Shuri-te

[tshadowchaser]

Chiduce thanks for the Short but detailed history I can follow it without any trouble.
Arnisador thanks for politly stateing what needed t be said.
Lets keep the discussions on topic and with some respect to the other posters . We agree t disagree but respect the others opion
Shadow:asian:

 

[Chiduce]

Originally posted by RyuShiKan




Good God where do you get this drivel?
Sorry dude but you ramble too much in your posts for me to actually take your seriously.

That drivel is fact jack. Now on page 54 of Okinawan Karate By Mark Bishop states in the section on Matsumura Orthodox Shorin-Ryu that the simplified lineage is as follows. Sokon Bushi Matsumura - Nabe Matsumura - Hohan Soken - Seiki Arakaki - Fuse Kise. There are no others in this direct line. Now Hohan Soken only had 6 primary students and they are as follows; Jushin Kohana - Fuse Kise - Seiki Arakaki - Mitsuo Inoue - Hideo Nakazato. Like i said before. The family system lineage spread after Soken Sensei took over the system. There were no others taught the family hakutsuru system but nabe and hohan soken! This family system revealed the ( "bu no chikara" ) or "Heavy Fist" to it's practitioner as well as striking and blocking with the cranes wing and hane while balancing in the single legged stance, etc. In the history of the Shaolin Fighting Monks and also the Bubishi Text there is mention of an okinawan temple in fuken. This is due to the fact that assumes Bushi Matsumura brought an okinawan version of the Bubishi Text back from the fukien/fuzhou okinawan temple upon his return to okinawa after completing his martial studies. "Mabuni, Kenwa wrote in his version of the Bubishi that he had made a copy from the copy that his teacher (Itosu) had made himself". Itosu had made a copy from his teacher, (Bushi Matsumura). So, even though this is theorized, it does show fact that the Shaolin Temple in Fuzhou was an okinawan temple! Bushi did also study in the Chinese Temple at Beijing. "Drivel"; HA! Sincerely, In Humility; Chiduce!

 

[RyuShiKan]

Originally posted by Chiduce

That drival is fact jack. Now on page 54 of Okinawan karate by Mark Bishop states in the section on Matsumura Orthodox Shorin-Ryu that the simplified lineage is as follows..........So, even though this is theorized, it does show fact that the Shaolin Temple in Fuzhou was an okinawan temple! Bushi did also study in the chinese temple at Beijing. "Drivel"; HA! Sincerely, In Humility; Chiduce!

I read the same book, you fail to mention all the people that studied with Bushi Matsumura before Hohan Soken.......but whatever.

As for Matsumura studying in any Shoalin temple is speculation at best.
He may have studied from someone that had been at the Shoalin temple but there is no proof he lived and trained there.

"Shoalin temple in Fuzhou an Okinawan temple".......:rofl: ......prove it.
There was a temple in Fuzhou and it was a Shoalin temple but it was most assuredly a Chinese one.
You have gone from "drivel" to outright nonsense.


When you start presenting the full facts and not just "your version" (p54. of Bishop's Book) and start proving some of the things you are claiming then I will stop calling your posts "drivel"

 

[Chiduce]

Originally posted by RyuShiKan




I read the same book, you fail to mention all the people that studied with Bushi Matsumura before Hohan Soken.......but whatever.

As for Matsumura studying in any Shoalin temple is speculation at best.
He may have studied from someone that had been at the Shoalin temple but there is no proof he lived and trained there.

"Shoalin temple in Fuzhou an Okinawan temple".......:rofl: ......prove it.
There was a temple in Fuzhou and it was a Shoalin temple but it was most assuredly a Chinese one.
You have gone from "drivel" to outright nonsense.


