Striking art strategy

Kung Fu Wang

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Do you use the following strategies in your striking art system?

1. Lead your opponent into the emptiness - You throw a jab, your opponent blocks it. You throw the 2nd jab, before your opponent tries to block it, you pull your jab back and throw a cross or hook. Your 2nd jab force your opponent to block into the thin air.

2. Borrow your opponent's blocking force - You throw a jab, your opponent blocks it. You throw the 2nd jab, when your opponent blocks it, you borrow his force, spin your arm, and change your jab into a hook.

3. Use your punch to set up a pull - You throw a jab, your opponent blocks it. You pull his blocking arm, and punch with a cross or hook.

4. Use one punch to set up another punch - You throw an overhand. Your opponent raises arm to block it. You use another hand to throw an uppercut.
 

Urban Trekker

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You could do any of those, but I typically don't go in with a plan. I'll throw some "feelers" first, then decide what I'm going to from there. You can gauge which of these might and might not work by how they react to the feelers.
 

RagingBull

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actually one of the most successfull fighters i knew used to throw wide circular punches a bit like you see in some Kung fu .
I am more into going the direct short distance but this guy swung them & i remember he did get some results in fights.
Probably lucky he was not fighting someone with a boxing background.
maybe the swinging gave the punches power but of course it is dangerous to leave yourself open. Of course this was just street fighting brawling.
 

JowGaWolf

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actually one of the most successfull fighters i knew used to throw wide circular punches a bit like you see in some Kung fu .
I am more into going the direct short distance but this guy swung them & i remember he did get some results in fights.
Probably lucky he was not fighting someone with a boxing background.
maybe the swinging gave the punches power but of course it is dangerous to leave yourself open. Of course this was just street fighting brawling.
When the swings are done correctly then the opening should be a minimum risk. The guy in that video had bad technique. If the stance isn't strong then that punch will through a person off balance
 

Bill Mattocks

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Do you use the following strategies in your striking art system?

1. Lead your opponent into the emptiness - You throw a jab, your opponent blocks it. You throw the 2nd jab, before your opponent tries to block it, you pull your jab back and throw a cross or hook. Your 2nd jab force your opponent to block into the thin air.

2. Borrow your opponent's blocking force - You throw a jab, your opponent blocks it. You throw the 2nd jab, when your opponent blocks it, you borrow his force, spin your arm, and change your jab into a hook.

3. Use your punch to set up a pull - You throw a jab, your opponent blocks it. You pull his blocking arm, and punch with a cross or hook.

4. Use one punch to set up another punch - You throw an overhand. Your opponent raises arm to block it. You use another hand to throw an uppercut.
I don't think I like the idea of 'pulling back' a jab.

In larger terms, I agree with some of what you've said. One of my favorite codes of karate is that a person's unbalance is the same as a weight. Steal someone's balance, you put them into an internal struggle of attempting to regain that balance as a higher priority than dealing with attacks from you. I also have no issues with redirecting an opponent's force whenever possible.
 

JowGaWolf

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I don't think I like the idea of 'pulling back' a jab.

In larger terms, I agree with some of what you've said. One of my favorite codes of karate is that a person's unbalance is the same as a weight. Steal someone's balance, you put them into an internal struggle of attempting to regain that balance as a higher priority than dealing with attacks from you. I also have no issues with redirecting an opponent's force whenever possible.
I've been waiting so long for someone to state that balance takes priority. Disrupt balance and the body will sell you out. It something that we can "train out of our reaction" That reality is why I put such a high value on footwork, Stance, and breaking structure. Get really good at all three and you'll be hard to beat. Disrupt balance will destroy punch power greatly.
 

Bill Mattocks

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I've been waiting so long for someone to state that balance takes priority. Disrupt balance and the body will sell you out. It something that we can "train out of our reaction" That reality is why I put such a high value on footwork, Stance, and breaking structure. Get really good at all three and you'll be hard to beat. Disrupt balance will destroy punch power greatly.
If you've ever seen anyone slip on ice, you know how involuntary reactions can take control. Balance is a survival imperative, and the primitive parts of the brain will detect even minor imbalance and immediately assert itself to deal with that as a priority. It's great for hitting people in my limited experience. Doesn't even require a big disruption. An inch or so will do it. Grab an opponent's arm and pull and hit them with the other hand. Amazing results at times.
 

isshinryuronin

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I don't think I like the idea of 'pulling back' a jab.
Agree with your post except this quote, kind of. For me, it depends on the opponent and the tactics that seem right for him and the situation.

If he is a quick counter-puncher I may not have time to follow-up my jab or evade his counter (not as fast as I used to be.) So snapping my punch back to a guard position (Isshinryu SOP) as I start my follow-up seems like a good idea. Or, if I don't want to crush him, I may "box" him using more finesse and combinations.

On the other hand, crushing him may be the correct option if we're playing for keeps or if he's a grappler and good at takedowns. Not my strong point so I'll want to finish him ASAP. In this case I'll leave my jab out to block his vision, or for a quick push to his shoulder (for the "imbalance" you describe immediately above) or face as I close in on him for the kill.

The choice of snapping it back can depend on these considerations, or maybe just on my mood at the time. There is no one best answer.
 

Bill Mattocks

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Agree with your post except this quote, kind of. For me, it depends on the opponent and the tactics that seem right for him and the situation.

