The fundamentals of your style.
- Thread starter jezr74
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You need to expand on what you're asking about here... What do you mean by "fundamentals"? Principles that underlie the techniques? Key strategies and approaches? Methods of power generation? Preferred range? Preferred weapons? See what I mean...
Ok, I'll try, starting with Aikido. Koichi Tohei posted four principles which you could call fundamentals. Relax completely, maintain centre, keep weight underside and extend Ki. The first two are self explanatory, the last two quite complex, but they really encompass the practice of Aikido.
When we look at karate, and here I am talking of Okinawan karate, all four apply, but realistically only three of them would be mentioned (excluding weight underside). The first two are constantly stressed. If I was to add another it would be that when you make the decision to engage you don't disengage until the danger is over.
Now when I look at other martial arts I can see most of them embracing the same principles, even if they may not be expressed in the same words.
When we look at karate, and here I am talking of Okinawan karate, all four apply, but realistically only three of them would be mentioned (excluding weight underside). The first two are constantly stressed. If I was to add another it would be that when you make the decision to engage you don't disengage until the danger is over.
Now when I look at other martial arts I can see most of them embracing the same principles, even if they may not be expressed in the same words.
Our base is called B1a, and B1b, which means clear (cancel height, width, and depth zones) & Thrust.
- 13 Taibao and 24 Shin (十三太保, 二十四式) - 13 postures training and 24 solo drills.
- 4 sides and 2 doors.
- butterfly hands.
- general defense and counter.
- ...
- 4 sides and 2 doors.
- butterfly hands.
- general defense and counter.
- ...
OP
OP
Whatever it means to you. I have heard the term fundamentals used by different practitioners (some on this site) a lot. And was hoping to hear peoples interpretation from different styles. I suspect there is no right or wrong answer, but I might learn more about other styles and where practitioners are coming from if I have an idea of what is the base of their training. Hope that makes sense.
If principles are what first jumps to mind when thinking of the fundamentals of your style, then that's what it is to you, I'd like to then hear about your principles in your art.
OP
OP
It could be, maybe it's not to far from what people call principles?
OP
OP
So fundamentals are principles that are consistent through all levels of your training? And is more important than knowing the basics as it's the foundation?
I think I can relate more to your description for Aikido since I practice Hapkido with very similar fundamentals\principles.
Okay, here are our basics
- movement. Lots of footwork. Part of why I like my TSD school is my footwork from boxing transferred almost flawlessly
-attack the attack.
- distance and don't waste moves.
For techs,
We use deep stances in forms for conditioning, deep horse stances help with many throws and takedowns.
4 basic kicks: roundhouse, side kick, front kick (thrusting not flipping) and back pivot. All from the same high knee chamber.
Jabs and reverse punches for sparring. Elbows, back fists, and knife hands
Danny T
Senior Master
Fundamentals are the basics; the basics by which something functions or is structured.
OP
OP
I've also heard it used specifically in the context of more along the lines of principles. This is what I'm after, WC centre line, Aikido circular motions, relaxation etc. mention of a focus on footwork. I just thought that maybe a the term fundamentals was more encompassing, it looks like I may have heard it used more in the wrong context.
Defense and Counters principles for the Shuai-Chiao (Chinese Wrestling) system are:
吸(XI) - Sticky, 摟(LOU) - Outer hook, 勾(GOU) - Upper hook, 判(PAN) - Trap, 削(XIAO) - Sickle hooking, 蹲(DUN) - Drop down, 跳(TIAO) - Hop,
磨(MO) - Spin, 轟(HONG) - Herd, 摇(YAO) - Shake, ...
Shai Hulud
Purple Belt
Sambo, whether Sport, Combat of Freestyle, rely on 4 basic principles: 1) Momentum & Transmission of Force, 2) Mechanics, 3) Leverage, and 4) Technique (power and speed included here).
ShortBridge
3rd Black Belt
Wing Chun (according to my folks)
Grounding
Center
Forward Intent
Relaxation
Economy of Motion
Not that different even though they look like very different styles.
Flying Crane
Sr. Grandmaster
Rooting and body rotation. And movement, while not losing the root. And still using body rotation.
Fundamentals -
Punching, kicking and grappling. The stand up used to be pretty even as far as percentage of punches and kicks, but in the last twenty five years it has morphed to around seventy five percent punching and twenty five percent kicking. All sparring is contact sparring. The punching looks like boxing to most. I think most most of you would recognize it as karate guys who also boxed. We train elbows and knees, but do not utilize them sparring (glaring weakness IMO). The "fundamental" we preach is "Keep your hands up, your chin down and your knees bent."
We don't train any Kata. I think that might also be a weakness, but I'm not completely sure yet.
The grappling is based on Bjj (Gracie) as was taught to us. We utilize light ground and pound and punch from guard more than in guard.
Our throws suck.
The other, more important fundamentals we teach are behavior and character. Both dojo etiquette and being a lady or gentleman outside the dojo. I know some may scoff at that, but I never gave a rat's ash about what people think. (Everybody knows where the dojo's door is) I also think good character creates a tactical advantage in real world fighting.
There is some handgun and knife training for some of the LEOs, not so much defensive, all offensive.
As for principles -
When he moves, you move. When he doesn't move, you move.
There's always one more son of a B than you counted on.
And even in the event of photographic evidence - deny everything.
