What do you guys think about?

[Tez3]

A martial artist is someone not only enjoys the art combat, but the spiritual side and philosophical side as well

No, I know many martial artists who don't care a fig for the spiritual and philosophical side. I can't actually remember the last time I met a martial artist who was actually into that part.

When you watch the sport as a fan and not knowing anything about the arts you become a kid. I have seen many kids beating there brains out or claiming to know so called mma and you know what they don't know baloney about the sport.

'You become a kid'? that's makes no sense. Kids have been 'beating their head's' for years since Bruce Lee became famous, kick boxing was the fad for a long time, then JKD before that there was boxing. It's nothing new.

On the other hand when you see a lot of athletes who never studied martial arts in the their life and all of the sudden they become MMA stars.

I don't know of any idiot who would get into the cage/ring for an MMA fight without a good knowledge of martial arts, that's would be insane.

And, yes MMA is a Sport and not what I call true MMA. I once asked a ufc fighter on this particular subject and he was shaky on his answer and admittedly said it was a sport with regulations.

So, which fighter or was it someone who just trained MMA?


No one called what they did 'MMA' before it became what it is, they said they were cross training or doing multiple martial arts or even just training martial arts. Martial arts has always had a competitive element, some like to compete some don't. Some like to challenge themselves by taking a fight, others like to test techniques and to see if they can go a few rounds. It has always happened in martial arts, as I said some like it some don't, it doesn't make MMA less of a martial art, it just makes it the same as many others.

 

[RTKDCMB]

I have seen many kids beating there brains out or claiming to know so called mma and you know what they don't know baloney about the sport.

I call those people 'instant experts', because that's what they think they are. There are people who claim they are more than they are with just about every sport and martial art, MMA is no different in that regard.

 

[wingchun100]

That's a pretty broad brush you're painting with. The UFC, and MMA as a whole, have a lot of people in it. Whatever your particular art happens to be, there's people in MMA who have also studied that same art. They might have a different opinion.

"I know you hate me, now." No, I really don't. I don't even dislike you, not even a little. Perhaps other things you "know" might also be incorrect?

My guess is your love for your particular Art is pure and filled with youthful exuberance and passion. Those qualities are wonderful, but can, at times, also narrow vision.

For instance, do you honestly believe there aren't any people in MMA who enjoy the spiritual side and philosophical side of the Arts?

And, yes, it does take years of dedication to be called a Martial Artist. How many years do you have in? Not as a kid, that doesn't count, but as an adult?

As for thinking outside the box, do you think outside the box?

I agree. We have no idea how many MMA practitioners engage in the philosophical side of what they do. Is it likely? No, because they are very busy training their asses off to win fights, but it cannot be ruled out or easily dismissed.

 

[wingchun100]

Also, I know many people who train in traditional styles who don't care about the philosophical side. So what does the OP consider someone who trains in one style, but does not care for any of the spiritual/philosophical stuff?

 

[frank raud]

Also, I know many people who train in traditional styles who don't care about the philosophical side. So what does the OP consider someone who trains in one style, but does not care for any of the spiritual/philosophical stuff?

I've been doing martial arts continuously since the 80's, years before the UFC existed, have yet to have a spiritual awakening through the martial arts. Guess I've wasted all those years. I could have been the boggle champion of my neighbourhood, but I chose to spend my time in the martial arts.

 

[wingchun100]

I've been doing martial arts continuously since the 80's, years before the UFC existed, have yet to have a spiritual awakening through the martial arts. Guess I've wasted all those years. I could have been the boggle champion of my neighbourhood, but I chose to spend my time in the martial arts.

I enjoy the spiritual and philosophical side myself, but I know some people just want to learn how to kick ***. Nothing wrong with that.

 

[JowGaWolf]

What do you guys think about the UFC or any other organizations alike, and do you think they have a good or negative impact on the martial arts community?

I think it has had both bad and good effects on the martial arts community.
Good things about the UFC.
1. Highlighted poor martial arts training and instruction within pre UFC systems.

2. Expanded the width of martial arts system vs martial art systems. In the past this was the test for many martial artists. System A vs System A.

The exact same way as boxing tests boxing. The UFC has made it more acceptable to do things like open sparring at a school where is System A vs what ever system shows up that day. People back then were good at using their system to fight their system. This forces people to have a deeper understanding of their own system and techniques beyond the context of fighting their own system.

3. UFC actually validates traditional martial arts. Many of the techniques used in UFC fight come from traditional martial arts. I know the MMA fans would disagree, but I don't think the MMA fighters would. The only real difference is that these techniques aren't being applied as if they are fighting someone from the same system.

