No Touch KO

[skribs]

I was thinking more in terms of Ultane and Nitrous Oxide, but I suppose your option could work too.

And I can't smell so I'd be immune.

 

[drop bear]

Not too hard to figure out why they want to believe it - They want to find a way they can beat anyone without any effort at all. Learning how to actually defend yourself takes too long, is too difficult, takes too much work, and is too painful. Why work hard when there’s a guy who can teach you to control anyone and knock them out without doing much of anything?

Quite simple, really.

It is a progression.

I have mentioned this idea where to say get better at throwing a ball you would start with a big target that is close. And progressively make it smaller and further away.

Martial arts does the opposite. Take a guy with some irritating natural reactions to attacks and train them out of him until he becomes a collapso tap out monkey.

 

[JR 137]

It is a progression.

I have mentioned this idea where to say get better at throwing a ball you would start with a big target that is close. And progressively make it smaller and further away.

Martial arts does the opposite. Take a guy with some irritating natural reactions to attacks and train them out of him until he becomes a collapso tap out monkey.

Good point. One I hadn’t considered.

 

[skribs]

It is a progression.

I have mentioned this idea where to say get better at throwing a ball you would start with a big target that is close. And progressively make it smaller and further away.

Martial arts does the opposite. Take a guy with some irritating natural reactions to attacks and train them out of him until he becomes a collapso tap out monkey.

To some degree, this is necessary with beginners. As a beginner, you need the other person to resist just enough that you can execute the technique. I'd argue the same applies to advanced students who are experimenting with techniques as well.

The problem is when that level of resistance becomes the constant, instead of the first step.

 

[JR 137]

To some degree, this is necessary with beginners. As a beginner, you need the other person to resist just enough that you can execute the technique. I'd argue the same applies to advanced students who are experimenting with techniques as well.

The problem is when that level of resistance becomes the constant, instead of the first step.

Yup. Absolutely no problem throwing a slow-ish punch and holding it out there while a partner gets his footwork and counter right.

Well, no problem with that until there’s some muscle memory and ability to alter the technique whenever and however necessary. Once they’re comfortable, you make them uncomfortable again by actually hitting them if they’re not getting out of the way, not holding the punch out, stuff like that.

It’s called progression. You don’t have to be out for blood, but you’ve got to push the person out of their comfort zone. If you watch a class with the upper ranks doing the same stuff as the lower ranks, and the upper ranks don’t have any more of a sense of urgency than the ones who relatively just learned it, the teacher doesn’t know what progression means. Using @drop bear analogy, if the freshman, JV and varsity team are all working on hitting a 10 foot target from 5 feet away and none of the higher levels are backing up, there’s a serious problem. Yet somehow that analogy is ok in some dojos. I guess people don’t want to get hit.

We had a great saying in my former dojo - the more you sweat and bleed in the dojo, the less you’ll sweat and bleed out on the streets.

 

[drop bear]

Yup. Absolutely no problem throwing a slow-ish punch and holding it out there while a partner gets his footwork and counter right.

Well, no problem with that until there’s some muscle memory and ability to alter the technique whenever and however necessary. Once they’re comfortable, you make them uncomfortable again by actually hitting them if they’re not getting out of the way, not holding the punch out, stuff like that.

It’s called progression. You don’t have to be out for blood, but you’ve got to push the person out of their comfort zone. If you watch a class with the upper ranks doing the same stuff as the lower ranks, and the upper ranks don’t have any more of a sense of urgency than the ones who relatively just learned it, the teacher doesn’t know what progression means. Using @drop bear analogy, if the freshman, JV and varsity team are all working on hitting a 10 foot target from 5 feet away and none of the higher levels are backing up, there’s a serious problem. Yet somehow that analogy is ok in some dojos. I guess people don’t want to get hit.

We had a great saying in my former dojo - the more you sweat and bleed in the dojo, the less you’ll sweat and bleed out on the streets.

I have noticed people get flinchy as the get better at assisting drills to work.

Which makes sense. If I stand there and you are allowed to punch me. I am going to be safer dropping than staunching.

Came across this one.

This is training students to be worse.

