Internal Power Anyone?

[Dudi Nisan]

This short article is the first in a series of posts I plan to write about internal power, as it is taught and explained by Liu Kangyi, my teacher.



Who? Liu Kangyi. Where? Taipei, Lion Books bookstore.



Internal power exists. There is such a thing, and I am speaking from experience. It is a singular ability, an imposing skill which can be used to devastating effect in a combat situation (On the other hand, it won’t make you an immortal; you might possess internal power but it won’t make white cranes carry you around. Nor are golden Buddhas going to visit you).

I am not misleading you. And I am not going to qualify my statement in any way (as in “yes, sure, there is internal power, but you can only witness it once a year, in full moon, if my teacher is able exactly at that moment to channel into himself the God of War”). This power is taught publicly and you can come and experience it too. At each and every class.

I don’t blame you for being skeptical. You should be. Common sense is something you must never give up. And common sense has taught us that internal power makes no sense. It’s nonsense.

I would like to tell you that I was exactly like you, I would like to tell you that I was skeptical too. But that would not be true. I was way beyond skeptical. I did not give internal power any thought at all. As far as I was concerned internal power was a mumbo jumbo of the most ludicrous kind. Something taken out of a cheap gongfu “novel”; a “story” told by swindlers and sold to the gullible. In other words, I did not think that such a thing as internal power ever existed. And for this reason I wasn’t even looking to find such a thing. Why look for something which you know does not exist? And why look for something which does not exist when there are so much wonderful knowledge out there just waiting for you to “find it”?

But I was wrong. Internal power does exist. And although I wasn’t looking for it, not specifically anyway, I did find it (or maybe it found me. I cannot tell yet).

 

[Kickboxer101]

So you found it or maybe you didn't? So basically you don't know if it exists that how I read that

 

[Dudi Nisan]

Definitely exists!

 

[Xue Sheng]

And how does one manifest internal power?
What is it used for?
What are the advantages?

 

[mograph]

How do you define internal power?

Remember, most of us are tired of sales pitches, whether money is involved or not. As a result, from a rhetorical-persuasive standpoint, you're dealing with a skeptical audience. It's not skeptical of internal power, but skeptical of those who claim they have it and claim they understand it.

Adjust your rhetoric appropriately.

 

[Midnight-shadow]

So, if I'm reading this right, what you put in the OP was what your teacher thinks about "internal power" (whatever he thinks that may be). The question is, what do YOU think? It's very tempting to blindly follow your teacher's way of thinking instead of stopping to think about things for yourself. I'm not saying you should ignore what he says, but think about it and come to your own conclusion about whether "internal power" exists or not.

 

[Danny T]

Internal power...does it exist?
Absolutely.
The human body can not do any or function without it.
Internal - Situated within or inside of something. For this discussion refers to inside the human body and/or mind.
Power - the capacity to do work.
No human, under its own power, can do anything without internal power. The power described as 'under its own power' is internal power.

 

[Tony Dismukes]

Depends on what you mean by "internal power."

I've seen two categories of stuff demonstrated as "internal power."

The first is magic tricks and hokum. Bending spears against the throat. No touch throws. Students hopping around when the teacher touches them like a preacher has just imbued them with the holy spirit. I don't have much use for that nonsense.

The second is just very good body mechanics applied in subtle ways. This is real. My only complaint is when certain CMA fanboys insist that this sort of skill is unique to specific "internal" arts where the instructors demonstrate the skill in certain stylized ways and use a certain culturally specific poetic sort of language to talk about what they are doing. That kind of skill can be found in just about any art at really high levels, although it isn't always conceptualized the same way.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Depends on what you mean by "internal power."

I've seen two categories of stuff demonstrated as "internal power."

The first is magic tricks and hokum. Bending spears against the throat. No touch throws. Students hopping around when the teacher touches them like a preacher has just imbued them with the holy spirit. I don't have much use for that nonsense.

The second is just very good body mechanics applied in subtle ways. This is real. My only complaint is when certain CMA fanboys insist that this sort of skill is unique to specific "internal" arts where the instructors demonstrate the skill in certain stylized ways and use a certain culturally specific poetic sort of language to talk about what they are doing. That kind of skill can be found in just about any art at really high levels, although it isn't always conceptualized the same way.

Not disagreeing but I need to correct one thing from a "culturally specific poetic sort of language" POV.

This

Bending spears against the throat.

Is considered external.

And it is MR CMA fanboy to you sir.

 

[DanT]

This short article is the first in a series of posts I plan to write about internal power, as it is taught and explained by Liu Kangyi, my teacher.



Who? Liu Kangyi. Where? Taipei, Lion Books bookstore.