4. UFC opened the eyes of people who want to avoid a McDojo. In the past most people accepted any martial art training as "the real thing" anyone seeing something like the video below would be amazed and think, "if I can break a board then I can break someone's face." For the longest demos like this were the only things that people had to go on.

People rightfully assume that if "if I know a martial arts and my enemy doesn't then I can beat my enemy." That's how our brains work. The reality is probably more along the lines of "If I train to fight and my enemy doesn't then I can beat my enemy." The UFC has help put this in more of a perspective and fewer people think that just because they know a martial arts doesn't mean that they will beat their enemy. More consideration is being taken into account when looking at Martial arts training now (for those who want to use it for fighting and real self defense).

Here are some bad effects of UFC
1. People abandoning traditional martial arts and thinking that they are useless.
2. Martial arts like karate, TKD, and especially Kung Fu have become the butt of jokes and no longer hold the validity that I those systems deserve.
3. UFC showed the reality of how painful a kick, an elbow are a punch to the face can be. "Hey come join MMA. Here are the things that you may experience."
4. There is a general mentality that those who want to fight join MMA gyms and that mentality is tough on schools like mine who need people like that to join our school.
5. Because people don't want to get hurt some Martial Art schools have taken the pain out of martial arts so that it will attract more people.

 

[OneKick]

Clearly no one understands my point after stating what I said. I said it many times again and again. Now I will take this one back and say yes MMA is martial art but it is a sport at the same time. Why should I call it a martial art when all you do is beat the living hell out of one another.

I will stick to my guns and say today's MMA has no right to be called MMA. I stated MMA/UFC is more of a style just like tae kwon do, karate and many other fighting styles.

The UFC does promote it's own side of martial arts which is mostly the violence side. Kids watch this stuff and get the wrong impressions on what the so called martial arts is all about. I am clearly not coming back to this forum until you do your math.

And, what spiritual or philosophical side is there in beating the living hell out of each other in cage?

 

[FlamingJulian]

I think it has a very negative impact on martial artists. It gives people the idea that we're violent. I think point sparring is good but I disagree with beating the daylights out of someone unless it's self defense. The UFC in my opinion will make you a better fighter due to the little bit of realism but I don't think it's worth it.


-Julian

 

[JowGaWolf]

A martial artist is someone not only enjoys the art combat, but the spiritual side and philosophical side as well. It takes dedication and years for someone to be called a martial artist in my opinion. To me martial art is a way of life and form of mediation and takes years of discipline to grasp hold of it.

This line of thought is a 1960's and 70's perception of martial arts.

There is nothing spiritual about a tiger claw technique to the face, or a tai chi sword to the gut, or a spear jab to the face. Martial arts is brutal and the only philosophy is "how can I hurt my enemy with maximum efficiency" and "How can I defend against my enemy with maximum efficienty." Many people think Tai Chi is innocent, all about spiritual development, and that it's for old people.

 

[JowGaWolf]

Name one.

That's funny. How about Art Jimmerson

 

[JowGaWolf]

And, what spiritual or philosophical side is there in beating the living hell out of each other in cage?

 

[frank raud]

Clearly no one understands my point after stating what I said. I said it many times again and again. Now I will take this one back and say yes MMA is martial art but it is a sport at the same time. Why should I call it a martial art when all you do is beat the living hell out of one another.

I will stick to my guns and say today's MMA has no right to be called MMA. I stated MMA/UFC is more of a style just like tae kwon do, karate and many other fighting styles.

The UFC does promote it's own side of martial arts which is mostly the violence side. Kids watch this stuff and get the wrong impressions on what the so called martial arts is all about. I am clearly not coming back to this forum until you do your math.

So, either we agree with you, or we are wrong? There's a saying that comes to mind about opinions. By the way, would you prefer people get their impression of martial arts from movies, because it is a much more realistic portrayal?

If someone in the UFC has spent years getting a black belt in a traditional system(GSP, kyushinkai, Ronda Rousey, Judo, Chuck Liddel, Kempo, Lyoto Machida, Shotokan, etc)not to mention the numerous BJJ black belts, are they no longer martial artists?
Are you against competition in martial arts in general? Do you disagree with having Judo and Tae Kwon Do in the Olympics? What level of contact is acceptable to you? Is point sparring an effective method of demonstrating the validity of your techniques?

As you believe that MMA does not deserve to be called MMA, because it is made up of mixed martial arts, what would you call it? I believe you have been asked that question already. By the way, just for reference, the guy who called it "human cockfighting" chose Sarah Palin as his running mate.

 

[JowGaWolf]

UFC Philosphy

 

[Kickboxer101]

Clearly no one understands my point after stating what I said. I said it many times again and again. Now I will take this one back and say yes MMA is martial art but it is a sport at the same time. Why should I call it a martial art when all you do is beat the living hell out of one another.

