Journey to a new style...

Gyakuto

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This is that image from 1984. I thought there were more tiles!
27F02072-E52E-47C0-A6F0-516A440CE370.jpeg
 
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_Simon_

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Well guys... my goodness it's been awhile since I'd posted! Apologies for that! I'll try to recap.

Still training, I had a bit of issues with my instructor at times and mentioned it in a message to him. He actually took it seriously and pulled me aside after class to have a chat which I really appreciated. It was mainly to do with not feeling like I was receiving much feedback or correction. It seemed others were getting it, and I refused to believe that I was just doing everything perfectly haha. He took that on board and for sure did say I was at an exceptional level and there was often no need for correction, but that he certainly will when it comes up. Also brought up how I wasn't sure the place that teaching plays... I mentioned often when we will do a certain drill, I will be placed with lower grades in more of a teaching role. Don't get me wrong, I fully understand that higher grades assist more, and I'm more than happy to and actually love to teach and share, but I guess just not all the time, especially if it prevents me from working on a drill and learning myself. I do get that you learn by teaching, and that is very true I've found, but sometimes it's not the same as working a drill directly. So I'd struggled with that and felt I was missing out. Again, he was wonderful and will make sure I don't miss out.

Was truly blown away with how open and receptive he was, and he values my thoughts a great deal. I felt much better about things, and also trying to check in with myself to make sure my expectations aren't too grandiose, and also trying to appreciate those opportunities more as a learning experience.

Next post is where I'm at in training.
 
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_Simon_

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So, in 3 weeks time I have my Shodan Ho grading! Very nervous but excited. Have been training like crazy in preparation for it, getting my cardio and stamina up, technique and technical knowledge etc. It's a bit of a contentious issue the probationary black belt, but I did some reading through threads on here and it makes sense. I like the idea, and I see it as an interim stage of maturing into the full black belt. Many quit after getting black belt, so I see it as a way of developing oneself further into the understanding of the dan ranks, and that it truly is the beginning. Any thoughts on their philosophy of Shodan Ho would be much appreciated!

Also have a seminar coming up with some very esteemed instructors of our style, each of whom have trained extensively with and gained rank under the founder of our style.

And will be attending a weekend camp too in November run by another club who also practices our style. Finally, I've missed those very much!

That's all for now!
 

Gyakuto

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Well guys... my goodness it's been awhile since I'd posted! Apologies for that! I'll try to recap.

Still training, I had a bit of issues with my instructor at times and mentioned it in a message to him. He actually took it seriously and pulled me aside after class to have a chat which I really appreciated. It was mainly to do with not feeling like I was receiving much feedback or correction. It seemed others were getting it, and I refused to believe that I was just doing everything perfectly haha. He took that on board and for sure did say I was at an exceptional level and there was often no need for correction, but that he certainly will when it comes up. Also brought up how I wasn't sure the place that teaching plays... I mentioned often when we will do a certain drill, I will be placed with lower grades in more of a teaching role. Don't get me wrong, I fully understand that higher grades assist more, and I'm more than happy to and actually love to teach and share, but I guess just not all the time, especially if it prevents me from working on a drill and learning myself. I do get that you learn by teaching, and that is very true I've found, but sometimes it's not the same as working a drill directly. So I'd struggled with that and felt I was missing out. Again, he was wonderful and will make sure I don't miss out.

Was truly blown away with how open and receptive he was, and he values my thoughts a great deal. I felt much better about things, and also trying to check in with myself to make sure my expectations aren't too grandiose, and also trying to appreciate those opportunities more as a learning experience.

Next post is where I'm at in training.
Youre very lucky to have such a teacher, _Simon_ and it sounds like hes lucky to have a student like you. Years ago, I had a teacher who gave generic feedback to the whole class and it was hard to work out what applied to me or not and progress was slow (which I suspect was his strategy!). Now I have a teacher who overwhelms me with detail and again progress is slow as I try and assimilate those details. Im actually taking a hiatus in training with him for very different reasons!
 

Gyakuto

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So, in 3 weeks time I have my Shodan Ho grading! Very nervous but excited. Have been training like crazy in preparation for it, getting my cardio and stamina up, technique and technical knowledge etc. It's a bit of a contentious issue the probationary black belt, but I did some reading through threads on here and it makes sense. I like the idea, and I see it as an interim stage of maturing into the full black belt. Many quit after getting black belt, so I see it as a way of developing oneself further into the understanding of the dan ranks, and that it truly is the beginning. Any thoughts on their philosophy of Shodan Ho would be much appreciated!

Also have a seminar coming up with some very esteemed instructors of our style, each of whom have trained extensively with and gained rank under the founder of our style.

And will be attending a weekend camp too in November run by another club who also practices our style. Finally, I've missed those very much!

That's all for now!
Shodan ho is a probationary shodan? How does one move from shodan ho to shodan? I personally dont see the point (and neither does my association). Its accepted that a newly qualified shodan may not be as accomplished as say, a shodan of a couple of years further instructions and practise, but this maturation occurs within the label of the grade. Thus to pass the grade you must have demonstrated the grading criteria as laid out (by the Zen Nippon Kendo Renmei in our case).

