...Yeah screw boxing. (I give up. I just realized how little I know. Long read.)

[KOKarate]

Because squat strength is the meaning of masculinity. It's an expression of how powerful my inner spirit is.

I mean dude, if you transfer my psyche into the times of Ancient Greece in Sparta, I would of course devote my life into surviving the rigors of whatever they wanna throw at me with their military training program. But right now, I have the relative luxury to CHOOSE what to invest in. And deep inside of my heart, in ways I can't explain, I think the purest expression of human strength, the purest expression of greatness without silly things like money and fame, is your relative squatting strength. I say RELATIVE because it's not the absolute squatting strength you have. It's how much you can squat in relation to your age and how long you've been training. If you were born to be able to squat 1,000 pounds with zero training, I'd have zero respect for you compared to a naturally weak man who took his squat from 200 to 400 with hard work.

I do it to gain confidence for myself. And nothing, and I mean nothing, gives me more self-worth and self-confidence than being stronger than everyone else and knowing I can defeat them all in a fair fight with my bare hands, boxing or wrestling.

This is why I loathe the idea of being a strictly skilled martial artist. I want to be the kind of fighter with a balance of a lack of finesse but make up for it with ridiculous strength and athleticism and specific endurance.

Heavy squatting builds foundational strength. Everything else is secondary after raising your squat numbers. Everything else is just icing on the cake.

I admire Napoleon Bonaparte a lot, but people don't understand why. So I'll give you something a bit more relatable... For me, the greatest man outside of the French Emperor to have ever walked the earth is Paul Anderson. There are a few more great men out there, but Paul is something special to me. I'd let you do your own search of him as I won't do him justice with this post. But basically, on top of having strong moral values and being a brother in Christ, the dude was the strongest squatter in the history of lifting. I don't care if a boxer or wrestler can beat him. To me, in a strength-to-strength battle, he'll always come out a champion. If Napoleon is my hero on matters of intellect, Paul Anderson is my hero on matters of being a one-man army.

And I absolutely despise skinny and weak UFC fighters who have the arrogance to call themselves athletes when they can't lift a twig. I despise the Diaz brothers and Floyd Mayweather for the kind of style they represent. Really, in their respective sports, I absolutely despise them. I wanna be the antithesis to those abominations.

lol those skinny ufc fighters would knock you around throw you on the floor and either choke you out break your arm or just beat the hell out of you. The diss brothers success comes from the fact they have outstanding cardio (the thing you DREAD) and can push the pace. And if you do start judo you’ll see that you’ll get easily tossed around by smaller people. Maybe then you’ll drop this ego nonsense of yours. Go watch the early UFC’s

 

[jobo]

Because squat strength is the meaning of masculinity. It's an expression of how powerful my inner spirit is.

I mean dude, if you transfer my psyche into the times of Ancient Greece in Sparta, I would of course devote my life into surviving the rigors of whatever they wanna throw at me with their military training program. But right now, I have the relative luxury to CHOOSE what to invest in. And deep inside of my heart, in ways I can't explain, I think the purest expression of human strength, the purest expression of greatness without silly things like money and fame, is your relative squatting strength. I say RELATIVE because it's not the absolute squatting strength you have. It's how much you can squat in relation to your age and how long you've been training. If you were born to be able to squat 1,000 pounds with zero training, I'd have zero respect for you compared to a naturally weak man who took his squat from 200 to 400 with hard work.

I do it to gain confidence for myself. And nothing, and I mean nothing, gives me more self-worth and self-confidence than being stronger than everyone else and knowing I can defeat them all in a fair fight with my bare hands, boxing or wrestling.

This is why I loathe the idea of being a strictly skilled martial artist. I want to be the kind of fighter with a balance of a lack of finesse but make up for it with ridiculous strength and athleticism and specific endurance.

Heavy squatting builds foundational strength. Everything else is secondary after raising your squat numbers. Everything else is just icing on the cake.