I will stick to my guns and say today's MMA has no right to be called MMA. I stated MMA/UFC is more of a style just like tae kwon do, karate and many other fighting styles.

The UFC does promote it's own side of martial arts which is mostly the violence side. Kids watch this stuff and get the wrong impressions on what the so called martial arts is all about. I am clearly not coming back to this forum until you do your math.

And, what spiritual or philosophical side is there in beating the living hell out of each other in cage?

All martial arts have sport aspect these days. So are you saying taekwondos not a martial art or judo or jiu jitsu or karate or boxing or kickboxing. These fighters aren't idiots from the street these guys train seriously hard day after day, these guys have families they've been to college, got degrees. Fighters come from all lives. We've had teachers, fire fighters, police officers, dancers. These fighters are competing and yeah people can get hurt as you can in all sports but no ones intentiallh trying to hurt people after almost every fight the fighters will help each other up hug each other and laugh and joke. Fighters like Anderson silva and Gsp bow to their opponents after a match anderson even gets on his knees and bows.

So you won't come back until we agree you are right? Bye close the door on your way out.

 

[frank raud]

I think it has a very negative impact on martial artists. It gives people the idea that we're violent. I think point sparring is good but I disagree with beating the daylights out of someone unless it's self defense. The UFC in my opinion will make you a better fighter du and kice to the little bit of realism but I don't think it's worth it.


-Julian

Reality check. You train to punch and kick people. No contact point sparring doesn't tell you if a technique is effective, just if it potentially is. Watching Nascar races doesn't mean we all have to drive 200MPH in a pack.

 

[Kickboxer101]

I think it has a very negative impact on martial artists. It gives people the idea that we're violent. I think point sparring is good but I disagree with beating the daylights out of someone unless it's self defense. The UFC in my opinion will make you a better fighter due to the little bit of realism but I don't think it's worth it.


-Julian

Ufc fighters are not violent for the most part. They're trained athletes who use their skills in a competitive environment which is legal, has rules and has medical checks before and after fights and doctors ring side and ambulances ready at first instance. Fighters look after each other look at mark hunt he knocks a guy out he walks away before the referee had even stopped it. Plenty of fighters have choked a guy unconscious and let go as soon as they realise without referee intervention.

I even was just now reading an article about Georges st Pierre the longest reining welterweight champ and one of the top pound for pound guys in the world said he hadn't finished fights in ages because he was worried about hurting them.

 

[Tez3]

One thing....the UFC is a company which runs MMA fights, it is not a martial art nor is it a sport, it's a business. There's many other promotions out there, many promoters running fight nights. Please do not confuse the UFC and MMA, that is such a fan boy thing to do!

I think it has a very negative impact on martial artists. It gives people the idea that we're violent. I think point sparring is good but I disagree with beating the daylights out of someone unless it's self defense. The UFC in my opinion will make you a better fighter due to the little bit of realism but I don't think it's worth it.


-Julian

You don't know what it was like before MMA, so you are assuming it's MMA that makes martial arts look violent lol, you should have been around during the Bruce Lee era, the kick boxing era etc etc. Full contact karate was kicking the daylights out of people long before you were even a twinkle in your father's eye. As I said please don't confuse the UFC and MMA, it will be MMA that makes you a better fighter, the UFC will match, promote and market your fights but you don't fight UFC.

 

[Tony Dismukes]

That's funny. How about Art Jimmerson

Boxing is a martial art. Jimmerson was a highly accomplished professional boxer, so he obviously spent many years of his life training martial arts to a high level.

He also was never a "MMA star", given that he only had one MMA fight, which he lost.

So really, rather than being "an athlete who never trained martial arts suddenly becoming a MMA star", he was a serious martial artist who trained hard for years and completely failed to become a MMA star.

 

[Kickboxer101]

One thing....the UFC is a company which runs MMA fights, it is not a martial art nor is it a sport, it's a business. There's many other promotions out there, many promoters running fight nights. Please do not confuse the UFC and MMA, that is such a fan boy thing to do!





You don't know what it was like before MMA, so you are assuming it's MMA that makes martial arts look violent lol, you should have been around during the Bruce Lee era, the kick boxing era etc etc. Full contact karate was kicking the daylights out of people long before you were even a twinkle in your father's eye. As I said please don't confuse the UFC and MMA, it will be MMA that makes you a better fighter, the UFC will match, promote and market your fights but you don't fight UFC.

Not to mention the old misconceptions that the old Kung fu master can torutre you with one finger or the deadly din mak that can kill you in a second.