Need advice how I should practice self defense with a cane

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Alan0354

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I totally agree on general leg shots, the muscles can take a lot of abuse. That said I have (twice) ended fights with shots to the side of the knee with a 10 ounce rattan stick. One fight on the first hit it wasn't weight bearing any longer and on the second shot to the same knee and essentially the same location he was done. The other fight it took a single shot to end the fight, it is possible that guy could have kept going but it would certainly have impacted his mobility at the very least. In both of the those cases there was no actual permanent damage.

I saw a stick hit that split the kneecap that ended that fight immediately and I have seen stick hits to the top of the foot absolutely take guys out of fights. I don't see any reason why a cane to these targets wouldn't do the same.
And also the big difference is you are in a match, people are a lot more rugged and they go into the fight with determination and persistence. I am looking at street self defense situation. You look at the news, a lot of times those thugs are thin and not big. You see if the victim fight back, they ran away instead of fighting to their death.

For me, I don't have any intention going into a match, if I can just scare off the thug by a leg wack, that would be the best. I am also holding the cane with my left hand, cane never touch the ground. This is to show I am NOT using the cane for walking. Just a polite sign of " don't tread on me"!! I don't want to get into a fight, I just want to be prepare if I have to.

BTW, I am going to make new videos soon to let you tell me what to work on next. I have been practicing cast, it's NOT easy, took me a while to get the force. It's a lot more compact with casting, it's not wild swing like in my old videos. I can use it in more confined space. I was about ready to make the video a month or so ago, then I really got into footwork, I started practicing, learning from basic Kali footwork and modified to suit me. Still not very good, but I think it's time to show you to get more opinion what is the next step.

Thanks for all your help and going out of your way to make the video of casting for me. I have not slack off at all. I work on it like 5 days a week. Just don't think it's to the point I can show you yet.
 

Blindside

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BTW, I am going to make new videos soon to let you tell me what to work on next. I have been practicing cast, it's NOT easy, took me a while to get the force. It's a lot more compact with casting, it's not wild swing like in my old videos. I can use it in more confined space. I was about ready to make the video a month or so ago, then I really got into footwork, I started practicing, learning from basic Kali footwork and modified to suit me. Still not very good, but I think it's time to show you to get more opinion what is the next step.

Thanks for all your help and going out of your way to make the video of casting for me. I have not slack off at all. I work on it like 5 days a week. Just don't think it's to the point I can show you yet.

Great! I look forward to seeing it!
 

Oily Dragon

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You really think you can drop a person with one punch or kick? Chances are very very low unless you are Tyson.

Yes. The technical term is "KO".

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Alan0354

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Yes. The technical term is "KO".

View attachment 27784
Occasionally, no guaranty at all. Always after a long fight when all the punches and kicks adding up. Just starting a fight and knock out, I've seen it maybe once on tv.

I never say one strike on the leg with cane is going to knock out the person, it add up, slow the movement.

People that count on one strike knock out in fighting are DREAMING. I sure hope they don't count on it..................Well, of cause, if the opponent is willing to stand still, let you get to the optimal position, keep holding still and wait for you to strike. Then you have a good chance to do KO in one strike.
 

Oily Dragon

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Occasionally, no guaranty at all. Always after a long fight when all the punches and kicks adding up. Just starting a fight and knock out, I've seen it maybe once on tv.

I never say one strike on the leg with cane is going to knock out the person, it add up, slow the movement.

People do not have actual hit points. One strike to the head can cause instant death, paralysis, or permanent brain injury.
 
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Alan0354

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People do not have actual hit points. One strike to the head can cause instant death, paralysis, or permanent brain injury.
For bare hand punching, you have to be either very good or very lucky or both to knock out a person on the first punch. Usually it's it takes a lot of punches and finally landing one perfect one and knock the person out. Very seldom you go up and the first punch knock the person out.

OR of cause, if the opponent is willing to stand still and let you take the time to go to optimal distance, aim and strike, you can do it.

It's very easy to talk, but in reality, you just don't see this happen that often at all. Like I said, people in fight being knocked out hitting the head, BUT mostly is after many tries or cumulative effect after punching to the head many times and the final blow knock the person out.

Bottom line, do NOT count on it. It's easy to talk, not easy to do first punch knock out.
 
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Oily Dragon

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For bare hand punching, you have to be either very good or very lucky or both. OR of cause, if the opponent is willing to stand still and let you take the time to go to optimal distance, aim and strike, you can do it.
According to whom?

According to the record (sport and Youtube), there are plenty KOs on record that are the result a single strike.

Very good? Maybe. Very lucky? Ditto.
 
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Alan0354

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According to whom?

According to the record (sport and Youtube), there are plenty KOs on record that are the result a single strike.

Very good? Maybe. Very lucky? Ditto.
You miss my point, yes, there are a lot of single strike KO, not on the first strike of the fight.