I admire Napoleon Bonaparte a lot, but people don't understand why. So I'll give you something a bit more relatable... For me, the greatest man outside of the French Emperor to have ever walked the earth is Paul Anderson. There are a few more great men out there, but Paul is something special to me. I'd let you do your own search of him as I won't do him justice with this post. But basically, on top of having strong moral values and being a brother in Christ, the dude was the strongest squatter in the history of lifting. I don't care if a boxer or wrestler can beat him. To me, in a strength-to-strength battle, he'll always come out a champion. If Napoleon is my hero on matters of intellect, Paul Anderson is my hero on matters of being a one-man army.

And I absolutely despise skinny and weak UFC fighters who have the arrogance to call themselves athletes when they can't lift a twig. I despise the Diaz brothers and Floyd Mayweather for the kind of style they represent. Really, in their respective sports, I absolutely despise them. I wanna be the antithesis to those abominations.

no mate, strengh is nice to have and it can change your mental out look for the better to know that your considerably stronger than those around you, i get that

but squatting is not the greatest expression of human physical achievement , it really isnt, gymnastics possibly is, strength, balance co ordination, control of your full body

what your doing is picking the thing your good at and promoting that in importance coz your good at it !, lots of people do it, its the line of least resistance

your still a young man, to old to turn pro at most things but plenty young enough to pick your sport and become more than competant at it and choose your body shape, to a large degree

im not sure your hatred for skinny athletes isnt tied to the fact your far from skinny and wished you were, so HATE

i see it a lot with people, not just with weight issues but all sorts of attributes THEY dont have.

really stick to weight lifting if thats what makes you happy, its a perfectly good sport

if you want to do another sports , any really your going to have to sort your cardio out, and probably your weight, cardio gets easier as your weight goes down for a start, but then if you start doing cardio your weight will go down, its win , win

you dont have to run in the short term ( or possibly ever), you can do cardio with weights, you just need to keep going with a lighter weight for a few mins, till your heart is beating like a drum, you can do it lying down if you want

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Wrestling matches are not a marathon 12-rounder.

You might be surprised the first time you do prolonged grappling.

 

[dvcochran]

Wrestling matches are not a marathon 12-rounder.

Wait till your first grappling match/spar. It shocked me at how out of breath 3 minutes made me, that first time. Took more out of me doing 1 3-minute BJJ round than 6 3-minute kickboxing rounds. I don't think there's any way to explain it until you actually experience it.

MTW summaries this entire thread right here.

Bee Brian, since you seem to be framing this in 'how long can I go lights out' what is your current time? Is heavy contact competition your goal, regardless of style type (boxing vs. grappling for example)? If so I suggest you look at alternative conditioning relative to your size build. This is something that is Very different for a minimumweight boxer to a heavyweight boxer. I am more familiar with this in the Olympic TKD spectrum but I do know it translates. You do not see many heavyweight fighters going for 10 miles runs every day. There are much smarter ways to get the equivalent gains without being hell on the heavier body.
To summarize and include my opinion on the brief amount of information I have. You have trained with specificity. Not a bad thing. Now you are trying to switch gears maybe in fast forward and, since you are seasoned in on skill (strength) you think you should easily be able to jump over to another skill (cardio/endurance). It works but only in measured amounts thus the gains will still be slower than you are used to. I have had professional marathon runners unable to finish TKD classes so I know first hand this is a real dynamic.
Just to help you see boxing from a different perspective; since it sounds to me that boxing is kicking your axx it may be just the workout you need to focus on. Time and balance is your ally here. Maybe you just need to take smaller doses of boxing early on. I don't think it matters what the 'other' style is, it you leave the gym after a grueling weight workout and go to (insert name here) class it is going to be tough(er).

 

[lklawson]

Don't fall for it.