 

[JR 137]

I have noticed people get flinchy as the get better at assisting drills to work.

Which makes sense. If I stand there and you are allowed to punch me. I am going to be safer dropping than staunching.

Came across this one.

This is training students to be worse.

My favorite was how he handled the guy wearing the hooded sweatshirt at about 2:22.

 

[skribs]

Once they’re comfortable, you make them uncomfortable again

I think this is the best way to explain teaching that I've ever heard.

Which makes sense. If I stand there and you are allowed to punch me. I am going to be safer dropping than staunching.

There was a 13 year old girl working with one of the Moms in a class I was teaching today. The girl was trying to be "tough" and resist the techniques as hard as she could, which resulted in her hitting the mat pretty hard when the Mom finally put enough force in it to take her down.

I had to tell the girl if she resists too much, she's going to get hurt when the technique is done.

 

[drop bear]

I think this is the best way to explain teaching that I've ever heard.



There was a 13 year old girl working with one of the Moms in a class I was teaching today. The girl was trying to be "tough" and resist the techniques as hard as she could, which resulted in her hitting the mat pretty hard when the Mom finally put enough force in it to take her down.

I had to tell the girl if she resists too much, she's going to get hurt when the technique is done.

If it is static it shouldn't be hard.

 

[skribs]

If it is static it shouldn't be hard.

Do you mean she shouldn't be resisting hard, or it shouldn't be hard to overcome her resistance?

 

[Bill Mattocks]

In a teaching/learning environment, not typically sparring, the uke resists enough to allow the technique to work but only if done correctly. The uke does not resist with all their might, nor does the person doing the technique apply everything they have to doing it.

As work between partners progresses, it is natural and effective training to increase speed, power, and resistance, so that if the technique being taught has to be applied in real life, it should function as intended. But to begin with, there has to be reasonable give-and-take between partners to establish the necessary feel for the technique.

 

[skribs]

In a teaching/learning environment, not typically sparring, the uke resists enough to allow the technique to work but only if done correctly. The uke does not resist with all their might, nor does the person doing the technique apply everything they have to doing it.

As work between partners progresses, it is natural and effective training to increase speed, power, and resistance, so that if the technique being taught has to be applied in real life, it should function as intended. But to begin with, there has to be reasonable give-and-take between partners to establish the necessary feel for the technique.

The thing I'm worried about with these teenagers is they'll try to show how "tough" they are by resisting the technique until their arm breaks.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

The thing I'm worried about with these teenagers is they'll try to show how "tough" they are by resisting the technique until their arm breaks.

That will teach them.

 

[Dirty Dog]

The thing I'm worried about with these teenagers is they'll try to show how "tough" they are by resisting the technique until their arm breaks.

There's a lesson to be learned there, too. And it'll be learned by more than just the foolish one, I bet.

Seriously, though, for this to happen BOTH sides have to be idiots. That's unlikely.

 

[skribs]

That will teach them.

I'd rather they not miss several classes while waiting to heal.

 

[JR 137]

I'd rather they not miss several classes while waiting to heal.

Yeah, but it only has to happen to one guy one time. Word gets around. Pick your sacrificial lamb and be done with it.

Just kidding, of course.

 

[JR 137]

There's a lesson to be learned there, too. And it'll be learned by more than just the foolish one, I bet.

Seriously, though, for this to happen BOTH sides have to be idiots. That's unlikely.

Never underestimate the depths of idiocy. Being an ER guy, I’m sure this isn’t news to you.

I’m sure you’ve heard “I’m not stupid enough to_____” countless times, yet they did it.

I followed around an orthopedic surgeon a few times during undergrad. My favorite memory was when he got called down to the ER to look at a guy’s hand. The guy says “I’m not stupid enough to stick my hand in a snowblower while it’s running, but I had to clear the chute.” The doc says “obviously you are stupid enough to stick your hand in a running snowblower, because that’s exactly what you did.” The guy’s response was “yeah, I guess you’re right.”

I’m pretty sure if I stuck around long enough, that one would only stand out because it was the first truly stupid one.

Stupidity knows no bounds.