Real Self Defense

terryl965

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Last night at my school a gentleman came in and was talking to me about his program of the real deal S.D., now I am a person that tells people we teach practicular S.D. and stuff. At anyrate he went on to say that 98.5% of schools out there are like me teaching unrealistic S.D. to the general program and he could put in his Real Life S.D. and increase my sales by two fold. The problem is most of what he teaches is basic wrist breaks and joint manipulation as well as hit and get out type of defense, when I explain this is stuff we already do he got mad and said it is people like me that cannot see beyond my own two eyes that really hurts the MA of today.

Well thought I would share.
 

Haze

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I think most of us teach practical self defense but what I see that is not taught or experienced in many schools is the aspect of trying to apply these tactics against a non-compliant partner.

I find that this is the biggest factor most "RBSD" guys bring up when addressing what they refer to as traditional arts.
 

Drac

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Last night at my school a gentleman came in and was talking to me about his program of the real deal S.D., now I am a person that tells people we teach practicular S.D. and stuff. At anyrate he went on to say that 98.5% of schools out there are like me teaching unrealistic S.D. to the general program and he could put in his Real Life S.D. and increase my sales by two fold. The problem is most of what he teaches is basic wrist breaks and joint manipulation as well as hit and get out type of defense, when I explain this is stuff we already do he got mad and said it is people like me that cannot see beyond my own two eyes that really hurts the MA of today.

Well thought I would share.

Father Greek just had an experience with a gentleman that allegedly teaches REAL SELF DEFENSE....I will ask him to post...
 

exile

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Kinda pathetic, really.

There are only so many things you need to be able to do, technically, to have 'real self-defense' skills. The real trick is getting people to train in those to the point where they become immediately accessible in an attack situation. If you have the right combination of locking/controlling and striking tools available, there are very few RL attack initiations you won't have the technique sets to handle.... but can you apply them when push, literally, comes to shove? That's not something you need some huckster coming in to sell to you, if you're a school owner. There's now a lot of information available on 'high-intensity' street-realistic training methods, and someone like you, who's seen it all, doesn't need this guy's sales pitch... but they just don't get it, do they.
 

jks9199

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And let me guess, Terry....

He would have been happy to provide his program for you, in exchange for a certain amount of cash. Maybe it'd be via a "certification course" or licensing fees for teaching his program at your school...

Didn't you realize that you were hurting martial arts because you cut into his bottom line? :D
 

just2kicku

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Wow, the arrogance of some people never cease to amaze me. To walk in someone elses house and do something like that either takes a set of balls or just plain stupidity.

I think that as long as a school teaches basics, then you're teaching practical SD. Cause when it comes down to it, most will always go back to basics.
 

kidswarrior

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Last night at my school a gentleman came in and was talking to me about his program of the real deal S.D., now I am a person that tells people we teach practicular S.D. and stuff. At anyrate he went on to say that 98.5% of schools out there are like me teaching unrealistic S.D. to the general program and he could put in his Real Life S.D. and increase my sales by two fold. The problem is most of what he teaches is basic wrist breaks and joint manipulation as well as hit and get out type of defense, when I explain this is stuff we already do he got mad and said it is people like me that cannot see beyond my own two eyes that really hurts the MA of today.
So if you say 'No thanks' to the product he's selling, he gets mad and insulting? Not a very good salesman. The snake oil hustlers give the MAs a far worse black eye than any honest instructor/club owner. :mad:

BTW, where'd this rocket scientist come up with the precise number 98.5? Pretty specific. I'd like to see his research. :uhyeah:
 

MJS

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Last night at my school a gentleman came in and was talking to me about his program of the real deal S.D., now I am a person that tells people we teach practicular S.D. and stuff. At anyrate he went on to say that 98.5% of schools out there are like me teaching unrealistic S.D. to the general program and he could put in his Real Life S.D. and increase my sales by two fold. The problem is most of what he teaches is basic wrist breaks and joint manipulation as well as hit and get out type of defense, when I explain this is stuff we already do he got mad and said it is people like me that cannot see beyond my own two eyes that really hurts the MA of today.

Well thought I would share.

This sounds like someone who thinks that they have the market cornered on SD. Gotta love those people, and we've seen some right here on MT, who claim to have the new and improved, etc.

Now, IMHO, I don't think that the RBSD guys of today, ie: Peyton Quinn, Sammy Franco, Geoff Thompson, etc. are bad guys, and IMO, they have alot to offer and bring up alot of good points. I think alot of the times, when we hear claims of this or that is better, its not so much that its anything new per se, but how its applied.