 

[jobo]

no mate, strengh is nice to have and it can change your mental out look for the better to know that your considerably stronger than those around you, i get that

but squatting is not the greatest expression of human physical achievement , it really isnt, gymnastics possibly is, strength, balance co ordination, control of your full body

what your doing is picking the thing your good at and promoting that in importance coz your good at it !, lots of people do it, its the line of least resistance

your still a young man, to old to turn pro at most things but plenty young enough to pick your sport and become more than competant at it and choose your body shape, to a large degree

im not sure your hatred for skinny athletes isnt tied to the fact your far from skinny and wished you were, so HATE

i see it a lot with people, not just with weight issues but all sorts of attributes THEY dont have.

really stick to weight lifting if thats what makes you happy, its a perfectly good sport

if you want to do another sports , any really your going to have to sort your cardio out, and probably your weight, cardio gets easier as your weight goes down for a start, but then if you start doing cardio your weight will go down, its win , win

you dont have to run in the short term ( or possibly ever), you can do cardio with weights, you just need to keep going with a lighter weight for a few mins, till your heart is beating like a drum, you can do it lying down if you want

the other thing to bare in mind with cardio. is you can do something useful with it.

house work gardening decorating can all be cardio if you do them at a brisk pace.

that way you can get your cardio and inpress your mother by doing the garden. provided she trusts you with sharp objects that is

 

[KOKarate]

End of the day if you do go to a boxing gym yeah you’ll suck...You’ll be gassed out quick and you’ll look horrible throwing punches but guess what so does every single person in the gym the first time they train. You don’t need to become a heavyweight champion or even fight just enjoy it and have fun if it’s what you want to do. If you’re always the worst guy in the room then so what? If you enjoy it then who cares about your skill level. It’s not all about winning or showing you’re the best it’s just about having fun. So yeah your cardio may suck....then pace yourself don’t go full out. That’s something you’ll learn to do as you go on. As the old saying goes “leave your ego at the door” fact is you’re a weightlifter that’s great, you’re passionate about that so that’s great no problem with it. But weight lifting and boxing they’re apples and oranges. They’re completely different and require different skill sets. I know I couldn’t enter a body building contest just with my martial arts and you can’t win a boxing match with just your weight lifting. End of the day any martial art needs cardio...it’s a huge part of any of it and if you’re not willing to put that work in then maybe it’s not for you. I don’t mean that in a negative way. Martial arts isn’t for everyone There’s no shame in admitting that there’s plenty of sports I’m absolutely awful at in fact most sports apart from martial arts and running I suck at. We all have our thing we enjoy and the things we don’t.

 

[JowGaWolf]

I'm gonna go ahead and hop onto a grappling art. I'm Philipino but I also have a Japanese heritage on my father side, so Judo should be appropriate.

Didn't think heritage would matter unless someone in your family was teaching you with their own customize system for Judo.

I can't handle the cardio... I just... I just can't. I really, just, CAN'T.

ha ha ha.. Well good luck with any grappling system. They get lots of cardio too. Grappling gasses people out faster than punching, and most people without cardio can only take about 30 seconds of full on punching. Like you can almost time when someone is going to give out with punching. Full on wrestling is about the same too. I'm willing to say that people with cardio normally gases out at 20 seconds.

Here's an example. Try to pause the video when you see one of them gas out.

My personal thoughts is that you won't be able to get a way with not doing cardio. Not unless you plan on winning within the first 10 seconds or if you plan on not having fighting contact for more than 3 seconds.

I think it's a good idea to quit now before I get my butt handed to me by a woman.

You are a beginner, so this will most likely happen if you go against a woman with experience. Then again when you get married, that will happen on almost a daily basis until you learn not to say anything lol.

that brute strength has a direct carryover to wrestling and judo.

Actually wrestling and uses a lot of technique which is why smaller people can beat larger people in wrestling and Judo. The only way your brute strength will be of value is if it is used with technique.

s long as I know I'm stronger than the other dude and can beat his butt in a fair fight, I'm satisfied.

