"classic" martial art vs "modern" martial arts

[isshinryuronin37 37]

I’ve never once used a square stance (shiko dachi) in Shotokan even though it does exist, but in Seibukan it essentially replaces the front stance which maybe gets used 10-20% of the time.

Shiko dachi (seiunchin stance) does NOT replace the forward stance. They serve different purposes.

.You’ll also notice that the punches are a little closer to Isshinryu.
Not quite a tate tsuki, but stopping short of a full fist rotation.

Kyan Chotoku taught a punch twisted about a quarter turn (and perhaps a full vertical for some applications) though mostly horizontal was the general rule. Seibukan's and Isshinryu's founders both studied under him. However, the latter changed to mostly full vertical, a very controversial innovation at the time, along with a more snapping than thrusting execution.

 

[Kung Fu Wang148 178]

What's the most important power generation?

1. You and your opponent stay 6 feet apart.
2. You have to step in, punch on his face, and knock him down.

In order to satisfy 1 and 2, how many different power generation methods exist on this planet?

 

[BorntoRaiseHell]

From

- leg -> hip is an upward motion.
- hip -> arm is a forward motion.

Is there another way of doing this? I don't think so. Can you apply this power generation method in all MA systems? I believe you can.

If you train for "health", you don't need to learn power generation. If you can knock your opponent down with your punch, your power generation is good no matter which style your power generation may come from.

I have seen people who brings:

- Baji Fajin into praying mantis system.
- While crane Fajin into Yang Taiji system.

Both look very good to me.

Looks funny

 

[Same Trick93 44]

How long did you personally train in wado ryu?

Oh, no I never studied Wado-ryu but 20+ years in Shotokan(JKA)

 

[Same Trick93 44]

Yes, his peer and rival, Shotokan’s Enoeda sensei 8th Dan used to do the same, like nodding pigeons! Enoeda was particularly noddy when kicking! Reminds me of champion marathon runner, Paula Radcliffe!

The other thing they both did was flare their elbows out from their sides when punching to create a whipping motion which is contrary to all teaching. I didn’t like that either although I did once see a Karate Nerd video where he suggested that movement was a simultaneous punch and block as used in Okinawa (The birth place of Koroddy).

The best puncher/kicker I ever saw was Sugasawa Fumio. He was incredible when I last saw him and only a 4th Dan too!

Yes I know, I guess it (the nodding) was something many of that generation regardless of style of Japanese karate did.

I correct myself about seeing the Seisan performed by “ohtsuka the younger”, that was not the son but the grandson Kazutaka Otsuka I meant, I liked that performance

 

[Same Trick93 44]

Yes, his peer and rival, Shotokan’s Enoeda sensei 8th Dan used to do the same, like nodding pigeons! Enoeda was particularly noddy when kicking! Reminds me of champion marathon runner, Paula Radcliffe!

The other thing they both did was flare their elbows out from their sides when punching to create a whipping motion which is contrary to all teaching. I didn’t like that either although I did once see a Karate Nerd video where he suggested that movement was a simultaneous punch and block as used in Okinawa (The birth place of Koroddy).

The best puncher/kicker I ever saw was Sugasawa Fumio. He was incredible when I last saw him and only a 4th Dan too!

.
Yes, the elbow out thing I was going to mention regarding T.Zuzukis empi kata performance , there could be that thought of simultaneously block-strike, it’s a thing in certain chines wushu, the thought is the whole forearm from elbow to knuckles is a fist.
The elbow down while punching creates another kind of force in the strike

 

[Same Trick93 44]

This sounds like a reprint of another article, some of which I have read elsewhere. Is this a bot, or just plagiarism?

He copied from the Shotokai info site I previously linked to, he should have put the link in the post

 

[BorntoRaiseHell]

He copied from the Shotokai info site I previously linked to, he should have put the link in the post

Guy called me a "Bot" or something... what a plum

 

[Gyakuto148 157]

A plum and a bot! Let’s hope they dont interbreed into a plot/blum!

 

[gspell68]

Shiko dachi (seiunchin stance) does NOT replace the forward stance. They serve different purposes.

Kyan Chotoku taught a punch twisted about a quarter turn (and perhaps a full vertical for some applications) though mostly horizontal was the general rule. Seibukan's and Isshinryu's founders both studied under him. However, the latter changed to mostly full vertical, a very controversial innovation at the time, along with a more snapping than thrusting execution.

