Disabled students as black belts

[miguksaram]

In a nutshell if you have a mentally/physically disabled person as a student, can they reach a black belt in your school if they are unable to perform to the standards like non disabled students can?

 

[Gnarlie]

Yes. I began in TKD with a physically disabled instructor. The disability caused limitations in some areas e.g. balance on certain kicks, ability to run / bend the knee. However, it also provided its own heavy weapon, and the inability to run away also places automatic priorities in other areas such as effective self defence on the spot.

There's no reason why someone with a disability can't reach black belt. The set of standards that they hold themselves to may be different to those of others.

I feel that in the case of my original instructor, the additional challenges he faced had made him a better black belt than many I have met since.

 

[Twin Fist]

no.

this is a physical activity, all that matters is ability

now one of my students had osteoarthritis, he COULD NOT do what other people could. I allowed him to do things as well as he was able to. But he never got anywhere near BB level.

if they did the best they could, and there was no way they would improve? maybe an honorary belt.

no dan rank, and the cert would say "honorary" on it.

maybe

 

[dancingalone]

For conversation's sake, I'll quote what I said in the other thread:

Call me a jerk, but I'll admit to having mixed feelings about it. I'm OK with some allowances granted for physical disability, but IMO there needs to be some objective measure of achievement, sustainable outside of "he is doing the best he can". I regard it more like a college degree of sorts - there are clear requirements that must be met before the degree is conferred.

It's clear that a mentally or physically disabled person WON'T be able to perform identically to a person that doesn't have the same challenges, but this is true to an extent across all normal people anyway. We all have different bodies and different minds, and what one can do well, another might find difficult.

So the real question is what modifications and allowances in the test are we talking about? Is this something we are doing just for disabled people or are we being holistic in our evaluation for everyone in general?

As an example, I might be willing to forgive a lot when it comes to aesthetic presentation in performing forms, but I doubt I would back off much on things like precision and power demonstrated by breaking boards and that's true for everyone, handicapped or not.

 

[Dirty Dog]

I think you have to say "it depends"...

Start by defining what you would consider a disability. I only have one eye. Is that a disability?

It certainly impacts my performance. For example, I modify stances so that targets to my left are visible. That means my head, my torso, and my arms are not going to be exactly where they're "supposed" to be. It's a small but real difference. This doesn't mean the technique is any less effective, but it does mean that I'll always score lower. Were I trying to make the US Poomsae team, this would matter.

Since none of us are perfect, then it must be admited that when we test we're only performing "close enough" to the ideal. I think that if the student can reach the level of "close enough" then they earn the rank. If they cannot, then they don't. A person who cannot kick probably cannot earn a black belt in TKD. That doesn't make them any less worthy as a person.

 

[Kong Soo Do]

In a nutshell if you have a mentally/physically disabled person as a student, can they reach a black belt in your school if they are unable to perform to the standards like non disabled students can?

This is an excellent question Jeremy, thank you for posting it. I think the answer will ultimately depend upon the focus and/or goals of the school. If the school is sport, as an example, and the focus is competition-based then someone physically/mentally challenged 'may' not be able to compete within the scope of the contest. They 'may' not be able to do what is required at the BB level. However, if the focus is towards SD, then perhaps yes.

As far as SD, I can answer only for my own school with authority. Our sole purpose is SD (and the aspects that are involved with SD). With this in mind, we do not teach cookie-cutter forms without application explanation i.e. we don't follow a 'learn a form-get a new belt' methodology. Our sole form is taught with the goal of in-depth application for every movement. The strengths of the individual student are addressed, which means by default that the weaknesses are addressed as well. The form is tailored to each student individually based on those strengths and weaknesses.

Let me use an example; Tom and Jerry are both MSK KSD students. Tom blew out his knee in the military jumping out of perfectly good airplanes (a little military humor). He walks with a limp. He isn't able to always put full weight on that leg. The weather may affect the injury. As a result, Tom just isn't a good kicker. So we tailor the MSK form to his strengths from a SD perspective. Tom is built like a fire plug and if he gets a hand on you then he can wrap you up and put you in a shoe box. He can fight inside a phone booth. Jerry on the other hand has limited use in his right shoulder due to a rotatory cuff injury. As a result, he's not real adept at grappling or throwing someone. Stuff that requires some strength and leverage. But Jerry can kick a quarter out of someone's hand and leave fifteen cents change. Well, we tailor the MSK form to fit his needs. Can both reach BB and beyond? Yes, given that they fully utilize what they have to work with and can effectively defend themselves against a realworld, violent threat.

For us, it isn't about 'pretty', it's about results against a resisting attacker.