Get over this ego and fear. There are plenty of guys out there that are stronger than you. The best fighters are the smart fighters. I like fighting people like you because they go in thinking that it's all about strength. They think they are just going to pound away at me, or grab me. You would be but a puppet against a lot of the old head in MT. The more you keep trying to brute force fighting the less successful you'll be at it and the more difficult it will be to win. If muscle was all that was needed to be good in fighting, then many of us would be built like mountain.

Forgive me for my previous behavior.

This is the best thing I've heard from you since day one of reading your post. It take a big person to apologize and admit when they were wrong or acted in a counter productive way. Don't change that about yourself. Just try to listen more. Hear people out. Listen to how people counter each other's advice at times. This will give you a lot of knowledge that you can uses to help you reach your goals.

 

[JowGaWolf]

Wait till your first grappling match/spar. It shocked me at how out of breath 3 minutes made me, that first time. Took more out of me doing 1 3-minute BJJ round than 6 3-minute kickboxing rounds. I don't think there's any way to explain it until you actually experience it.

lol. I can explained it. Drained cardio and muscle wise. Heart tired, arms tired, hands tired lol. The funny part is that training usually requires that we train for longer than what we expect to use. Want to run 100 yard dash then sprint 200 yards. Want to fight for a minute with out getting tired then, train to fight for 2 minutes. Want to wrestle for 1 minute then learn to wrestle for 4 minutes lol.

 

[JowGaWolf]

Because squat strength is the meaning of masculinity. It's an expression of how powerful my inner spirit is.

Maybe it's a generation thing.
For me masculinity was based on how a guy carries himself as a person. Very little of it had anything to do with strength. There's some other stuff that goes with it, but that stuff isn't worth mentioning, because it doesn't have anything to do with strength either.

For me inner spirit was always about what person was willing to go through, or push through in order to accomplish a goal. It was always about not quitting and giving it your best. See things through even when you have doubts.

 

[KOKarate]

Maybe it's a generation thing.
For me masculinity was based on how a guy carries himself as a person. Very little of it had anything to do with strength. There's some other stuff that goes with it, but that stuff isn't worth mentioning, because it doesn't have anything to do with strength either.

For me inner spirit was always about what person was willing to go through, or push through in order to accomplish a goal. It was always about not quitting and giving it your best. See things through even when you have doubts.

Yeah in my experience the only time where what weights you can lift or how much muscle you have mattered to anyone....it was in high school....after high school no one cares about unimportant stuff like that. It’s a hobby for you to care about but no one else does. That’s not even in a mean way but I’m a 4th dan black belt if I ever get a 5th dan I’m sure my friends will say well done but it’s not going to impress them and make them think more of me because simply they don’t care that much. This type of stuff really doesn’t impress others as much as people think it does

 

[jobo]

Yeah in my experience the only time where what weights you can lift or how much muscle you have mattered to anyone....it was in high school....after high school no one cares about unimportant stuff like that. It’s a hobby for you to care about but no one else does. That’s not even in a mean way but I’m a 4th dan black belt if I ever get a 5th dan I’m sure my friends will say well done but it’s not going to impress them and make them think more of me because simply they don’t care that much. This type of stuff really doesn’t impress others as much as people think it does

people who want your helping pushing a car or moving a wardrobe care

being strong can be of use in all sorts of ways, karate, less so

 

[JowGaWolf]

people who want your helping pushing a car or moving a wardrobe care

being strong can be of use in all sorts of ways, karate, less so

I can't remember when I had to push a car or when someone asked me to.

The last time I moved I didn't check out the movers to see if they were strong, It didn't matter how they moved the stuff so long as they could move it without breaking it.

Most people people use technique to move heavy stuff. I've done this without the straps and it's heavy and it was never as easy as what I'm seeing here. They had a choice to move it without the straps, but you hear him say "It's better." I'm pretty sure they are strong enough to lift it without the straps but they aren't trying to make things more difficult to do.

I have nothing against muscles, it just doesn't drive the world as much as what people think it does. The only people that really need it are people who play certain sports, have certain jobs that require size, maybe an action start here and there, and people who lift as a hobby.

