MMA vs Kung Fu Day 2 - The war room

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JowGaWolf

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MMA guy couldn't make the sparring for tonight due to an injury to his arm. Even though his arm was injured, he still went to lift weights. Sooooo. He's either young enough to heal fast or It will be a week or 2 before I'll be able to spar with him again. All I have to do at this point is to keep training and not injure myself while training.
 

Alan0354

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MMA guy couldn't make the sparring for tonight due to an injury to his arm. Even though his arm was injured, he still went to lift weights. Sooooo. He's either young enough to heal fast or It will be a week or 2 before I'll be able to spar with him again. All I have to do at this point is to keep training and not injure myself while training.
My experience in injury is I don't stop, but just do the same exercise with very light weight or even no weights just to go through the motion. That's just for me, I am NOT telling anyone to do the same.

Like after I hurt my back, I never took a day off, instead doing everything in slow motion, very light. Actually doing slow motion punching and kicking lessen the pain, believe it or not!!! Particular walking in deep horse stance. But again, that's just me. Been doing like this for over 30 years.

But, that's off the subject, I'm leaving now!!!
 

Kung Fu Wang

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I hope I'll have a new single leg defense after tonight. Or at least one in the making.
The 1st single leg couter that I have learned was:

- You have right leg forward.
- Your opponent uses both hands to hold on your right leading leg.
- You use right over hook under his left shoulder.
- You use left stealing step and use your right leg to lift (or spring) his left leg and throw him forward.

I don't have video for this. I like this counter. You can borrow your opponent's forward momentum. Your opponent wants to move forward. You help him to move forward more than he wants to.

Again, I still think you should spend time to train single leg instead of to train the counter for single leg. In Shuai Chiao, a teacher won't teach the counter to a throw until the student can execute the throw first.
 
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JowGaWolf

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My experience in injury is I don't stop, but just do the same exercise with very light weight or even no weights just to go through the motion. That's just for me, I am NOT telling anyone to do the same.

Like after I hurt my back, I never took a day off, instead doing everything in slow motion, very light. Actually doing slow motion punching and kicking lessen the pain, believe it or not!!! Particular walking in deep horse stance. But again, that's just me. Been doing like this for over 30 years.

But, that's off the subject, I'm leaving now!!!
We'll get to see how long it takes to heal properly. I'll probably start to move into my twice a day workout schedule tomorrow morning. That means I have to wake up at 5 am to go train. I got mixed feelings about that.
 
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JowGaWolf

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The 1st single leg couter that I have learned was:

- You have right leg forward.
- Your opponent uses both hands to hold on your right leading leg.
- You use right over hook under his left shoulder.
- You use left stealing step and use your right leg to lift (or spring) his left leg and throw him forward.

I don't have video for this. I like this counter. You can borrow your opponent's forward momentum. Your opponent wants to move forward. You help him to move forward more than he wants to.
I was hoping you had video of it. I'll have to work it out in my mind what it might look like.
 

Alan0354

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We'll get to see how long it takes to heal properly. I'll probably start to move into my twice a day workout schedule tomorrow morning. That means I have to wake up at 5 am to go train. I got mixed feelings about that.
Ha ha, I barely went to bed!!! I am living on Hawaii time!!!
 

Kung Fu Wang

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MMA guy couldn't make the sparring for tonight due to an injury to his arm.
Either you guys may train too hard, or I don't train hard enough. I have not had any injury from training for many years.

My teacher always told me that one should know how to train, but one should also know how to maintain and protect.
 

Alan0354

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Either you guys may train too hard, or I don't train hard enough. I have not had any injury from training for many years.

My teacher always told me that one should know how to train, but one should also know how to maintain and protect.
Sports and injuries goes hand in hand. If you don't have any injuries, only thing I can think of is you are not working hard enough. Which is perfectly ok.

I can't even think of a period of time I don't have any pain in the last 30+ years. The key is how to deal with injuries.
 

Monkey Turned Wolf

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Sports and injuries goes hand in hand. If you don't have any injuries, only thing I can think of is you are not working hard enough. Which is perfectly ok.

I can't even think of a period of time I don't have any pain in the last 30+ years. The key is how to deal with injuries.
There's also different definitions of injuries. If you get a welt on your arm from stick sparring, some might consider that an injury. Others would think it's par for the course and forget it happened in a week.
 

Wing Woo Gar

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What flaws do you most often see when people are practicing this defense? It seems a little complicated. I guess I want to see it used in full speed. I worry about my knee when practicing this with less skilled opponents. Nothing scares me more than doing single legs with white belts. I have seen that go bad twice. Year ending events for both victims. Surgery was needed for both. I am truly a novice grappler.
 

Alan0354

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There's also different definitions of injuries. If you get a welt on your arm from stick sparring, some might consider that an injury. Others would think it's par for the course and forget it happened in a week.
Oh, I am talking about real injuries like back, shoulder, knee etc. Those you talked about are not injuries in my book, just rest or ignore it.
 

Alan0354

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You should not get back, shoulder, knee injuries in the first place.
Like I said, sports and injuries goes hand in hand, I am not the only one. If you never get injured, I question how hard you are practicing.
 
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JowGaWolf

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Either you guys may train too hard, or I don't train hard enough. I have not had any injury from training for many years.