If you read all my posts that started this, I said I want to make the first strike with the cane to the leg so I don't have to strike to the head of the first strike that can kill the person. Someone said striking the leg will not stop the person in one strike. That started the argument. We are not talking about bare knuckle fights.

I was not even talking about bare knuckle. But still, I don't believe you can count on the first strike and KO the person. Yes, you throw a lot of punches, most missing the optimal, but if you throw enough punches, one will land perfectly and knock the person out.
 
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Alan0354

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Can. But that's in a vanishingly small percentage of strikes.
I just saw an old UFC heavy weight fight, I forgot their names. The guy had heavy punches, but it was not until the 2nd or 3rd round when he one punch KO the opponent. He swing a lot, but it's hard to connect cleanly and perfectly. But the power is there, keep throwing the punches and all it takes is one clean and perfect punch and lights out.

Very very seldom I've seen the fight started and the first punch or kick KO somebody. Like I was joking that unless the opponent willing to stand still, let you take your time to get to perfect position and throw the strike, yes, then it is more likely one can KO the opponent on the first punch.

Whole discussion started when I said I don't want to use the cane to strike the thug's head as the first strike in self defense. I don't want to risk killing the guy with my heavy cane. I practice the first strike on the knee or the leg. Someone said striking the leg is not going to KO the person. That's what my intention as I don't expect to KO someone on the first strike, just slow the thug down by injuring the knee first and other strikes follow. The point is to neutralize the thug, not killing the thug, slowing him down is a good start by injuring the legs.
 
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Oily Dragon

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You miss my point, yes, there are a lot of single strike KO, not on the first strike of the fight.
Why not?

And what about the 3rd, 5th, etc.

Not getting the point is my calling card apparently. Always not understanding everyone else, nobody understanding me. I'll deal with it one breath at a time, as always.

 
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Alan0354

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Even so, there is a wide gulf between "can" and "not".
Point is don't count on it. Better have the mind set of not being able to KO the guy in the first punch, just work it through. If that happens, go buy a lottery ticket!!!
 

Oily Dragon

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Point is don't count on it. Better have the mind set of not being able to KO the guy in the first punch, just work it through. If that happens, go buy a lottery ticket!!!
It's not rare, though. Nothing like winning the lottery.

Just go look at all the fastest KOs in boxing in MMA history. There are plenty of fights that end in the first strikes. Because that's just the way the human body, especially the brain, works. And I think professionals know this.

Have you ever had a concussion? One strike can cause that.

How about the opposite of your question, don't you train like you could be KO'd with a single blow?
 
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Alan0354

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It's not rare, though. Nothing like winning the lottery.

Just go look at all the fastest KOs in boxing in MMA history. There are plenty of fights that end in the first strikes. Because that's just the way the human body, especially the brain, works. And I think professionals know this.

Have you ever had a concussion? One strike can cause that.

How about the opposite of your question, don't you train like you could be KO'd with a single blow?
Maybe you are that good, I won't count on it.
 
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Alan0354

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I'm not a great striker, honestly. I don't even like it.

I prefer tiger and dragon styles. Grippity stuff.
Let's get back to my cane, it all started because I said I don't want to strike on the head as my first strike. With a 20oz heavy cane swing with both hands, it is much higher possibility to kill someone with the first strike. I don't want that. I want to neutralize the person, not kill the person. So I practice striking on the knee as the first strike knowing it's not going to KO the guy, but I am sure it will slow down the guy from the injury of the leg. That's neutralizing. If not, at least I tried, then the head is fair game.

But I still going to try to strike the mid section. Not because of worrying about killing the guy. It's much harder for the opponent to try to grab the cane when I strike the leg and mid section. Striking the head is a double edge sword, it's much easier to grab the cane if you go high. It's much harder to grab the cane if I strike the mid section, that still will cause a lot of pain striking the arm, hand or ribs.
 

Oily Dragon

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I am sure it will slow down the guy from the injury of the leg.
You sure sound sure.

I'm not, you're confusing the hell out of me. We just warped from "don't count on the first strike ending a fight" to "my 20oz cane can kill with a single blow, so I'll try lower first".

help me out here. Which point did I just miss, this time? And keep in context I am a very well trained staff fighter. I'm a stick guy. I love them.

My favorite target? Feet. Vulnerable, necessary, sensitive.
 
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Alan0354

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You sure sound sure.

I'm not, you're confusing the hell out of me. We just warped from "don't count on the first strike ending a fight" to "my 20oz cane can kill with a single blow, so I'll try lower first".

help me out here. Which point did I just miss, this time? And keep in context I am a very well trained staff fighter. I'm a stick guy. I love them.

My favorite target? Feet. Vulnerable, necessary, sensitive.
I said the possibility is higher with a 20oz cane hitting on the head. That's the chance I am not willing to take.
 

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