Its often useful to look at other qualification awarding boards to get a better handle on the concept. Thus, are candidates awarded a probationary degree/PhD or probationary fellowship of the Royal Collage of Surgeons? No: when you pass you are that grade. One is either a flight qualified astronaut or an astronaut candidate.
 
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_Simon_

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Youre very lucky to have such a teacher, _Simon_ and it sounds like hes lucky to have a student like you. Years ago, I had a teacher who gave generic feedback to the whole class and it was hard to work out what applied to me or not and progress was slow (which I suspect was his strategy!). Now I have a teacher who overwhelms me with detail and again progress is slow as I try and assimilate those details. Im actually taking a hiatus in training with him for very different reasons!
Thank you that's kind of you to say. I do feel very lucky. And I very much appreciate how he values our thoughts and is big on sharing, as well as constantly trying to learn himself.

That's very interesting! Yes, generic feedback can be not specific enough to you, and too much feedback can be overwhelming to assimilate!
 
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_Simon_

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Shodan ho is a probationary shodan? How does one move from shodan ho to shodan? I personally dont see the point (and neither does my association). Its accepted that a newly qualified shodan may not be as accomplished as say, a shodan of a couple of years further instructions and practise, but this maturation occurs within the label of the grade. Thus to pass the grade you must have demonstrated the grading criteria as laid out (by the Zen Nippon Kendo Renmei in our case).

Its often useful to look at other qualification awarding boards to get a better handle on the concept. Thus, are candidates awarded a probationary degree/PhD or probationary fellowship of the Royal Collage of Surgeons? No: when you pass you are that grade. One is either a flight qualified astronaut or an astronaut candidate.
Yeah haha, like I said not everyone is a fan of it. Some put it solely down to a money-making scheme, whereas to me it is not (although I'm sure it has been used as such). From Shodan Ho to Shodan is essentially learning and exploring a new higher level kata, a weapons kata and also doing a 1000 word essay.

Traditionally (from what I have read), there is a period of a minimum of one year training between probationary black and 1st dan, and I actually really like this idea.

To me, all these elements signify a deepening of commitment and a willingness to engage in a more whole-perspective process, as well as developing of patience (which can often be lacking in the rush and excessive desire to just "get a black belt noooow" mentality). Also the probationary belt is black with a white tag, and 1st dan is the embroidered belt.

I'm in no rush whatsoever. In fact, I even pushed back doing this grading for awhile, wanting to deepen and solidify my understanding of 1st kyu and above material.

I guess this is a different orientation than the standard PhDs etc approach. Although, many jobs/occupations here actually have a 3 month probationary period ;).

This is just my take on it all, keen to hear others'.
 

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Its often useful to look at other qualification awarding boards to get a better handle on the concept. Thus, are candidates awarded a probationary degree/PhD or probationary fellowship of the Royal Collage of Surgeons? No: when you pass you are that grade. One is either a flight qualified astronaut or an astronaut candidate.
One translation of the Korean Chodanbo is, in fact, Black Belt Candidate. In our association, 1st Dan is a teaching rank. Chodanbo is a transition period where the focus shifts from learning to learning to teach.
 

Gyakuto

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Yeah haha, like I said not everyone is a fan of it. Some put it solely down to a money-making scheme,
How are they able monetise it?
whereas to me it is not (although I'm sure it has been used as such). From Shodan Ho to Shodan is essentially learning and exploring a new higher level kata, a weapons kata and also doing a 1000 word essay.
Ah, so you do have to grade (and pay for it) to get from being a ho to a sho (sorry I couldnt resist that)? I do like the idea of a written paper (we have a short answers written paper, too), but I recall the marker once saying to me thats they learned a lot from my answers. That didnt inspire much confidence and they recycle the questions so its hardly a real test of ones knowledge. What kind of weapons do you have at your disposal?
Traditionally (from what I have read), there is a period of a minimum of one year training between probationary black and 1st dan, and I actually really like this idea.
I can see the attraction of this but just tag the extra time onto the interval between ikkyu and shodan and dont charge for the ho to sho (again, Im sorry).
To me, all these elements signify a deepening of commitment and a willingness to engage in a more whole-perspective process, as well as developing of patience (which can often be lacking in the rush and excessive desire to just "get a black belt noooow" mentality). Also the probationary belt is black with a white tag, and 1st dan is the embroidered belt.
Thats fair enough.
I'm in no rush whatsoever. In fact, I even pushed back doing this grading for awhile, wanting to deepen and solidify my understanding of 1st kyu and above material.
Excellent. Most people are in a huge rush, but I feel Id rather be an accomplished 5th Dan rather than someone whos just scraped through.
Although, many jobs/occupations here actually have a 3 month probationary period ;).
Thats to ensure they havent hired a knobead and that youre a fit with the other workers rather than ensuring you can do the job. Ones CV should be good evidence the latter.
 