My teacher always told me that one should know how to train, but one should also know how to maintain and protect.
Injuries in training are normal if you are pushing your limits. If you are staying within a comfort zone then yes, you won't get many injuries if any. It's not a one size fits all where all exercises won't yield any injuries. If you play tennis then there will be injury, if you run competitively then there will injury. It's only natural for the body to break down in structure as endurance reaches it's limits. Even if I can continue with the exercise with no problem cardio wise, my body may not be able to take what I can give.

There is a reason why CMA and medicine follow hand and hand. If you spar at a high enough intensity then there will be injury eventually. Sometimes injuries are just part of the cost. Example, golfers with knee and back issues. Tennis players with elbow and wrist issues. Runners with knee and hip issues. Football and concussions.

Healing injuries is part of the "maintain and protect." Fixing an injury is maintenance which often involves the protecting rehab the injured body part. If you are overweight then back, knee, and hip injuries is going to be a big issue. I'm currently over weight and on the path of losing the weight. I should see a reduction in injuries as I lose the weight.
 
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Alan0354

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Injuries in training or normal if you are pushing your limits. If you are staying within a comfort zone then yes, you won't get many injuries if any. It's not a one size fits all where all exercises won't yield any injuries. If you play tennis then there will be injury, if you run competitively then there will injury. It's only natural for the body to break down in structure as endurance reaches it's limits. Even if I can continue with the exercise with no problem cardio wise, my body may not be able to take what I can give.

There is a reason why CMA and medicine follow hand and hand. If you spar at a high enough intensity then there will be injury eventually. Sometimes injuries are just part of the cost. Example, golfers with knee and back issues. Tennis players with elbow and wrist issues. Runners with knee and hip issues. Football and concussions.

Healing injuries is part of the "maintain and protect." Fixing an injury is maintenance which often involves the protecting rehab the injured body part. If you are overweight then back, knee, and hip injuries is going to be a big issue. I'm currently over weight and on the path of losing the weight. I should see a reduction in injuries as I lose the weight.
That's life. As one get older, it's even easier to get injured. Of cause, if you just do slow walk, you might............................HOLD ON..............Don't tell my wife about that!!! She had to replace both hips from walking!!!! She walk fast, but still!!! BOTH HIPS. When they open her up, they were both bone on bone.
 
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JowGaWolf

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That's life. As one get older, it's even easier to get injured. Of cause, if you just do slow walk, you might............................HOLD ON..............Don't tell my wife about that!!! She had to replace both hips from walking!!!! She walk fast, but still!!! BOTH HIPS. When they open her up, they were both bone on bone.
Your wife is the exception. There will always be an exception.
 

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Oh, I am talking about real injuries like back, shoulder, knee etc. Those you talked about are not injuries in my book, just rest or ignore it.
Cool. Just making sure we are all on the same page.

That said, ignoring small injuries is often what results in large injuries. If you're training safely and take the rest you should with the small ones, barring unfortunate accidents that results in acute injuries, you shouldn't be getting those 'real' injuries.
 

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It's almost time for another round of sparring for me. I think I'm all healed up or at least I think I will by this coming Monday (hopefully). I have another round of high stance sparring to get through, this part of the training sucks, because I already know what the outcome will be. The first day of sparring pretty much summed up everything I've talked about narrow stances, the risks, and dangers of using a high stance. With all of that said I'm still going to give it my best shot to figure out some exceptions to what I currently know about using a high stance.

I've been thinking to ask him if I can record the next session. It seems like I'm throwing a way a good opportunity for other Kung Fu practitioners to have some video footage that may help them with some of their own theories. If you guys don't have anyone to take you down then at least you can see me hit the mat (every time), at least until I start lowering my stance. So what are my plans for the next round of punishment?

Here's what I'm thinking:
1. Footwork speed and big angles (larger than 45 degree angles.
2. In and outs - pop in and get out.
3. Jumping - My theory about jumping is that it will force me not to stand up too tall as my legs will need to be in a position to be able to jump. In kung fu there is a technique where the practitioner jumps away from the attacker. I'll give this a try if it's feasible to do it from a high stance. There's a small jump / stomp in kung fu that has always seem out of place in sparring and my theory is that it might be used for grappling to prevent the leg from being picked up. There's only one way to find out lol.

After this I'm done with anything high stance + grappling. It's just a bad idea all around. I've seen it play out the same way every time no matter the sport. Physics and Biology just works against me then add the strength of my opponent. It's like I'm making things more difficult for me, which is something you just really don't want to do in competition or in a fight.

Well that's my plan for round 2. I'll try to record it if the MMA guy is cool with that. Maybe he'll have some thoughts of his own about it.
Keep in mind, the problem with using your Kung Fu against MMA is that you have to restrain your strikes, as where the MMA does not have much to restrain.
 
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JowGaWolf

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Keep in mind, the problem with using your Kung Fu against MMA is that you have to restrain your strikes, as where the MMA does not have much to restrain.
Yeah the grappling is definitely less restrained throws too to an extent. But I'm fine with it so long as I'm not getting my joints busted up. There are some younger guys that spar really hard. I stay away from them. One of them didn't have a mouth guard and was getting his chin rocked. The MMA guy didn't want to get any of that action. He cares more about quality training and longevity so his body isn't broken after weeks of sparring.
 

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