Why is their so much disrespect for Karate? And what can we do to stop it?

jobo

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No, this is what I said: "I told you, I don't know a single person whose first ever real fight took place as an adult..."

Let me rephrase that, since you're having trouble understanding: someone who has only fought as an adult, but never as a child. I don't know any such people. Is that better?



That's not how it works. If you're going to accuse me of something, then it's your responsibility to prove it. Don't want the responsibility? Then don't make the accusation.
I havent accused you of anything, so far, though I am tempted to suggest your a bit challenged
as youve now quoted the quote that contradicts your subsequent logic and cant see I the contradiction

oh well, horse to water and all that

it's a lovely sunny evening here and I'm on a river bank in the middle of nowhere, so il leave you to ponder the proposition and see if Dawns on you,
 
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Urban Trekker

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I havent accused you of anything, so far, though I am tempted to suggest your a bit challenged
as youve now quoted the quote that contradicts your subsequent logic and cant see I the contradiction

oh well, horse to water and all that

Jesus H. Christ, man...
 

Tez3

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LOL, no. Only someone who lacks real fighting experience would say this. A real fight never goes the way a sparring session does.

If your kwoon has you guys donning MMA gloves and getting into the cage, then I'll give you that. Anything short of that isn't gonna cut the mustard.


You haven't seen our sparring sessions.
When our students fight it goes to plan always because the plan is to be prepared for everything and anything.

Our students fight in the cage and on the mats, they fight quite often when they're out on a night and their 'day' job means they are trained to be ready to fight at any time. :D
 

Tez3

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Football (soccer) hooligans? Antifa members? Proud boys? Violent subcultures( like skinheads, mods, punks)? Biker gang members? Kimbo Slice from backyards fight times? Ordinary assholes who like to fight when drunk? Jesus, even "west side story" is about street violence.
I was antifa guy (SHARP) skinhead when I was 16-21. More than 50 fights, scuffles, scrimmages from 1:1 to 100:100. Empty handed or with both sides armed with bats, knives, chains, knuckle dusters etc. Really a lot of experience without any martial arts training.
Experience does not make anybody skilled fighter. Experience makes people calm, makes people good tactician, helps people no to make stupid things, removes tunel vision but it is not the best way to learn new skills.

With a lot of luck :)


Without bringing politics into this you haven't the slightest idea what Antifa is so please don't bring your own definitions into this.
 

Graywalker

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LOL, no. Only someone who lacks real fighting experience would say this. A real fight never goes the way a sparring session does.

If your kwoon has you guys donning MMA gloves and getting into the cage, then I'll give you that. Anything short of that isn't gonna cut the mustard.
I would agree, if your experience is strictly in a gym sparring and you have no real world experience (ring experience, imo is not real world experience)...it is very hard for me to respect your opinion or even take your advice seriously.
 

Graywalker

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As for stopping the disrespectful attitude towards Karate. I have found that a majority of people who do, have no idea concerning what Karate is..
 

Cynik75

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Without bringing politics into this you haven't the slightest idea what Antifa is so please don't bring your own definitions into this.
Sorry for OT but: "Antifa" is so wide term that many different social phenomenons and groups fit into this. And I am pretty sure I know way better than you what and who was Antifa 25-30 years ago and what and who is now in central Europe.
 

Graywalker

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Interesting enough, the MA did not teach me how to fight, it taught me how to think in a fight. You do not need training to be a successful fighter, experience will definitely give you that. But, it does help to organize your fighting method.
 

Buka

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The real question is why is there so much disrespect for each other on this forum and what can we do to stop it?

If some of you ever trained in a real dojo and had the attitudes and bad manners you display here you would get your ash handed to you in a broken lunch pail.
 

isshinryuronin

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The real question is why is there so much disrespect for each other on this forum and what can we do to stop it?

If some of you ever trained in a real dojo and had the attitudes and bad manners you display here you would get your ash handed to you in a broken lunch pail.

So much back and forth on the efficacy of what this art or that art teaches, TMA vs MMA in a fight, and so on. One thing TMA does usually teach is a code of conduct. Respect, humility, and the way one carries oneself. This is inherent in the training at a good TMA dojo.

While I have been somewhat critical of the evolution of karate this past century, one good thing to come out of this evolution IMO has been the development of the "way," the "do" in karate-do. Self-discipline and respect are not only expected in a "real dojo," but as Buka elegantly points out, strongly enforced. This shift from karate-"jitsu" to karate-do did little, if anything, to directly improve fighting ability. But it has the potential to improve something perhaps more important - one's self and the community at large.

Even before this shift, Matsumura Sokon (b.1809) embodied this concept in his "Seven Virtues of Bu" (warrior arts.) Trained in combat from horseback, an expert with the sword and staff, and a master of empty hand combat, he served three Okinawan kings as a security agent and bodyguard. Real life-death combat was his profession! Yet, he recognized that MA should be more than just fighting.
 

gpseymour

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From Dictionary.com:



The people in those videos were either legit trying to KO each other at worst, or knowingly proceeding in such a way that could lead to a KO at best. Maybe they don't need sparring gear, but what they were doing is not consistent with the definition of sparring.
Dictionaries are meant to report usage, not control it. Most folks around here understand the difference between heavy and light sparring.
 

gpseymour

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yes but that's what sparing can be, it only you that wants to put a play fight defintion on it as it fits your view

in championship boxing for instance sparring is what they do to prepare for a contest, they arnt gently tapping each other, it would be pointless in the extreme if they were

the only difference between sparring and the contest is sparring doesnt get them a belt.

when I spar with a couple of lads at the dojo, the rules are simple ,move your head or get knocked over
You must really be enjoying the irony of someone trying to force upon you a definition they prefer, rather than working with a generally acceptable usage.
 

Urban Trekker

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Dictionaries are meant to report usage, not control it. Most folks around here understand the difference between heavy and light sparring.

I'm past arguing what was meant by the word. In fact, I stated that if they call what was in those videos "sparring," then they should fare decently against one who is experienced but untrained.

But the same cannot be said of those who lack experience and only spar according to the dictionary definition of it.

Capisci?
 

jobo

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I'm past arguing what was meant by the word. In fact, I stated that if they call what was in those videos "sparring," then they should fare decently against one who is experienced but untrained.

But the same cannot be said of those who lack experience and only spar according to the dictionary definition of it.

Capisci?
you do know that dictionaries seldom agree
 

jobo

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You must really be enjoying the irony of someone trying to force upon you a definition they prefer, rather than working with a generally acceptable usage.
no he is working by the general ( public) usage, im requiring a more accurate ma specific definition coz well we are ma discussing ma and it seems appropriate to do so

i don't care what definition people use as long as i cant hear or see, I'm very considerate like that
 

jobo

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I'm clearly dealing with someone who lacks social skills. But I learned that days ago.
well your dealing with someone who thinks your opinion is of no importance, when i am deploying my social skill i pretend it is,,,,, though admittedly not very well usually, but it is hard to fake when someone is talking nonsense
 
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