If he is a quick counter-puncher I may not have time to follow-up my jab or evade his counter (not as fast as I used to be.) So snapping my punch back to a guard position (Isshinryu SOP) as I start my follow-up seems like a good idea. Or, if I don't want to crush him, I may "box" him using more finesse and combinations.

On the other hand, crushing him may be the correct option if we're playing for keeps or if he's a grappler and good at takedowns. Not my strong point so I'll want to finish him ASAP. In this case I'll leave my jab out to block his vision, or for a quick push to his shoulder (for the "imbalance" you describe immediately above) or face as I close in on him for the kill.

The choice of snapping it back can depend on these considerations, or maybe just on my mood at the time. There is no one best answer.
As we emphasize to the kids and new adult students, we don't pull back our punches to that guard position, though. It's the natural recoil from the turning of the hips during delivery of the punch that returns the punch to guard position. I think I was just objecting to the idea of using muscle control to 'pull back' a punch.
 

Graywalker

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Some, but we are more concerned with controlling the gate.

Hands narrow, opening on the outside. Hands wide opening on the inside.
 

drop bear

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I don't think I like the idea of 'pulling back' a jab.

In larger terms, I agree with some of what you've said. One of my favorite codes of karate is that a person's unbalance is the same as a weight. Steal someone's balance, you put them into an internal struggle of attempting to regain that balance as a higher priority than dealing with attacks from you. I also have no issues with redirecting an opponent's force whenever possible.

It is called a Dutch trap. And it is pretty common.

There are some positional tricks to make it work.

 
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Kung Fu Wang

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I don't think I like the idea of 'pulling back' a jab.

In larger terms, I agree with some of what you've said. One of my favorite codes of karate is that a person's unbalance is the same as a weight. Steal someone's balance, you put them into an internal struggle of attempting to regain that balance as a higher priority than dealing with attacks from you. I also have no issues with redirecting an opponent's force whenever possible.
The "pulling back" is similar to your "redirecting". But it can give a longer time "hook - body connection" effect.

Also my "pulling back" can help me to change a striking game into a wrestling game if I want to. It's a CMA principle that "you should never come back with an empty hand".

A spear with a hook is more dangerous than a spear.

spear_with_hook.jpg


spear.jpg
 
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Bill Mattocks

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The "pulling back" is similar to your "redirecting". But it can give a longer time "hook - body connection" effect.

Also my "pulling back" can help me to change a striking game into a wrestling game if I want to. It's a CMA principle that "you should never come back with an empty hand".

A spear with a hook is more dangerous than a spear.

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Now I understand, thank you. We do similar things. The basics of blocking and punching give way to the advanced techniques where every block can be a strike, every strike can be a block, blocks can be many things besides just hard blocks, you can use punches to deflect attacks and so on. It's endless and really only limited to time, imagination, and dedicated practice against resisting partners.
 

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Do you use the following strategies in your striking art system?

1. Lead your opponent into the emptiness - You throw a jab, your opponent blocks it. You throw the 2nd jab, before your opponent tries to block it, you pull your jab back and throw a cross or hook. Your 2nd jab force your opponent to block into the thin air.

2. Borrow your opponent's blocking force - You throw a jab, your opponent blocks it. You throw the 2nd jab, when your opponent blocks it, you borrow his force, spin your arm, and change your jab into a hook.

3. Use your punch to set up a pull - You throw a jab, your opponent blocks it. You pull his blocking arm, and punch with a cross or hook.

4. Use one punch to set up another punch - You throw an overhand. Your opponent raises arm to block it. You use another hand to throw an uppercut.
Nice! Good strategy.
 
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Kung Fu Wang

Kung Fu Wang

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every strike can be a block,
This is my favor principle at this moment. I have always believed that when my opponent throws a

- straight punch, I can use circular punch to redirect his punch.
- circular punch, I can use straight punch to redirect his punch.

When my opponent's arm are attacking me, instead of using my arms to guard my head, my arms are attacking him at the same time too.

It's like to use my anti-missile system to knock down the incoming missile attack. I don't like to be put in defense mode.
 

Flying Crane

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A spear with a hook is more dangerous than a spear.

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View attachment 26866
Well no, that is not even close to an absolute. It is very much a case of it depends.

A spear with a hook can get caught up in stuff, rendering it immobilized. A regular spear can do a sewing machine type stabstabstabstabstab. Very difficult to be on the receiving end of that.
 

Buka

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This is my favor principle at this moment. I have always believed that when my opponent throws a

- straight punch, I can use circular punch to redirect his punch.
- circular punch, I can use straight punch to redirect his punch.

When my opponent's arm are attacking me, instead of using my arms to guard my head, my arms are attacking him at the same time too.

It's like to use my anti-missile system to knock down the incoming missile attack. I don't like to be put in defense mode.
Sometimes I'll do exactly that, other times I'll slip or weave his straight punch or weave his hooks, always punching at the upward U of the weave, or hook at the slip. (or shovel hook at the slip - half hook, half uppercut)
 

geezer

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Well no, that is not even close to an absolute. It is very much a case of it depends.

A spear with a hook can get caught up in stuff, rendering it immobilized. A regular spear can do a sewing machine type stabstabstabstabstab. Very difficult to be on the receiving end of that.
What you said... historical weapons experts often stress context when evaluating the effectiveness of weapons. For example, a hook is great for pulling people off horses, and sometimes useful in pulling down a shield to make an opening ....if those are your concerns. In other situations, it just adds weight and can get caught on things. So, you have to ask what the context is.
 

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