 

[shesulsa]

Rank progression at my school goes: White - Orange - Yellow - Green - Purple - Blue - Brown - Red - Half-red/half-black - Black. Younger children learn an abbreviated syllabus in each rank so they run in junior color ranks up to Jr. Black.

I have a 12-year-old autistic student who is currently ranked at Junior Blue, decided rank. He requires repetitive correction in things like techniques, but does pretty darn well at grappling, jousting and touch-sparring despite his tactile sensitivity. He can pass his jok sul (kicking combination test) in under 3 seconds. His memory is improving and he's starting to remember more material than just the rank he's in.

He is still making progress all the time, so I'm keeping the potential for full rank on the table at this point.

I anticipate having to decide the litmus test (if you will) factor as to whether he will be full or decided rank.

I think it may come down to whether he can make use of his knowledge to help himself and whether he can control his emotions and impulses to keep his abilities at bay when appropriate. I can say right now I really want to see his physical ability continue to improve, his memory continue to expand and his self-control to improve. Pie-in-the-sky goal is for him to be able to share his knowledge with someone else - adequately teach some basic skills to another student - and have some decent level of discussion on tactics.

That's just me and my student. I'm frankly not impressed with what other styles call black belt, but from a progression standpoint, I guess I can see it. I would proffer this consideration: if a 5-year-old can have a black rank, why can't this young man? :lol2:

 

[Instructor]

For what it's worth I would rather have one disabled student who always attends class and gives me his or her all than ten healthy people who drift in and out of class and then quit after three months.

Black Belt isn't just about demonstrating techniques it's about the person and their will and attitude. The spirit to overcome counts for a lot.

 

[Twin Fist]

you dont graduate from college cuz you tried hard.

you graduate by achieving success and passing the minimium standards.

I treat rank the same way.

there is a minimum standard of ability that is required.

otherwise? thats what honorary belts are for

Black Belt isn't just about demonstrating techniques it's about the person and their will and attitude. The spirit to overcome counts for a lot.

 

[Gnarlie]

What about if the person can't do all the things that an able bodied person can do (for example, physical limitations around high kicking and running), but could still beat the snot out of an equivalent graded able bodied person? Do they get a Dan grade? Where is the line?

 

[Dirty Dog]

I came up with another example.

Look at my avatar. I think that's a pretty fair kick from a worn out tired old fat man, landed on a 1st Dan 30 years my junior. But, clearly, my left hand/arm position would be considered less than ideal. Why? Because I had a broken hand at the time, and was in a cast. Keeping that arm out of the way was safest for both myself and my opponent. And good practice, since in a self defense situation, you can't necessarily stop because of an injury.

If adapting to the disability can be done while maintaining effectiveness, then we're back to "close enough".

 

[dancingalone]

What about if the person can't do all the things that an able bodied person can do (for example, physical limitations around high kicking and running), but could still beat the snot out of an equivalent graded able bodied person? Do they get a Dan grade? Where is the line?

Sparring and/or fighting ability trumps a lot of other things in my book. In the end, we are looking for the application of all this stuff we practice right? If so, the ability to USE what we learn is the highest measure there is.

 

[Gnarlie]

I used to have a student with a detached retina in one eye. He was very agile, and could always beat me in sparring unless I deliberately took advantage of the blind spot. Which of course, I did, and because of that he adapted over time to beat me anyway. I'm working on new advantages for next time I visit . He's just got his first dan.

 

[Twin Fist]

proof is in the puddling

 

[Gnarlie]

Sparring and/or fighting ability trumps a lot of other things in my book. In the end, we are looking for the application of all this stuff we practice right? If so, the ability to USE what we learn is the highest measure there is.

Totally agree, I was asking Twin Fist, who I thought had taken the hard line, but maybe not judging from his second post.

Can someone who can't kick do TKD if they are great with their hand techniques and can use them as effectively as a kicker can kick?

 

[Restita D.]

For what it's worth I would rather have one disabled student who always attends class and gives me his or her all than ten healthy people who drift in and out of class and then quit after three months.

Black Belt isn't just about demonstrating techniques it's about the person and their will and attitude. The spirit to overcome counts for a lot.

I wholeheartedly agree. Does "black belt" only mean "physically capable with all limbs, faculties, and senses? " I think not. I've had many physically capable students quit after a few months of hard work, while less capable or very challenged people stick around each and every day working their button off to learn to perform forms, techniques and self protection in a way that works effectively for *them* while still trying to keep a certain standard of posture, intention, or power.

