who gave ed parker his black belt ?

[suicide]

In general or in Kenpo? Because he was a BB in Judo before he left Hawaii.

this is a kenpo question ...

 

[shesulsa]

:deadhorse:tantrum::fart::btg:irates:

 

[punisher73]

As Mr. Bishop has already stated, this is incorrect.

Who? Furthermore, they are clearly mistaken as the photograph directly contradicts them.

This is irrelevant. No one is disputing Parker's skill or knowledge. Just that his kenpo rank under Chow is disputable. Which as I said is almost irrelevent since he didn't teach Kara-Ho Kempo.

Right, of which no evidence to contradict Chow's statement that he did not issue one to Parker has been presented by you.

It does not invalidate his claim against Parker's rank in Kara-Ho Kempo.

This is irrelevant and has nothing to do with Parker's rank. Nice attempt at a Starw-man argument though :wink:

Please provide evidence to the contrary.

This is irrelevant to what rank Chow gave him. Any training under Emperado would be irrelevant at this point since he was teaching Kajukenbo and not Kara-Ho. Even if Parker earned a BB in Kajukenbo that would not be a BB under Chow or in Chow's Kempo.

This is irrelevant to Parker's rank under Chow. Furthermore, GM Kuoha is the true successor and he has the documentation to prove it.

So? Once again, this does not a liar make.

So? Lots of people did, Mitose was not easy to like and there was a lot of negative politics surrounding him. It is also irrelevant to Parker's rank.

This is your opinion, a disputable one at that.

Yes, he was angry. This doesn't mean he lied about Parker's rank.

Irrelevant, this has nothing to do with Parker's rank.

Each one is a link in the chain. Why would nothing ever be said about this while Parker was alive (or Chow for that matter). Each item pointed out was that Chow changed and exagerated known facts as was pointed out in several of the claims in the interview. You are choosing to ignore all of the other things that were wrong with what Chow said, but suddenly that one item is to be taken as fact. It's not a strawman argument, it is presenting everything as a whole to show that the information in that interview is not accurate and is only for an agenda to stir the pot.

Why would Sijo Emperado promote Parker to 5th Dan, if he knew that he had been lying all these years about his rank from Chow? Ralph Castro studied with Chow and recieved his Brown Belt from Chow and was promoted to Black belt by Parker, don't you think that he would have known that Parker was never promoted by Chow?

There are many respectable MA's that knew and trained with Chow and I have never heard/read one of them say he wasn't promoted.

Correct on being wrong about the photo though. Had read from someone else that Chow only used white, brown, black when parker trained with him.

 

[celtic_crippler]

Had read from someone else that Chow only used white, brown, black when parker trained with him.

I had a "senior" tell me that.

Anyway...yeah, it's no secret that though Chow kicked much butt he was definately a whack-job and said some outlandish things in his life.

 

[James Kovacich]

If it's real?

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=11108&d=1247981837

 

[suicide]

If it's real?

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=11108&d=1247981837

all we need to do now is verify tthat sig.

 

[Ray]

What I really want to know is "who gave Newton his professorship"

 

[John Bishop]

Here's samples of Prof Chow's signature from 1973 and 1986.

(1986)

 

[Sigung86]

Well does it matter now, no. Should it matter yes, we all have a lineage and was trained by someone. Nobody woke up and said I am a Black Belt today.

Some have...

 

[Sigung86]

Y'know... I just sort of stumbled in and posted my above post before I realized this sucker ran on for four pages. I might be a little bit blind, or maybe age is catching up, but these kinds of arguments are crap for want of a better word, particularly about this subject. There is so much that is undocumented about the early days of most all the martial arts that folks practice now.

Speaking with a friend of mine last night about rank, high rank, and how much does it count. Having been a martial artist since around 1963, sorry no real documentation back that far, and having come up a long way in the intervening years, I guess my attitude is, "Who really cares"? Not just about Mr. Parker, but about all of our arts, interpretations, and subjunctures, in general. Was the first Black Belt ever given to the very first Black Belt recipient in those halcyon days of yesteryear, issued from Heaven?

