series of articles on the art or school. Perhaps write a book. Something that contributes to the art in some way. Something along those lines in addition to reaching the required TIG.

 

[Cyriacus]

Thank you. With the diverse menu that we have in the same art it seems like a good way to glean information.




For example, to reach a higher Dan level one could develop a new form, develop an application to an existing form or drill, develop new drills or some sort of teaching method. Perhaps write an article or series of articles on the art or school. Perhaps write a book. Something that contributes to the art in some way. Something along those lines in addition to reaching the required TIG.

No such thing is required.
You can, if You choose, come up with Your own Drill or Form. But thats Personal Choice. The Syllabus is set - Youre not building it, Youre learning it.

 

[dancingalone]

No such thing is required.
You can, if You choose, come up with Your own Drill or Form. But thats Personal Choice. The Syllabus is set - Youre not building it, Youre learning it.

Many martial arts require a master level student to create something new like a book or a thesis - something is supposed to ADD to the body of knowledge for everyone. Kind of like the old guild process with the 'masterpiece' or the master's thesis or doctoral dissertation process done with academic degrees.

 

[Cyriacus]

Many martial arts require a master level student to create something new like a book or a thesis - something is supposed to ADD to the body of knowledge for everyone. Kind of like the old guild process with the 'masterpiece' or the master's thesis or doctoral dissertation process done with academic degrees.

Aha - I understand that. And that kind of adding can do just as much damage if its taken on as it can do good. Besides - Im not here to create TKD. Im here to Learn it. I didnt join up to add to it, or subtract from it. Im sure others feel differently.

 

[SahBumNimRush]

In reference to TIG (time-in-grade), is there an average and/or minimum time to be eligible for testing for a first Dan?

• white to gold: 3 months
• gold to green: 3 months
• green to brown tip: 3 months
• brown tip to brown: 3 months
• brown to red tip: 3 months
• red tip to red: 3 months
• red to blue: 6 months
• blue to black: 1 year

If promoted everytime the student is eligible first dan can be earned in 3 years. Most of my students are closer to 4 years.

Once first Dan has been reached, is there a minimum TIG in place to proceed to the second, and then the third etc?

• 1st dan to 2nd dan: 2 years
• 2nd dan to 3rd dan: 3 years
• 3rd to 4th: 4 years
• 4th to 5th: 5 years
• 5th to 6th: 6 years
• 6th to 7th: 7 years
• 7th to 8th: 8 years

and so on.. .

Is a physical skills test required for each and every Dan grade? If not, at what rank does a physical test cease?

Outside of our KJN (9th dan), the highest ranking seniors in our association are two 7th dans. When the two seniors test for 7th, there was no physical test (they were in their 70's and late 60's and had significant physical limitations due to chronic degeneration and past injuries of the shoulders and hips). However all other ranks have had a physical component to their test. I imagine that due to my age, I will be expected to perform a physical test IF, I am asked to test for my 7th dan when my TIG is up, since I will only be 40 years old.

If a physical skills test isn't required for a certain grade (and up), does anything replace it other than TIG?

A thesis is required for every dan promotion. Contribution to the art/association is also a factor.

What are considered acceptable contributions to your art, if used as the basis of a promotion.

While, I'm not certain that there are hard set criteria for these contributions, I can share what the two 7th dans have done. The two seniors that tested for 7th dan have been practicing under our KJN for 40 years, and have been state head instructor and assistant head instructor for the majority of that time. They have served as tournament co-directors, state association board of directors, produced tens of thousands of students, hundreds of black belts and have opened 4 schools. They have been living examples of the tenants of Taekwondo. There is much more that I could go on to state about these two gentlemen, but these are things that come to mind readily.

 

[SahBumNimRush]

Aha - I understand that. And that kind of adding can do just as much damage if its taken on as it can do good. Besides - Im not here to create TKD. Im here to Learn it. I didnt join up to add to it, or subtract from it. Im sure others feel differently.

From DancingAlone's quote, I wouldn't necessarily say that the Master's Thesis would always "add to the art." It often times is a demonstration of knowledge of the art. Illustrating not only years of devoted practice, but the knowledge and wisdom that should be the result of such training. At least that has been my experience in my association. Similar to a Master's thesis for a M.S. or M.A. degree shows depth of knowledge. You may be "adding to the art," in some fashion since those who attend the test or read the thesis may gain a deeper knowledge of the art, but I wouldn't say that its really inventing something new. I would say it would be more accurately described as expanding the knowledge base.

 

[Archtkd]

We have many types of TKD represented here on the board. By 'types' I mean different organizational representation as well as independent, sport-focused as well as SD-focused etc. I thought it may be interesting to get a picture of the similarites and differences among them.

1. In reference to TIG (time-in-grade), is there an average and/or minimum time to be eligible for testing for a first Dan?
2. Once first Dan has been reached, is there a minimum TIG in place to proceed to the second, and then the third etc?
3. Is a physical skills test required for each and every Dan grade? If not, at what rank does a physical test cease?
4. If a physical skills test isn't required for a certain grade (and up), does anything replace it other than TIG?
5. What are considered acceptable contributions to your art, if used as the basis of a promotion.

Thank you.