-Restita

 

[lifespantkd]

Valuing Taekwondo only for its physical aspects is, for some and quite naturally and understandably, the result of viewing an Eastern martial art through the lense of a Western worldview. When viewed through the lense of an Eastern worldview--the original paradigm in which Taekwondo and other Eastern martial arts are grounded--Taekwondo can be seen to be a holistic physical-mental-spiritual path of human development. In the context of the original Eastern worldview, a high level of physical development in Taekwondo is a grossly inadequate marker of success if that physical skill is not accompanied by a sincere commitment to mental and spiritual development. Through the course of a lifetime, the capacity to continue to develop in non-physical ways persists much longer, on average, than the capacity to maintain a high level of physical ability. When Taekwondo is valued only for its physical aspects, it can only be practiced by an elite few for a relatively small portion of their lifetimes. When it is valued for its physical-mental-spiritual aspects, it can be practiced by almost anyone throughout the lifespan. In this view, success is not found just in the "doing" of physical techniques and rank attainment. It is also found in the mental and spiritual "being" and "becoming" of the practitioner.

Peace,

Cynthia

 

[Twin Fist]

absolutely

it is tae KWON do

if they can kick knee high thats good enough for me. Plus, the end result is, can they fight? as long as they can fight, i can forgive a LOT

Totally agree, I was asking Twin Fist, who I thought had taken the hard line, but maybe not judging from his second post.

Can someone who can't kick do TKD if they are great with their hand techniques and can use them as effectively as a kicker can kick?

 

[Steve]

Great thread. This is a topic I'm interested in, and while it's in the TKD area, it seems that there are many issues that transcend style.

I've commented on similar threads before, and I will always fall back on my experience working as a professional with folks who are disabled. I've had supervisors who were blind, had peers who were disabled in many different ways, and have also been a supervisor for employees with various disabilities: blindness, deafness, as well as physical disabilities.

These experiences have shaped my opinions, but they've also helped me clarify and simplify the issue.

The key for me is to carefully identify what's really important. As Brad Pitt said in Moneyball, "Guys. We're asking the wrong questions." The question isn't whether you should or shouldn't compromise your standards by awarding rank to someone who doesn't qualify. Clearly, I believe, the answer is self evident. You should not.

The real question is, "What's are the critical, requisite skills and attributes needed to earn a black belt (at your school)?"

As others have already noted, no two people have the same skills or talents. Everyone is already starting off different. So, in the band of human interaction and ability, where are the lines drawn?

I'd recommend that in order to really get to the root of this issue and begin to fix it, we start by defining standards, and then distinguishing these standards from the means by which we measure success in these standards.

For example, in BJJ, the standard for earning a blue belt could be "a demonstrable foundation in BJJ techniques." This isn't very specific, and that's the idea. Standards are guides, and should be pretty much iron clad. But if overly defined, they can be limiting and result in situations where you risk compromising your standards unnecessarily.

Measures ARE specific. So, a demonstrable foundation in BJJ techniques can be reflected in a number of specific ways. I'm not as flexible as some, so upside down guard isn't a place I often find myself, but I can discuss tactics and strategies. I can execute techniques in sparring. While gold eludes me, I've got a few silver medals under my belt from competition. I have earned a blue belt, and I've gone on to earn a purple belt. While my jiu jitsu looks different than others', and there are techniques I can't do that others can, the standard is consistent.

I don't have a lot of time to really flesh out what I'm thinking, but hopefully, you guys get the idea. It's about distinguishing the standards from the measurements of those standards. It's about the spirit or intent of a rank, and the myriad of ways in which that spirit or intent can be demonstrated or judged.

 

[Steve]

you dont graduate from college cuz you tried hard.

you graduate by achieving success and passing the minimium standards.

I treat rank the same way.

there is a minimum standard of ability that is required.

otherwise? thats what honorary belts are for

But in college, there are accommodations made. The key isn't to compromise standards. In college, a deaf student can have an interpreter. If the measure of success in a math class is the ability to learn and execute the math functions being taught, and the student is being unnecessarily handicapped not by their impairment, but by the mechanism of instruction, then the student could fail for reasons unrelated to the standards of the school.

Say there's a student in a wheelchair unable to enter the lecture hall because there is no ramp and he can't navigate the stairs. It's pretty clear that the student will fail the class if he can't attend the lectures. But is he failing due to his disability? I'd argue not, and that the reason for his failure is a fundamental misunderstanding of the true nature of the standards for the school. In this example, we haven't even allowed the student the opportunity to meet the standards.

In the same way, a martial arts school has standards, but are folks with impairments failing to meet the standards due to their impairment or due to your inability or unwillingness to accommodate their impairment.