Gyakuto

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Thank you that's kind of you to say. I do feel very lucky. And I very much appreciate how he values our thoughts and is big on sharing, as well as constantly trying to learn himself.
You are lucky. In my experience most teachers have a huge ego, hate being questioned, however politely and strut around like a cockerel in a hen house!
 
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_Simon_

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How are they able monetise it?
Ah, so you do have to grade (and pay for it) to get from being a ho to a sho (sorry I couldnt resist that)? I do like the idea of a written paper (we have a short answers written paper, too), but I recall the marker once saying to me thats they learned a lot from my answers. That didnt inspire much confidence and they recycle the questions so its hardly a real test of ones knowledge. What kind of weapons do you have at your disposal?
Yes you do pay, but grading fees are incredibly modest compared to other places I've seen. It's actually not traditional kobudo weaponry but Shodan is a short-stick form (sort of a han-bo), and higher grades I believe are long pole, sword, and sabre forms. As the founder of our style trained internal CMA as a compliment these are incorporated in our study as well.
I can see the attraction of this but just tag the extra time onto the interval between ikkyu and shodan and dont charge for the ho to sho (again, Im sorry).
That's fair enough, we'll all have our views on it, and can appreciate where you're coming from. I personally don't mind at all, and gives me a chance to focus on certain things for longer and gain a deeper appreciation of them.

Ps. Big fan of the ho to sho 不
 

Gyakuto

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Yes you do pay, but grading fees are incredibly modest compared to other places I've seen.
Yes Ive noticed that in the USA, grading are very expensive compared to the U.K. at least.
It's actually not traditional kobudo weaponry but Shodan is a short-stick form (sort of a han-bo), and higher grades I believe are long pole, sword, and sabre forms. As the founder of our style trained internal CMA as a compliment these are incorporated in our study as well.
Its Kyokushin you practise, isnt it?
That's fair enough, we'll all have our views on it, and can appreciate where you're coming from. I personally don't mind at all, and gives me a chance to focus on certain things for longer and gain a deeper appreciation of them.
There are many ways to skin.an avocado (vegan version of the expression).
Ps. Big fan of the ho to sho 不
If the name fits, wear it
 
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_Simon_

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Yes Ive noticed that in the USA, grading are very expensive compared to the U.K. at least.

Its Kyokushin you practise, isnt it?

There are many ways to skin.an avocado (vegan version of the expression).

If the name fits, wear it
Haha 不

Kyokushin was my old style which I left a few years ago, Goju Kensha is what I practice now. I've noticed quite a few Goju schools use the shodan ho rank in their system. It is interesting for sure!
 

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Shodan ho is a probationary shodan? How does one move from shodan ho to shodan? I personally dont see the point (and neither does my association). Its accepted that a newly qualified shodan may not be as accomplished as say, a shodan of a couple of years further instructions and practise, but this maturation occurs within the label of the grade. Thus to pass the grade you must have demonstrated the grading criteria as laid out (by the Zen Nippon Kendo Renmei in our case).

Its often useful to look at other qualification awarding boards to get a better handle on the concept. Thus, are candidates awarded a probationary degree/PhD or probationary fellowship of the Royal Collage of Surgeons? No: when you pass you are that grade. One is either a flight qualified astronaut or an astronaut candidate.
I think the issue really ends up being about the use of "probationary". It's not all that different from how the NGAA handles ikkyu and shodan. Ikkyu testing includes most of the testing for shodan. Once you get ikkyu, it's understood you're in preparation for your shodan (no new techniques at that rank), and you have to spend at least a year at that rank before testing for shodan.
 

Gyakuto

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Haha 不

Kyokushin was my old style which I left a few years ago, Goju Kensha is what I practice now. I've noticed quite a few Goju schools use the shodan ho rank in their system. It is interesting for sure!
During a summer hiatus in my campanology sessions I decided to give Goju Ryu karate a try at a local club. A large part at the beginning of the class consisted of press ups and carrying fellow students on ones shoulder (thank goodness I go to the gym!). Then began the tanren where a partner punches you in the abdomen and chest three times repeatedly This went on for a while and although they took it easy on me, it was brutal and I had painful knuckle bruises on my pecs for days afterwards (and we all know koroddy men bruise on the inside). It was then that I realised that Im a soft wuss and too old for that kind of malarkey! Despite the dojo members being really nice and welcoming, I was glad to get back to pulling a rope with a bell on the end!
 

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During a summer hiatus in my campanology sessions I decided to give Goju Ryu karate a try at a local club. A large part at the beginning of the class consisted of press ups and carrying fellow students on ones shoulder (thank goodness I go to the gym!). Then began the tanren where a partner punches you in the abdomen and chest three times repeatedly This went on for a while and although they took it easy on me, it was brutal and I had painful knuckle bruises on my pecs for days afterwards (and we all know koroddy men bruise on the inside). It was then that I realised that Im a soft wuss and too old for that kind of malarkey! Despite the dojo members being really nice and welcoming, I was glad to get back to pulling a rope with a bell on the end!
I think back on some of the things I did as part of my training, and there's no way I'd be up to them now. Unfortunately, I don't think it's that I'm any smarter - I just can't get up as quietly the next day.
 

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