 

[JowGaWolf]

karate, less so

Martial arts was actually more useful for me. I didn't have health issues until I stopped training. I have not interest in lifting weights like I used to when I was in my 20's. I actually learned some things through martial arts, did lion dance, forms, sparred, made new friends in the school and outside of the school. I did competitions when I was younger, actually used martial arts in street fights, I taught martial arts. Met you guys on MT because of my Martial Arts, Learned staff, learning sword, learning spear. It's a big stress relief for me and I didn't realize just how big until I stopped training, now I have big time hypertension.

Not saying I can't get the same benefits from lifting weights, but I've had more people ask me about my martial arts than my muscles.

 

[Bee Brian]

Yeah in my experience the only time where what weights you can lift or how much muscle you have mattered to anyone....it was in high school....after high school no one cares about unimportant stuff like that. It’s a hobby for you to care about but no one else does. That’s not even in a mean way but I’m a 4th dan black belt if I ever get a 5th dan I’m sure my friends will say well done but it’s not going to impress them and make them think more of me because simply they don’t care that much. This type of stuff really doesn’t impress others as much as people think it does

Dude it does. Women love men with muscles and those who are high up on the social hierarchy.

Get real. You know it does.

 

[Dirty Dog]

Dude it does. Women love men with muscles and those who are high up on the social hierarchy.

Get real. You know it does.

It seems to me that you know only really shallow women, or perhaps don't really know anything about women.

 

[Bee Brian]

It seems to me that you know only really shallow women, or perhaps don't really know anything about women.

I mean... There are women who will enter a man's life who will end up falling in love with the man for his personality. But I don't think that's what most men really want. Men just want a pleasurable sex life. Lust is an incredibly powerful emotion. It makes people cheat on their spouses. And at the end of the day, lust will win.

 

[jobo]

I can't remember when I had to push a car or when someone asked me to.

The last time I moved I didn't check out the movers to see if they were strong, It didn't matter how they moved the stuff so long as they could move it without breaking it.

Most people people use technique to move heavy stuff. I've done this without the straps and it's heavy and it was never as easy as what I'm seeing here. They had a choice to move it without the straps, but you hear him say "It's better." I'm pretty sure they are strong enough to lift it without the straps but they aren't trying to make things more difficult to do.

I have nothing against muscles, it just doesn't drive the world as much as what people think it does. The only people that really need it are people who play certain sports, have certain jobs that require size, maybe an action start here and there, and people who lift as a hobby.

well no they dont ask you coz they know your weak,

i get three or 4 requests a month to help people out moving thing, , pushibg thibgs and occational pulling things and once in a while to break in for them, but thats been happening since i was 7, i must look like i have cat burglar skills

 

[jobo]

I mean... There are women who will enter a man's life who will end up falling in love with the man for his personality. But I don't think that's what most men really want. Men just want a pleasurable sex life. Lust is an incredibly powerful emotion. It makes people cheat on their spouses. And at the end of the day, lust will win.

generaly its other blokes that are impresed wwith your muscles, that can indeed move you up the,social hierarchy.

but that rather depends on the social group, no one cares at the chess club

 

[jobo]

Martial arts was actually more useful for me. I didn't have health issues until I stopped training. I have not interest in lifting weights like I used to when I was in my 20's. I actually learned some things through martial arts, did lion dance, forms, sparred, made new friends in the school and outside of the school. I did competitions when I was younger, actually used martial arts in street fights, I taught martial arts. Met you guys on MT because of my Martial Arts, Learned staff, learning sword, learning spear. It's a big stress relief for me and I didn't realize just how big until I stopped training, now I have big time hypertension.

Not saying I can't get the same benefits from lifting weights, but I've had more people ask me about my martial arts than my muscles.

apart from sd, the uses of ma,skills are very limited, like you can turn a light on with your foot if your hands are full, and ...no thats about it

i ised my football skill to catch a dropped egg on my foot the other day, , bet you cant do that with your spear