Well it seems you are exceptional (note I didn't say "special" :D ).

I'm sure there are other success stories and when something is meant to be that can transcend everything else. But more often in-house relationships get going for other reasons, and that's when ugliness happens. :shrug:

Michael also spoke about exploitation (conscious or unintentional) , that's the worst case scenario, and all-too-common. Power equations in relationships sure can be a minefield. Being human, it really isn't easy to completely compartmentalize relationships, and being people we just don't stay in our compartments, we keep trying to get out.

Case in point, as sexual orientation was an origional question of this thread: my co-worker is gay, and his lover has friends visiting for a few days from Wisconsin. The lover isn't out of the closet at home, with either old friends OR his family. So my colleague is being a heterosexual friend. He is trying to act as butch as possible, and trying not to gesture. He has moved out for the week, so he is out of his home. He brought a girl we work with out to dinner with this group, as though they were involved. Now one man's secret has involved two other people. The next day after the group dinner, my co-worker was exhausted and depressed from being someone he isn't, for the sake of someone he loves, who won't admit they are involved.

Keep it simple- jeez. Work is for working, the dojo is for fighting, if you want to get laid, go to a party. If you meet someone special, grab on like grim death and tell everyone you know, so they can be jealous.
Sexual orientation should not be an issue in the kwoon/dojo. Nor should dating. I do not consider the study of combat arts to be a hobby, it is a lifestyle. It is often hard work. Work and relationships should be mutually exclusive. I don't even like working with friends, much less someone I am dating. Instructors and students? Outta the question! Too many authority issues. Students and students? Never seen one work out....and I've done it!!! My amendment to that last statement would be a strong relationship (ie. marriage) before training together. I say this because my wife and I train together as equals when we train together. The last kwoon in which I trained, instructor/student relationships were forbidden and I approved of that policy. Now, the question of sexual tension in a co-ed training environment is a whole other issue. There are some who say that males and females should never train together. I disagree, for a lot of reasons. However, sexual tension cannot be avoided...with the possible exception of eunuchs (do they train in combat? quarterstaff, perhaps?)
We've had some experiences with students dating each other.. subsequently breaking up and that was a loss of a student, which was unfortunate for the one leaving and for us as a business. We not only lost a student but a friend.
We have a few couples as students now mostly college kids. One joined initially and brought their girlfriend/boyfriend into join. I think it's great up to a point. I do have some issues with some of them showing 'affection' during class, kissing etc should be done outside the studio in my humble opinion.

Being Seig and I are married does go to show couples can train together :) It's great having commonalities in any relationship.

As far as Homosexuality.. who's to know unless the person states their sexuality preference? If they are a good instructor or student.. well who cares which way they wanna go..
With the way Males students bond at our studio .. ya begin to wonder about em all *G*
Originally posted by Quick Sand
When it comes to dating in the dojang I don't think I would do it myself but I do know one success story. I'm not sure if they were both students when they first started dating, but now he's a 2nd degree Black Belt and she's a 3rd or 2rd gyup brown belt. In otherwords he's an instructor and she's a student. They're completely 100% professional in class and you would never know they were together if you didn't know them outside of class. Now they're getting married next month. :D

I can verify that... Well, sometimes you can tell, but it's not obvious, and they're not going out of their way to play favourites (in fact, the black belt works the brown belt extra hard just to ensure that they aren't playing favourites with each other).

I've also dated a fellow student in a dojang, but when the relationship ended, we remained friends, and it didn't tear the dojang apart. Personal relationships aren't always a bad thing... and besides, as Jill noted, there's nothing wrong with flirting... as long as you are aware of the risks in going further than flirting, you should be okay.

As to homosexuality, I don't think the sexual orientation of any individual should have any impact on their ability to teach, and I am comfortable enough with my own orientation to believe that it doesn't matter what you are, straight or gay, in the martial arts, in working together, etc. It doesn't bug me. Long rant, I know, said before, I know, good to repeat, you know. :p
Sexual Orientation? Don't care.

Relationships between students? Not something I would recommend but hey it makes life interesting.

Instructors and students? Bad idea. Would you date your college professors? High school teachers? Not a smart idea for either party. Some instructors seem to have issues with appropriate age for relationships (i.e. young teenagers are not okay when 20 some things) but that's a different topic.
So this is why there is no authentic japanese martial arts training in the united states!

Originally posted by TKDman
So this is why there is no authentic japanese martial arts training in the united states!


How do you equate an alleged lack of authentic Japanese martial arts with politics? You should visit Japan sometime... Plenty of politics to be had by all.

:asian: :tank: :asian:

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