Every art out there has locks, kicks, punches, etc., but some may go about applying the principles differently. I'm guessing that this guy is probably stereotyping TKD. He saw one TKD school and assumed that all TKD is the same. IMO, its not the art, but the person. :)
 

astrobiologist

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It was not honorable of this man to insult you in your school. He was in the wrong. Regardless of what he thinks, it sounds like the way he went about it was disrespectful.

My hat's off to you for keeping your cool.
 

Aiki Lee

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I have seen ome pretty ineffectual SD practices (one relied soley on pinching people), but 98.5% seems a little high for me. I'd say more like 30% and that's a vague meaningless guess.
 

exile

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I have seen ome pretty ineffectual SD practices (one relied soley on pinching people), but 98.5% seems a little high for me. I'd say more like 30% and that's a vague meaningless guess.

Didn't one of our membersKreth?have a custom tag line to the effect that "87.5% of all statistics are made up on the spur of the moment"? :D It's hysterical that the guy is implying that he's actually sat in on enough different MA school classes and surveyed them carefully enough to have a supposedly robust number like that to stick in people's faces. Guy sounds truly, uh, dedicated.... :rolleyes:
 

BLACK LION

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If he really had some worthwhile expertise and tools, he would not be going door to door imposing anyhting. He would forge his own training in his own sector. Sounds like a bum to me... one of those kinds that jumps on your car while spraying and whiping it down then demands for some change or some compensation when they were not asked or promted to begin with.
 
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I think most of us teach practical self defense but what I see that is not taught or experienced in many schools is the aspect of trying to apply these tactics against a non-compliant partner.

I find that this is the biggest factor most "RBSD" guys bring up when addressing what they refer to as traditional arts.

That pretty much hits the nail on the coffin. Sports MA guys and RBSD guys often use that as validification that TMA schools don't teach effective SD. And to be honest, I have seen a number of schools (in some styles more than others), where the SD is composed of one and two step "sparrig" and the attacker falls over with the minimum of effort. In the case of the OP's encounter however, I'm thinking that the "door-to-door" tactics of the so called SD instructor seem rather bogus.
 
OP
terryl965

terryl965

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And let me guess, Terry....

He would have been happy to provide his program for you, in exchange for a certain amount of cash. Maybe it'd be via a "certification course" or licensing fees for teaching his program at your school...

Didn't you realize that you were hurting martial arts because you cut into his bottom line? :D


We never did to that point.
 

Brian R. VanCise

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Wow, some people.
icon13.gif
 

Joab

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Last night at my school a gentleman came in and was talking to me about his program of the real deal S.D.,
Joab: Implying you don't teach real S.D.? Rude!

now I am a person that tells people we teach practicular S.D. and stuff. At anyrate he went on to say that 98.5% of schools out there are like me teaching unrealistic S.D. to the general program and he could put in his Real Life S.D. and increase my sales by two fold.
Joab:Out and out insults your school saying it doesn't teach realistic S.D.! You were patient with him!

The problem is most of what he teaches is basic wrist breaks and joint manipulation as well as hit and get out type of defense, when I explain this is stuff we already do he got mad and said it is people like me that cannot see beyond my own two eyes that really hurts the MA of today.

Joab: This guy was incredibly rude to you, I'm glad you had the patience not to kick his butt and physically toss him out of your school! Sorry you had to put up with this guy. I took classes from a well known RBSD person who will remain nameless for now, he didn't think much of traditional, classical systems, although he spent many a year gaining many a blackbelt in many of them before creating his own system. But the man would never walk into another school and act this rudely! Sorry you had to go through this.

Well thought I would share.

Thanks for sharing, sorry you had to put up with this jerk.
 

Deaf Smith

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Last night at my school a gentleman came in and was talking to me about his program of the real deal S.D., now I am a person that tells people we teach practicular S.D. and stuff. At anyrate he went on to say that 98.5% of schools out there are like me teaching unrealistic S.D. to the general program and he could put in his Real Life S.D. and increase my sales by two fold. The problem is most of what he teaches is basic wrist breaks and joint manipulation as well as hit and get out type of defense, when I explain this is stuff we already do he got mad and said it is people like me that cannot see beyond my own two eyes that really hurts the MA of today.

Well thought I would share.

Terry, it may have just to do with the economy. They need income and well they feel you are in the way of that when you reject their idea of adding their 'system' to yours.

As the economy gets worse, exepect more dog-eat-dog thinking.

Deaf
 

Guardian

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I'm sure for $29.95, he can make your program a real self-defense program they all can and he'll thrown in a 2nd real self-defense program for free at that price.

I love those type of folks.
 
OP
terryl965

terryl965

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Terry, it may have just to do with the economy. They need income and well they feel you are in the way of that when you reject their idea of adding their 'system' to yours.

As the economy gets worse, exepect more dog-eat-dog thinking.

Deaf

You know Deaf you are probaly right
 

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