Punching, kicking and grappling. The stand up used to be pretty even as far as percentage of punches and kicks, but in the last twenty five years it has morphed to around seventy five percent punching and twenty five percent kicking. All sparring is contact sparring. The punching looks like boxing to most. I think most most of you would recognize it as karate guys who also boxed. We train elbows and knees, but do not utilize them sparring (glaring weakness IMO). The "fundamental" we preach is "Keep your hands up, your chin down and your knees bent."
We don't train any Kata. I think that might also be a weakness, but I'm not completely sure yet.
The grappling is based on Bjj (Gracie) as was taught to us. We utilize light ground and pound and punch from guard more than in guard.
Our throws suck.
The other, more important fundamentals we teach are behavior and character. Both dojo etiquette and being a lady or gentleman outside the dojo. I know some may scoff at that, but I never gave a rat's ash about what people think. (Everybody knows where the dojo's door is) I also think good character creates a tactical advantage in real world fighting.
There is some handgun and knife training for some of the LEOs, not so much defensive, all offensive.
As for principles -
When he moves, you move. When he doesn't move, you move.
There's always one more son of a B than you counted on.
And even in the event of photographic evidence - deny everything.
Chinese wrestling general principles/strategies (sometime principle and strategy are hard to be separated):
- Push the head down and sweep/hook the leg up.
- Move your gravity center to be outside of your base, borrow the gravity, lose your balance, take your opponent down, regain your balance back.
- Get both of your opponent's legs if you can, otherwise, get one leg first and get the other leg afterward.
- Attack one direction, when your opponent resists, borrow his resistance, and attack the opposite direction.
- Attack one direction, when your opponent yields/escapes, borrow his yielding, and attack the same direction again.
- You want yourself to be at where your opponent is standing. You also want your opponent to be at where you are standing.
- Move yourself out of your opponent's attacking path, give him plenty space, and lead him into the emptiness.
- Hide your preparation in your previous move so you can reduce 1,2 into 1, and 1,2,3 into 1,2.
- Fight in your opponent's territory instead of to fight your own territory.
- Interrupt your opponent's power generation and speed generation in the early stage.
- Lead your opponent into some areas that you are more familiar with than he does.
- It's better to be on the top than to be on the bottom. It's better to be inside than to be outside.
- Strength can defeat 10 best techniques. Good skill can defeat strength.
- Use shaking to deal with big and strong opponent.
- If your opponent punches/kicks you, you run him down. If your opponent does nothing, you still run him down.
- Don't use brute force. It's better to find the right key to open the right lock.
- Use your opponent's contact point as your free contact point.
- Try to obtain clinch ASAP.
- ...
- Push the head down and sweep/hook the leg up.
- Move your gravity center to be outside of your base, borrow the gravity, lose your balance, take your opponent down, regain your balance back.
- Get both of your opponent's legs if you can, otherwise, get one leg first and get the other leg afterward.
- Attack one direction, when your opponent resists, borrow his resistance, and attack the opposite direction.
- Attack one direction, when your opponent yields/escapes, borrow his yielding, and attack the same direction again.
- You want yourself to be at where your opponent is standing. You also want your opponent to be at where you are standing.
- Move yourself out of your opponent's attacking path, give him plenty space, and lead him into the emptiness.
- Hide your preparation in your previous move so you can reduce 1,2 into 1, and 1,2,3 into 1,2.
- Fight in your opponent's territory instead of to fight your own territory.
- Interrupt your opponent's power generation and speed generation in the early stage.
- Lead your opponent into some areas that you are more familiar with than he does.
- It's better to be on the top than to be on the bottom. It's better to be inside than to be outside.
- Strength can defeat 10 best techniques. Good skill can defeat strength.
- Use shaking to deal with big and strong opponent.
- If your opponent punches/kicks you, you run him down. If your opponent does nothing, you still run him down.
- Don't use brute force. It's better to find the right key to open the right lock.
- Use your opponent's contact point as your free contact point.
- Try to obtain clinch ASAP.
- ...
Last edited:
hoshin1600
Senior Master
The fundamental base for what I do stems from research on combat and the biological responses to stress in combat. So for example we know under stress we sometimes experience tunnel vision. So in kata or scenario training I will have points that I will stop and scan the area for other threats.
We know that the biological response of the body is to lose fine motor skills so I make sure training uses more gross body moment and strikes.
So knowledge of these type biological responses act as a guide and baseline on which to build a combatives system. Kata would not be a continuous flow of action but rather short bursts of offensive actions that mimic real combat.
I like to use strikes that give the maximum return in the shortest amount of time.
The emotional content of the practioner is also important. As example you may give a gun to someone for self defense but that does not automatically mean they have the will to use it. To take a human life is a heavy decision and it would be a mistake to assume everyone has that emotional ability.
This may not be what you had in mind but I believe this makes a good foundation for everything else to be built upon.
We know that the biological response of the body is to lose fine motor skills so I make sure training uses more gross body moment and strikes.
So knowledge of these type biological responses act as a guide and baseline on which to build a combatives system. Kata would not be a continuous flow of action but rather short bursts of offensive actions that mimic real combat.
I like to use strikes that give the maximum return in the shortest amount of time.
The emotional content of the practioner is also important. As example you may give a gun to someone for self defense but that does not automatically mean they have the will to use it. To take a human life is a heavy decision and it would be a mistake to assume everyone has that emotional ability.
This may not be what you had in mind but I believe this makes a good foundation for everything else to be built upon.
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