I tend to look at knowledge and such as a real test of a martial artist. Would you stop and learn from an Orange Belt, purple, blue, green, or one of the modern 3 degrees of brown if they maybe had something to offer? Why not? I would, and often do. I have, for instance, a twelve year old, small in stature, young lady who, on occasion, gives me insights into what we normal or larger size folks take for granted, that may not work for diminutive folks. She's barely a blue belt, and still manages to instruct. Should she be ignored?

To me, the value of the Black Belt is all simply because we've all granted it credence. The old Kung-fu schools had no such gradings. You either were recognized by your peers, or not.

Who really cares about the old lore, legends myths, and perhaps, outright lies. If you spend time perfecting what you have found and what works for you... Then I repeat... What the Hell does it matter regarding who gave what to who and when? Interestingly, it seems that no one ever questioned Bruce Lee on his abilities, and yet he never attained a Black Belt anywhere. He thought belts were good for holding up pants, only. Me too!
:yoda:

 

[shaolin-warrior]

sorry duplicate...

 

[dianhsuhe]

My understanding is that Professor Chow gave Mr. Parker his Black-Belt when he (Parker) left to teach here in the mainland, and there was an agreement between the two that would have been mutually beneficial but this agreement was apparently never fulfilled by Mr. Parker.

Professor was not happy at all with Mr. Parker and did not like his Kenpo, of which Parker admittedly changed 90%. Professor called it "Mosquito fighting".

Mr. Parkers skill and contributions are certainly not in question these days...

Some day soon I hope we can all focus on furthering all of these mens systems, ideals.

 

[Milt G.]

:wavey: answer : the real deal !

Hello,

I do not think Evander Holyfield, AKA; "the real deal", gave Ed Parker his black belt.

I think it was given to him by William Chow and recognized over the years by many prominent martial arts founders and leaders. Of course, it was not given in American Kenpo, or EPAK. Those "variations" did not exsist at that time. It was given in Kenpo Karate, I believe.

Of course there are various opinions on this subject. But going on lineage, appropriate in this case, it was William Chow.

An interesting, if over discussed, topic.

Thank you,
Milt G.

 

[Kembudo-Kai Kempoka]

I remember clearly what Ed Parker said when I asked him about it.

"Who the hell are you? How the hell did you get in my house at 3:00 in the morning past that alarm system Rich Hale installed? Get outta here before I kick da crap out of you and call da cops!"

Ahhh, memories. I should have sued him for the sprained ankle I got running down the stairs.

 

[Kembudo-Kai Kempoka]

all we need to do now is verify tthat sig.

Look at the cursive "fessor" and at the hieght of "Chow" above the lines. Particularly, the nature of the 2 "ss" in "Professor": The space between them, , between them at the 'e' of the 'fe', the fatness of the first s, the narrowness of the 2nd.

 

[shaolinmonkmark]

ok, so , now we have to bring in an " FBI signature expert ?"

LOL!!!

 

[Kembudo-Kai Kempoka]

ok, so , now we have to bring in an " FBI signature expert ?"

LOL!!!

Hey. It's already been done for other kenpo lineage claimants. People do wierd stuff to bolster their claims or diminish those of others.

 

[shaolinmonkmark]

Hey. It's already been done for other kenpo lineage claimants. People do wierd stuff to bolster their claims or diminish those of others.

right, but scientists, criminalogists, and CIA have all noted, that as time goes, on, and we get older, our "Hand writing " may slightly diminsh/or change a bit.
(Im not sticking up for anyone at all, just stating that time maybe could be a factor In this case.(?)

 

[shaolinmonkmark]

only way to really find out, is compare the hand writing and signatures at , before and after the same time parker received his.
That way, we can get earlier ones, around the same time, and, after parker got his.

 

[jks9199]

And they have to be comparable exemplars... Which those don't really appear to be.