What makes a Martial Art?????

[IWishToLearn]

I propose that Exile, Flying Crane, Xue Sheng and I form a cranky-yet-heroic band known as "The Four Cynical Curmudgeons". We can travel the Intrawebs fighting naivete and squashing innocent enthusiasm wherever it rears its head. We can have cool names like "Feet of Clay" and "Captain Verbosity" and RantGirl (or RantBoy depending).

LAUGHS!

 

[Flying Crane]

I propose that Exile, Flying Crane, Xue Sheng and I form a cranky-yet-heroic band known as "The Four Cynical Curmudgeons". We can travel the Intrawebs fighting naivete and squashing innocent enthusiasm wherever it rears its head. We can have cool names like "Feet of Clay" and "Captain Verbosity" and RantGirl (or RantBoy depending).

actually, to keep it in the spirit of the Hong Kong kung fu flicks, I think we would have to call ourselves "The Four HEROIC Cynical Curmudgeons."

 

[Xue Sheng]

actually, to keep it in the spirit of the Hong Kong kung fu flicks, I think we would have to call ourselves "The Four HEROIC Cynical Curmudgeons."

That works for me....just as long as when we talk what we say and what it looks like we are saying are 2 ENTIRELY different things.

 

[Monadnock]

'Martial Art' is an American term as can be seen by the English letters used to display it on your computer screen. It probably popped up sometime in the states in the early 20th century and referred to whatever Japanese or Okinawan systems had first crossed over the pond.

Today it's a term we use to lump together the practice of Karate, Judo, Kempo, system-of-the-month, what-have-you. When you look at the different martial systems of the world, it would be best to look at them from their own languages to better understand where they come from.

Read up on a little of Dave Lowry's works if you are interested in the closest Japanese tranlation of 'martial arts'...being Bu Jutsu. You'll find that looking at the meaning of Bu Jutsu, Mr. Lowry has separated Karate from being a Martial Art to a system of self defense.

But this has little to do with Karate's effectiveness and more to do with consistent and accurate terminology. To the original post, I think in America, Martial Art has come to mean a system of armed or unarmed fighting designed for self defense and we use it to describe almost all systems here today. (Look at MMA).

There's always going to be shades of gray and people who will say, well, so-and-so-art really isn't a martial art. I'm one of them. You just have to get the right context to see where they are coming from. For the most part, unless you are talking to a hoplologist or serious practitioner of some classical system, Martial Art will get the point of what you do across to almost any non-practitioner in the US. When speaking to each other, we should be more precise.

 

[kingkong89]

being a true martial artist takes time, like anything else there is a lot of learning involved but the most important thing to learn is RESPECT, without it someone who can do all these amazing moves is not a true martial artist.

 

[tellner]

To see the answers to your post, take a look at the last couple dozen letters on this thread. I'm afraid your assertion doesn't cut much ice when examined closely or historically...

 

[exile]

actually, to keep it in the spirit of the Hong Kong kung fu flicks, I think we would have to call ourselves "The Four HEROIC Cynical Curmudgeons."

Works for me!! ... And definitely, let's keep HEROIC in capital letters, eh? :lol:

 

[Xue Sheng]

"Four HEROIC Cynical Curmudgeons."

Now in my signature.. Thanks

 

[Flying Crane]

"Four HEROIC Cynical Curmudgeons."

Now in my signature.. Thanks

I like that. I think I'll have to add it to mine as well. Good move.

 

[Flying Crane]

Done!

 

[exile]

I like that. I think I'll have to add it to mine as well. Good move.

Well, if it's good enough for you guys....

 

[Langenschwert]

To me, a Martial Art is a systemized method of combat, nothing more or less. The systemization is an attempt to make the essentially chaotic nature of combat more predictable, thereby increasing the combatant's chances of victory. It was born when the first hominid figured out to bash in a rival's head with a rock. This thread has already mentioned the etymology of the term as the "Arts of War". The first written usage of the term "Martial Art" in the English language is a 17th Century Rapier manual entitled Pallas Armata, which refers to the "noble Martial Art of fencing". Prior to this, combat arts were known in the West as the "Arts of Mars" (the Roman God of War). So not only are koryu jiu-jutsu, FMA, and Italian Rapier all Martial Arts, so is archery, firearms use, or for that matter (my favourite example), piloting a fighter jet in combat. It's just a matter of the machine you're using to perform the Martial Art, whether merely the body or a weapon. A sword is after all, a machine with one moving part. Anybody who's seen pistol expert Todd Jarett would be hard pressed to not call him a Martial Artist of the highest calibre.

