The rant thread

Rich Parsons

A Student of Martial Arts
Founding Member
Lifetime Supporting Member
MTS Alumni
Joined
Oct 13, 2001
Messages
16,618
Reaction score
955
Location
Michigan
Under my jurisdiction, I have the lawful authority to detain people for up to six hours while waiting for the police. As long as I've seen the crime being committed with my own eyes - no sweat.

BTW, that mp3 player cost more than a hundred dollars.

More than $100 is usually a felony. That changes things as well.

I was not arguing with you, only stating that someone who knows what they can do and are allowed to do, should execute such actions. Otherwise they might end up in court for legal reasons.
 

jks9199

Administrator
Staff member
Lifetime Supporting Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2006
Messages
23,026
Reaction score
3,344
Location
Northern VA
More than $100 is usually a felony. That changes things as well.

I was not arguing with you, only stating that someone who knows what they can do and are allowed to do, should execute such actions. Otherwise they might end up in court for legal reasons.
Dangerous assumption, there...

The dollar value for felony vs. misdemeanor larceny is wildly variable. In VA, it's $200, but I know that in other states it's as high as $500 (and maybe more), and I recall hearing as low as $50. There's no rhyme or reason.

It sounds like Nimravus knows his job. I'd encourage him to wear some sort of visible ID, or put his badge on a chain -- but also to be careful. His brief summary hear almost could be interpreted as being impersonation in VA. (I arrested a guard for impersonation and domestic assault once; when someone tried to intervene in the struggle between him and his daughter, he showed his badge trying to keep the good Samaritan from calling us...)
 

Grey Eyed Bandit

Master of Arts
Joined
Mar 14, 2004
Messages
1,503
Reaction score
49
Location
MAP Hell
I'd encourage him to wear some sort of visible ID, or put his badge on a chain --

It's actually a card, and not really a badge per se.

In any case, the two plain clothes cops who showed up seemed to understand exactly what was going on, which is more than can be said about anyone else present at the scene.
 

jks9199

Administrator
Staff member
Lifetime Supporting Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2006
Messages
23,026
Reaction score
3,344
Location
Northern VA
It's actually a card, and not really a badge per se.

In any case, the two plain clothes cops who showed up seemed to understand exactly what was going on, which is more than can be said about anyone else present at the scene.
You were lucky, and I'd half suspect that they were on a mall detail of some sort. And I wasn't trying to imply you did anything wrong; just warning of a potential pitfall.

I'm currently in a plainclothes assignment. Working plainclothes law enforcement or security has certain inherent risks; people don't know who you are like they do if you're in uniform. If I'm dealing with someone, and a uniformed cop rolls up on us, I expect to be proned out until my ID is sorted out and confirmed. The simple rule is do what the folks in uniform say!
 

Brian R. VanCise

MT Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Sep 9, 2004
Messages
27,758
Reaction score
1,518
Location
Las Vegas, Nevada
You were lucky, and I'd half suspect that they were on a mall detail of some sort. And I wasn't trying to imply you did anything wrong; just warning of a potential pitfall.

I'm currently in a plainclothes assignment. Working plainclothes law enforcement or security has certain inherent risks; people don't know who you are like they do if you're in uniform. If I'm dealing with someone, and a uniformed cop rolls up on us, I expect to be proned out until my ID is sorted out and confirmed. The simple rule is do what the folks in uniform say!

I have been in this field and I must say that you need to make sure you have ID to present and or visible when necessary. (definately the way to go in my book) Definately this can alleviate some problems. Listen to jks9199 as he has some really sound advice here.

On the side though I am glad everything worked out.
icon14.gif
 

Grey Eyed Bandit

Master of Arts
Joined
Mar 14, 2004
Messages
1,503
Reaction score
49
Location
MAP Hell
I've been thinking about whether or not I should have tossed the mp3 player up the stairs so that I'd at least have one hand free. As long as the thief's in custody, the store won't be losing any money from the ordeal, but given the fact that I don't know if the cameras I saw the whole thing through were recording at the time that might have compromised the only available evidence.

Again, the cops knew right away what was going on, and as soon as they intervened I had the opportunity to show my ID to everyone around. And no, they weren't even on duty - they had just stopped for lunch at a nearby caf矇.
 