When you start presenting the full facts and not just "your version" (p54. of Bishop's Book) and start proving some of the things you are claiming then I will stop calling your posts "drivel"

Homes, what i gave you as info is fact. By the way, how could an okinawan version of the chinese bubishi text exist unless it was translated into the okinawan language by okinawan monks at shaolin! You keep talking about the students before nabe and hohan soken. You are a close minded analogy of your version of what you want to be fact. Open your mind and see that there was no one which learned the matsumura family system of shorin-ryu but nabe and hohan soken from bushi. Now where is your fact that i'am false? You have none. You only have the fact that bushi taught others hakutsuru, but not the family hakutsuru /white crane system. Go to any source and look up matsumura seito and you will not see anyone but nabe and hohan soken as the system's leaders! I gave you proof just as you gave me the names of the others which bushi matsumura taught. Now if you were a teacher at that particular time in history, and well known would you be stupid enough to teach many all the martial skill that you attained? So, what in Heaven's name do you think that a man as skilled as bushi would do. Protect Family First; not teach others to defeat him and family members. To tell you the truth guy, like would really like to curse you out. But i will not stoop as low as you and even try to assume that you understand. There is an old saying that if your cup is full, that there is no room for improvement or learning. Sir, so please keep your cup over-running with slop and bath in it! Sincerely, in Humility; Chiduce!

 

[RyuShiKan]

Originally posted by Chiduce

Homes, what i gave you as info is fact.

My name is not "Holmes" save that crap for your gang-bangin buddies........or would you like me to start calling you "Cheez-Douche"?

I hope you don't mind me asking your age.The reason why is I feel like I am having a discussion with a teenager.

Originally posted by Chiduce

By the way, how could an okinawan version of the chinese bubishi text exist unless it was translated into the okinawan language by okinawan monks at shaolin!

If you actually had a copy of the Bubishi you would have read who contributed to it's contsruction and how it came to be inthe hands of Okinawans.
If you have re-read the part about the 36 Chinese families in Okinawa and the Ryukyu Cultrual envoys to China, Fuzhou.
I would say if you could read Japanese you may even want to refer to a book called Ryukyu no Kase which tells in great detail about the above mentioned envoys. Since you can barely comprehend what you read in English I doubt you will have a chance to read it.

If you knew anything about the Shoalin Temple you would know that only until recently did they even let foreigners enter the temple, not to mention actually TRAIN there!

Originally posted by Chiduce

You keep talking about the students before nabe and hohan soken. You are a close minded analogy of your version of what you want to be fact.

No I keep looking at the same page you do with the same names written on it....why is it I see them and you don't. I just quoted Bishop's book. I don't know where you pulled your fairy tale version of "Okinawa Shoalin Monks" from, but whomever told you that is an idiot.

Since you know "everything" there is to know about Matsumura and his Okinawan Shoalin Temple I think I will leave you to wallow in your own "intelligence" :rofl:

 

[arnisador]

Please, keep the discussion polite and respectful, without personal insults.

-Arnisador
-MT Mod-

 

[Rob_Broad]

Gentlemen please refrain from escalating this any further. The comments are becoming very condescending, and it is causing enough friction that no one else wants to comment on this thread. Let us act accordingly and govern oursleves as martial artist.

MT Moderator
Rob Broad

 

[Chiduce]

OK! I will apologize for my comment about the cup! Yet, i only stated from texts which were authored by respected martial historians. Nothing more! It was not my version though i did not quote a lot of it as is from the texts! I have read a lot worse from others. Though that is another story. I would just like to know why a guy with so much knowledge would have a web page which is restricted like a top secret document. I guess it is a new thing. I do know that i like many others have nothing to hide about myself, my system or anything else. I keep an open mind to anything because there is always something new to learn. I can elaborate on the level as a well versed individual or on the level of the individual whom is nicely trying to tell me to go...! So, i'am through with expecting too much of others! Sincerely, In Humility; Chiduce!

 

[jeffbeish]

BTW, here is a photo of a Judo buddy Preston Pugh standing by Eiichi Miyazato who was with us in Japan in 1962 as our coach. He was godan Judo and is judan (10th dan) Goju-ryu karate master (if he is still alive that is). I think he was hachdan then. Very nice guy and made me wash the dojo floor more than once!

The old photo was not so good.

 

[norrisisawus]

Hey I studied under Rocky as a kid in Japan. I would really like to correspond with him if you could help that would be great.

Thanks

 

[norrisisawus]

Help find rocky.

 

[twendkata71]

FYI, Eiichi Miyazato Hanshi passed away in 1998 I believe. There is a website for the dojo that he founded on Okinawa. Taira sensei is now running his dojo, the last I had heard.