Best regards,

-Mark

 

[tellner]

Xue Sheng, Flying Crane, Exile:

If you guys photos of yourselves or representative images I'd like to make an appropriate piece of artwork. Your martial tradition wouldn't be amiss either. PM or email, please. Also, if you want to go by a particular secret identity like "Colonel Bombast" or "Knouter of Deceased Equids" that would help.

 

[JBrainard]

actually, to keep it in the spirit of the Hong Kong kung fu flicks, I think we would have to call ourselves "The Four HEROIC Cynical Curmudgeons."

With respect to Hong Kong kung fu flicks, I would have suggested "The Four Cynical Curmudgeons of Death."
But this is only a most humble suggestion, as I would NEVER tell "The Four" how to do anything, as they are omnipotent and could squash my insignificant intelect with but a stern look...

 

[terryl965]

Maybe this has been said maybe not but a bottle of whiskey and a couple cases of beer and who knows what can be consider an Art

 

[Xue Sheng]

With respect to Hong Kong kung fu flicks, I would have suggested "The Four Cynical Curmudgeons of Death."
But this is only a most humble suggestion, as I would NEVER tell "The Four" how to do anything, as they are omnipotent and could squash my insignificant intelect with but a stern look...

Don't make me look sternly upon you :mst: :uhyeah:

 

[JBrainard]

Don't make me look sternly upon you :mst: :uhyeah:

:lfao:
Sorry, I can't keep a strait face to save my life

 

[exile]

The first written usage of the term "Martial Art" in the English language is a 17th Century Rapier manual entitled Pallas Armata, which refers to the "noble Martial Art of fencing".

Very interesting, Mark... I've wondered from time to time just where the phrase originated. It has a kind of archaic feel to it... thanks for the info!

Xue Sheng, Flying Crane, Exile:

If you guys photos of yourselves or representative images I'd like to make an appropriate piece of artwork. Your martial tradition wouldn't be amiss either. PM or email, please. Also, if you want to go by a particular secret identity like "Colonel Bombast" or "Knouter of Deceased Equids" that would help.

Todd, I'll see what I can find. For some reason, the only secret identities I've been able to come up with are monikers like `Thorkill Skullsplitter' and other Vikingish names for people who were unquestionably homocidal psychopaths in the 12th c. or thereabouts, so I probably need to rethink the possibilities... but thanks for the invitation; will let you know once something a little less horrifying comes to mind! My martial traidition is Song Moo Kwan TKD.

With respect to Hong Kong kung fu flicks, I would have suggested "The Four Cynical Curmudgeons of Death."
But this is only a most humble suggestion, as I would NEVER tell "The Four" how to do anything, as they are omnipotent and could squash my insignificant intelect with but a stern look...

Actually, JB, I prefer to think of us as the Four Heroic Cynical Curmudgeons of Terminally Accurate Argumentation... but `Death' is shorter and the result is pretty much the same, eh ? :EG:

Guys, let's go find that Free French garrison... I think this is the beginning of a beautiful friendship!

 

[Flying Crane]

For some reason, the only secret identities I've been able to come up with are monikers like `Thorkill Skullsplitter' and other Vikingish names for people who were unquestionably homocidal psychopaths in the 12th c. or thereabouts, so I probably need to rethink the possibilities... but thanks for the invitation; will let you know once something a little less horrifying comes to mind! My martial traidition is Song Moo Kwan TKD.

Hmmm... I was sort of thinking of something like Checker of Reality, or Smasher of Myths...

since Man Who Walks With No Shadow Under The Moon has already been taken...

 

[Xue Sheng]

I just don't know... there are so many possibilities

- Captain Pentothal the Truth Finder
- Lord Axiom the Truth Keeper
- Mr Misanthropic the Displeased
- Ace Acrimonious the Captious
- Ace Aporetic the Incredulous