What you do on the training floor and sometimes external kyorugi and poomsae competion is considered a more critical component in our dojang's grading process, than time in grade. 1st Dan/poom take about 2-3 years depending on how one trains, and we generaly train hard. We follow Kukkiwon rules for dan progression, when it comes to the time in grade and age consideration for promotion. There's a minimum one year time in grade to test for 2nd Dan from 1st, two years from 2nd Dan to 3rd, and so on and so forth. Physical testing should happen to 8th dan, but we don't have anyone close to that rank in our dojang. A 10-page thesis, in addition to the physical elements, is usually required for ranks 6th-8th. Teaching experience is not required for dan progression in our dojang, until 3rd dan. My own journey in taekwondo has taken much longer than usual. It took me about 7 years to get to 1st dan. I will be testing for 5th dan later this month, 19 years after I earned that 1st dan.

 

[dancingalone]

My own journey in taekwondo has taken much longer than usual. It took me about 7 years to get to 1st dan. I will be testing for 5th dan later this month, 19 years after I earned that 1st dan.

Good luck, not that you'll need it!

 

[SahBumNimRush]

My own journey in taekwondo has taken much longer than usual. It took me about 7 years to get to 1st dan. I will be testing for 5th dan later this month, 19 years after I earned that 1st dan.

Incidentally it took me nearly 7 years to earn my 1st dan as well (training constantly throughout). I earned my 5th dan in January 2008, 16 years after earning my 1st dan. I think training an dedication like this gives a person perspective. I will be eligible for testing for my 6th dan in January 2014, so I will begin physically pushing my training more intensely very soon to prepare myself for this test.

Good luck on your promotion examination!

 

[Archtkd]

Good luck, not that you'll need it!

Thanks a lot. Good luck is always hoped for. It's interesting I was looking back at where I was in terms of development, when I earned my first dan and now and the gap is huge. Lots of my hair is gone, though, and speed is slightly reduced. My footwork is much better than 19 years ago, which makes me a lot more accurate in defense and offense. I was 175 pounds in 1993 and weight about 182 now (after cutting almost 20 pounds over the last couple of years.) All in all I feel good, but I've still got tons of testing butterflies.

 

[Kong Soo Do]

My own journey in taekwondo has taken much longer than usual. It took me about 7 years to get to 1st dan. I will be testing for 5th dan later this month, 19 years after I earned that 1st dan.

My very best wishes for your upcoming test.

A thesis is required for every dan promotion. Contribution to the art/association is also a factor.


While, I'm not certain that there are hard set criteria for these contributions, I can share what the two 7th dans have done. The two seniors that tested for 7th dan have been practicing under our KJN for 40 years, and have been state head instructor and assistant head instructor for the majority of that time. They have served as tournament co-directors, state association board of directors, produced tens of thousands of students, hundreds of black belts and have opened 4 schools. They have been living examples of the tenants of Taekwondo. There is much more that I could go on to state about these two gentlemen, but these are things that come to mind readily.

Good examples. This also brought to mind hosting and conducting training/teaching seminars for the art. This would be a factor that would benefit the art.

 

[andyjeffries]

Incidentally it took me nearly 7 years to earn my 1st dan as well (training constantly throughout). I earned my 5th dan in January 2008, 16 years after earning my 1st dan.

Although we run the risk of derailing the thread, time in grade/to promotions is kinda relevant so I thought I'd add mine. I trained for 4 years to 1st Dan and got my 5th Dan in December 2010 20 years after my 1st Dan.

Good luck on your promotion examination!

I'd like to add my wishes of luck too!

 

[Archtkd]

Incidentally it took me nearly 7 years to earn my 1st dan as well (training constantly throughout). I earned my 5th dan in January 2008, 16 years after earning my 1st dan. I think training an dedication like this gives a person perspective. I will be eligible for testing for my 6th dan in January 2014, so I will begin physically pushing my training more intensely very soon to prepare myself for this test.

Good luck on your promotion examination!

Thanks. I'm glad to hear I'm not the only slow, but steady climber. And best of luck to you too as you prepare for the next level.

 

[Archtkd]

Although we run the risk of derailing the thread, time in grade/to promotions is kinda relevant so I thought I'd add mine. I trained for 4 years to 1st Dan and got my 5th Dan in December 2010 20 years after my 1st Dan.



I'd like to add my wishes of luck too!

Thanks mate. It's inspiring to learn you've kept at it for so long,

 

[Earl Weiss]

1. In reference to TIG (time-in-grade), is there an average and/or minimum time to be eligible for testing for a first Dan?
2. Once first Dan has been reached, is there a minimum TIG in place to proceed to the second, and then the third etc?
3. Is a physical skills test required for each and every Dan grade? If not, at what rank does a physical test cease?
4. If a physical skills test isn't required for a certain grade (and up), does anything replace it other than TIG?
5. What are considered acceptable contributions to your art, if used as the basis of a promotion.

Thank you.

First - TIG is not just time but active training time . Typicaly 8 classes a week minimum. There are also minimums per org. standards and average minimums which are typicaly longer.

1. First Dan. No time set. Typicaly 3 years for an adult. (Adult starting at age 16) .
2. For 2nd Dan minimum is 2 years, typicaly 3.
3. Third Dan - Minum 2 years. typicaly 3.
4th and above minimum is the # of years for the rank you are.
Physical test thru 7th for the USTF. ITF had a physical test thru 6th and now some ITFs thru 8th.
4&5 . For 7th and above must be actively teaching and training.

 

[andyjeffries]

Thanks mate. It's inspiring to learn you've kept at it for so long,

There are people on here who have been at it for much longer than you or I, maybe as much as both of us combined (if not, then close).