Rich Parsons

A Student of Martial Arts
Founding Member
Lifetime Supporting Member
MTS Alumni
Joined
Oct 13, 2001
Messages
16,618
Reaction score
955
Location
Michigan
Dangerous assumption, there...

The dollar value for felony vs. misdemeanor larceny is wildly variable. In VA, it's $200, but I know that in other states it's as high as $500 (and maybe more), and I recall hearing as low as $50. There's no rhyme or reason.

It sounds like Nimravus knows his job. I'd encourage him to wear some sort of visible ID, or put his badge on a chain -- but also to be careful. His brief summary hear almost could be interpreted as being impersonation in VA. (I arrested a guard for impersonation and domestic assault once; when someone tried to intervene in the struggle between him and his daughter, he showed his badge trying to keep the good Samaritan from calling us...)


;) I see someone gets my points about assumptions.

It is bad for me to assume that a dollar value is associated with a felony without checking the local laws.

It is bad for others to assume this guy was not kidnapping, for if he was a kidnapper everyone would be upset.

It is bad for people to assume that he is a kidnapper for he was doing his job within authority.
 

Grey Eyed Bandit

Master of Arts
Joined
Mar 14, 2004
Messages
1,503
Reaction score
49
Location
MAP Hell
Someone else whom I relayed the events to asked whether or not the reactions of the onlookers would have been different had I been blonde and/or Caucasian. While my old Brazilian passport from the 80's describes me as "branco", I'm probably not whom most people would look at and think "white".
 

Grey Eyed Bandit

Master of Arts
Joined
Mar 14, 2004
Messages
1,503
Reaction score
49
Location
MAP Hell
New rant, new subject...

What I'm about to say here might be seen as a slam against people of Western origin who have taken up residence in Japan, I apologize for that in advance. Those of you who know your true worth probably also realize that this is not intended towards you.

There's this certain individual in the Bujinkan who left his native country to come and live in Japan somewhere around the early 90's, and who has recently relocated back to the Western hemisphere. His reputation as one of the best the Bujinkan has to offer stretches all around the world, and though I've never trained with him personally (I did however meet him several times in Japan), his teachings heavily influenced the training at my dojo the last year and a half by way of my instructors, particularly in the areas of spear techniques and Kukishinden dakentaijutsu. Admittedly, I've never seen him in action with my own eyes, but if my current teacher says that he's the freakin' man, then as far as I'm concerned he's the freakin' man.

There are two aspects of this individual's persona that continue to fascinate me.
To begin with, it's the ongoing usage of what I as well as others have referred to as a behavioristic approach to training - that is, you work and train hard at something until you *REALLY* have it down. If for instance you're aiming to improve your skills with the jo, you stand there for hours going through all the hits, thrusts, swings and positions. You don't get creative, you don't go off speaking in tongues, you simply keep going in the most literal sense of the word.
This has, according to people who've trained with him, manifested itself in ways that IMO are far too seldomly seen in the Bujinkan - as in the brilliant phrasing: "all right people, drop your swords. None of you can do this yet."

Second, it's what has been relayed to me as one of his personal motivations for leaving Japan. Apparently, he found himself unable to endure the constant physical and mental domination he was subjected to by Hatsumi. Without having even the slightest resemblance of a personal relationship to him myself, after merely having been in the same room as him I can tell that he has somewhat of a powerful and imposing aura around him (this is absolutely not intended as an insult or a form of criticism, just a reflection on his obviously very unusual personality), which I imagine can have a profound effect on the people living around him on a daily basis.

Now, some might try to infer that this unability to cope with Hatsumi's constant presence primarily has to do with the mental constitution of the person in question. And sure, that is a valid standpoint, but I dare you to say it to his face. From my limited perspective, however, it only adds to my perception of him as a sensible and reasonable individual.
This stands in a pretty stark contrast to all the people constantly trying to emulate Hatsumi's movements as well as his method of speech.

What I think this says about a lot of the "Hatsumi hangarounds", for lack of better and more sophisticated wording, is probably best left unsaid.
 

bencole

Green Belt
Joined
Oct 22, 2004
Messages
114
Reaction score
3
Nim,

I'm sorry, but I not quite sure what the takeaway of this "rant" was supposed to be.