I really like the idea of Isshinryu forearm blocks where both bones absorb a strike, too.
That was probably pretty innovative as well.

 

[gspell68]

Yes I know, I guess it (the nodding) was something many of that generation regardless of style of Japanese karate did.

I correct myself about seeing the Seisan performed by “ohtsuka the younger”, that was not the son but the grandson Kazutaka Otsuka I meant, I liked that performance

Yeah.
I’ve seen several guys who started in the 60’ and ‘70 who do a weird thing where they lead with the hips and then the upper body catches up.
I’m not certain it’s a good thing or not.
I do know that the one dude that did it the most had one of the most incredible punches I’ve ever seen… or felt.
My sternum still pops after 40 years!
He barely even touched me but the power goes through you like a shock wave.
I cannot remember if he did the elbow whip thing or not but he had incredible control.
My teacher was his best friend and he said years earlier his friend was playing around sparring with another guy.
Right after they stopped, the guy started breathing funny, then blacked out.
They took him away in an ambulance.
I can’t remember if they said he had bruised or broken ribs, but of the guys sparring said he never made contact.

I do a little bit of the elbow whip thingee during the rising punches in Enpi.
It just feels right!

Another thing you’ll see old timers do, like Enoeda, is drop the hand on the side that they are kicking on, but we got yelled at for doing that.

 

[isshinryuronin37 37]

I really like the idea of Isshinryu forearm blocks where both bones absorb a strike, too.
That was probably pretty innovative as well.

Shimabuku T.'s changes were very controversial. A number of his students, including his younger brother, Eizo, left and returned to their Shorinryu roots, Eizo becoming a master in his own right. His agility was off the charts.

 

[Gyakuto148 157]

I really like the idea of Isshinryu forearm blocks where both bones absorb a strike, too.
That was probably pretty innovative as well.

I’ve been seeing quite a bit if Isshin Ryu on Youtube for some reason. I saw this kind of thing and thought ‘WTF’ then thought after a few moments, ‘Oh it’s actually a really good idea’!

 

[isshinryuronin37 37]

I’ve been seeing quite a bit if Isshin Ryu on Youtube for some reason. I saw this kind of thing and thought ‘WTF’ then thought after a few moments, ‘Oh it’s actually a really good idea’!

Also, the forearm muscle becomes part of the contact surface, which when developed by kote kiai (arm conditioning) can absorb/deliver a good impact.

 

[Same Trick93 44]

I really like the idea of Isshinryu forearm blocks where both bones absorb a strike, too.
That was probably pretty innovative as well.

That kind of blocking is present in Chinese Changquan(long fist) styles,.
Also the vertical/standing fist is common in Chinese wushu.
Isshin-ryu founder might just have taken inspiration from Chinese sources, a traditional Okinawan approach .

 

[drop bear147 22]

That is absolutely not what those words mean.

Interestingly, I was watching a DEVGRU operator teach CQB/shooting technique. It was literally ALL kata. It amazes me how drastically misapplied that word is by 'modern/mma' fanboys. They don't seem to realise that virtually all of their learning is done through kata..

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Gun trainers are moving away from the kata idea. For kind of the same reason everyone else did.

(Don’t get sooky. I am specifically talking about kata as fighting. Not as development)

 

[Gyakuto148 157]

When a colleague went to Naha to visit a stem cell facility, he noticed that the staff preparing cells and cultures etc performed exactly the same movements and finger pointing at reagents, Gilson pipettes etc. He asked what they were doing and was told it was ‘stem cell culture kata’. The implementation of this kata reduced mistakes to virtually zero. Shinkansen train drivers do similar safety kata in the cockpit of their bullet trains and we all know how safe and reliable trains are in Japan!

Kata are a great way of ingraining precise procedures, whether they’re to do with setting up and delivering fighting techniques to driving 200mph trains. They’re laborious, Westerners find them dull, but they work. I’d’ve thought gun handling procedure would lend itself to this idea too.

 

[Same Trick93 44]

soon the will be +20 stem cell katas, kyu and dan gradings, competitions between the many stem cell ryu-ha

 

[Gyakuto148 157]

soon the will be +20 stem cell katas, kyu and dan gradings, competitions between the many stem cell ryu-ha

I nearly posted the same comment!

 

[Gyakuto148 157]

Of course, the original Naha school is the best. It’s primacy and age make it so. They never lift the Gilson pipette above the waist because that doesn’t make sense