It looks like those guys are practicing it, too.That's one hell of an interpretation considering that he pulled all of that from this;
All of that from that simple movement? Yeah, okay.....
Protip: Learn proper head clinching from a style like Muay Thai where they actually practice it.
That vid perfectly illustrates the problem of bunkai; No one is ever going to attack you in that fashion to allow you to perform those types of counters.
Just because it's a seminar, and because the kata is being interpreted differently than you were taught, that doesn't change the fact that those folks at the seminar are, in fact, practicing a head clinch. Arts evolve (or should).Nah, that's a seminar.
I did that kata numerous times. No one ever even hinted at any of that being a head clinch.
Just because it's a seminar, and because the kata is being interpreted differently than you were taught, that doesn't change the fact that those folks at the seminar are, in fact, practicing a head clinch. Arts evolve (or should).
I thought bunkai was all about application? Are you guys now saying kata is like stretching?
Why have a library of fighting movements that aren't meant to be applied in a fight?
I was under the impression that forms and kata are used synonymously. I'm pretty sure that many here use them that way. Thanks for clearing this up.I said forms same as stretching in relations to fighting.
Meaning it has another purpose that is of benefit, it is not fighting.
Never did I say kata or bunkai. I leave that discussion to others.
I was under the impression that forms and kata are used synonymously. I'm pretty sure that many here use them that way. Thanks for clearing this up.
So, just to make sure. You're saying forms are not kata, but are more like stretching in that they have an indirect benefit tmfighting skill.
He may be adding to what was originally intended, but that's not the same as making it up. If he finds a movement they already rehearse (in a form) and uses that to teach something that should be in their training but isn't, that's probably a good intro to it. As I said, arts should evolve, and this would be a good evolutionary step for Karate.Seminars are in place to build upon fundamentals, or to teach fundamentals themselves. Something as complex as the head clinch isn't something you should be introducing at a seminar. This is especially true if the movement you're pulling it from (kata) is a dubious source to begin with.
Further, I don't remember ever drilling head clinches in my old Shotokan classes, nor ever fighting a karateka that used them. The main strikers in my experience who utilize head clinches are Muay Thai kickboxers, and they have an entire sub-system built around that position.
With all due respect, Mr. Abernathy's "bunkai" has always struck me as something he just makes up as he goes along.
I remember talking with another martial artist about how they used forms (it was a hybrid art drawing on Indonesian and Filipino roots). He demonstrated part of a form for me that was just a series of steps (literally, no hand movements), and it looked pretty goofy. Then he showed me a couple of applications to their techniques, and showed me where the sequences of footwork (including one that knelt halfway through and another that rose from kneeling) showed up in the form. They used it just like you're talking about.I never said it was not applied. Just like writing down alphabet does not mean it will resemble words. It will only show you the letters you may use and in terms of forms there is also concepts and theories that apply to them to create thought.
None of it intended to be application and in my view not something that is of large focus during training. Still important to understand movements correctly.
Waste of time? Ask me in 40 years if I can show all things in this system. If I still remember all forms then I can show you. It takes you years of study to grasp what I show but that is not my problem unless I wish to teach you.
The videos don't support his argument. If you look at what is being done and ask "can I make the same movement in a fight?" then it actually shows the validity of the bunkai and forms.You're kind of supporting all of Hanzou's points. (They'll be no living with him.)