So far, I got, "Someone your teacher thinks is good practices things over and over again. One of the reasons this person is leaving Japan is because Hatsumi-sensei can be a dominating presence. This implies something about those who haven't left Japan."

Is this correct?

-ben
 

Grey Eyed Bandit

Master of Arts
Joined
Mar 14, 2004
Messages
1,503
Reaction score
49
Location
MAP Hell
So far, I got, "Someone your teacher thinks is good practices things over and over again.

I'm pretty sure you think he's good too, but yes.

One of the reasons this person is leaving Japan is because Hatsumi-sensei can be a dominating presence. This implies something about those who haven't left Japan."

Is this correct?

This implies something about a certain type of people, yes.
 

bencole

Green Belt
Joined
Oct 22, 2004
Messages
114
Reaction score
3
I'm pretty sure you think he's good too, but yes.

Really? Curious....

I don't think most people are very good. :)

Nimravus said:
This implies something about a certain type of people, yes.

Or that Japan itself demands a certain type of person....

You say this individual went to Japan in the early 1990s. That's over 10 years in Japan!!! To be honest, ten years in Japan can turn anyone batty! It takes a special temperment to live there looooooong term like that.

Moreover, unless you plan to stay there forever or teach Budo the rest of your life, if you actually want to get a job in your home country, you need to go home before the age of 40. It's kinda hard to find a job if you are 40 years old and have *NO* transferrable skills! :) (Note: Employees at Japanese firms become experts at navigating the complexities of their own firm, but that's not helpful if one hopes to work at another firm).

Anyways, it takes a special type of person to live in Japan for ten years. It takes an even more special type of person to settle there permanently.

Moving on only seems natural to me....

-ben
 

shesulsa

Columbia Martial Arts Academy
MT Mentor
Lifetime Supporting Member
MTS Alumni
Joined
May 27, 2004
Messages
27,182
Reaction score
485
Location
Not BC, Not DC
This discussion sounds to me as though it's more a behavioral/personality comment than anything.

I'm not sure that I know to whom you are referring, however sometimes I think people need breaks from each other no matter the relationship. Sometimes really, really long breaks ... with a lot of distance.

And I cannot know the circumstances behind the residence of this individual nor all of the considerations one may normally need to weigh (family, employment, etcetera).

Hmm.

I assume you are expressing your disappointment that this particular individual could or would not continue his tenure at the Bujinkan Dojo in Japan and are lamenting that though this person be a quality traditional instructor, his return to the West signifies his inadequacy.

Is that a correct assumption?
 

Grey Eyed Bandit

Master of Arts
Joined
Mar 14, 2004
Messages
1,503
Reaction score
49
Location
MAP Hell
And I cannot know the circumstances behind the residence of this individual nor all of the considerations one may normally need to weigh (family, employment, etcetera).

It should be noted that family factored into the equation as well, at least that's what I've been told.

I assume you are expressing your disappointment that this particular individual could or would not continue his tenure at the Bujinkan Dojo in Japan and are lamenting that though this person be a quality traditional instructor, his return to the West signifies his inadequacy.
Is that a correct assumption?

No. For some reason it seems as if you missed what I wrote earlier:

Now, some might try to infer that this unability to cope with Hatsumi's constant presence primarily has to do with the mental constitution of the person in question. And sure, that is a valid standpoint, but I dare you to say it to his face. From my limited perspective, however, it only adds to my perception of him as a sensible and reasonable individual.
This stands in a pretty stark contrast to all the people constantly trying to emulate Hatsumi's movements as well as his method of speech.
 

shesulsa

Columbia Martial Arts Academy
MT Mentor
Lifetime Supporting Member
MTS Alumni
Joined
May 27, 2004
Messages
27,182
Reaction score
485
Location
Not BC, Not DC
So, then ... you are lamenting the loss of his presence, perhaps?
 

Bigshadow

Senior Master
MTS Alumni
Joined
Apr 13, 2005
Messages
4,033
Reaction score
45
Location
Saint Cloud, Florida
OKAYYY... I don't really see a rant jumping out and throwing shuriken at me. ;) Was this a rant or an expression of disappointment?
 

Latest Discussions

Top