Internal power exists. There is such a thing, and I am speaking from experience. It is a singular ability, an imposing skill which can be used to devastating effect in a combat situation (On the other hand, it won’t make you an immortal; you might possess internal power but it won’t make white cranes carry you around. Nor are golden Buddhas going to visit you).

I am not misleading you. And I am not going to qualify my statement in any way (as in “yes, sure, there is internal power, but you can only witness it once a year, in full moon, if my teacher is able exactly at that moment to channel into himself the God of War”). This power is taught publicly and you can come and experience it too. At each and every class.

I don’t blame you for being skeptical. You should be. Common sense is something you must never give up. And common sense has taught us that internal power makes no sense. It’s nonsense.

I would like to tell you that I was exactly like you, I would like to tell you that I was skeptical too. But that would not be true. I was way beyond skeptical. I did not give internal power any thought at all. As far as I was concerned internal power was a mumbo jumbo of the most ludicrous kind. Something taken out of a cheap gongfu “novel”; a “story” told by swindlers and sold to the gullible. In other words, I did not think that such a thing as internal power ever existed. And for this reason I wasn’t even looking to find such a thing. Why look for something which you know does not exist? And why look for something which does not exist when there are so much wonderful knowledge out there just waiting for you to “find it”?

But I was wrong. Internal power does exist. And although I wasn’t looking for it, not specifically anyway, I did find it (or maybe it found me. I cannot tell yet).

In my opinion:

External power = force delivered by muscles.

Internal power = force delivered by muscles + "yi" (complete focus).

Therefore an external power strike is the same as an internal power strike, the only difference is that internal adds "yi" or complete focus. If you're talking about chi blasts from dragon ball z, that's not a thing, unfortunately.

 

[Dudi Nisan]

Discussants of this thread are concerned with theory and authenticity. You are right. You should be. So let me assure you that there is theory and that it is authentic.

All of you are experienced martial artists so when you’ll see (and experience) what Liu can do you’ll understand. And you’ll start asking different questions. You’ll realize it’s not a matter of what I, the OP, thinks, assumes, or vise verse. So, first, it’s real. What I think/know about it matters less (at this point of the discussion).

As for theory, well, Liu has formulated his own (quite elaborate) theory, and has already written two books about it (the third one is on the way. All books are in Chinese and, unfortunately, I don’t have time to translate them. Maybe in the future). I will touch upon this theory in future posts.

And how does one manifest internal power?
What is it used for?
What are the advantages?

Good questions!

Liu’s explanation (in extreme abbreviation): he stands up, then mentally-cognitively “allows” himself to lose balance and fall, even while keep standing erect. When he “falls” but stays erect internal power manifest.



Advantages: size, distance, control.



Size: the size of the force Liu generates is an advantage in its own right. Sometimes he just “touches” me with tip of his fingers and besides being quite painful it feels like he can pierce my body like a hot knife pierces butter.



Distance: as you all know distance is an important factor in determining a force’s size. With internal power you can generate amazing force from zero distance. So, it’s not Bruce Lee’s one-inch punch, but zero-distance power.



Control: at the moment of contact with your opponent he is immediately thrown off balance. Thus, he is in fact “leaning” on you in order to regain his stability and is therefore under your total control.

While the opponent is “stuck”, so to speak, the one generating internal power can move freely, i.e. he can marinating pressure at the contact point—pressure which immobilizes the opponent—even while freely attacking him.



I don’t expect you to take my word for it, and in fact you don’t have to. You can come and experience it for yourself.

 

[jks9199]

Traveling to Taipei isn't likely to be on my agenda soon. So far, I don't see an explanation or meaningful definition. Many of your descriptions above end up semantically null; he's falling but not falling, etc.

Perhaps you could paraphrase your instructor's definition? Tell us more about how it's applied, or even provide a video clip?

 

[oaktree]

Can you provide what actually your teacher says in hanzi so I can read it and translate it for myself. The English equivalent really doesn't say much. I personally wouldn't put to much into internal power much better to cultivate for health then constantly wasting it on demonstrations.

 

[Midnight-shadow]

All of you are experienced martial artists so when you’ll see (and experience) what Liu can do you’ll understand. And you’ll start asking different questions. You’ll realize it’s not a matter of what I, the OP, thinks, assumes, or vise verse. So, first, it’s real. What I think/know about it matters less (at this point of the discussion).

In my opinion, what you think about it is very important, and here's why. "Internal Power" is a buzz word in Chinese Martial Arts that can describe many different things, depending on who you talk to. Some people define it as one's mental strength in being able to withstand greater pain and enduring through it. Others define it as the act of using leverage and physics to overcome a larger opponent in a fight. Still others consider it merely to be a combination of good breath control and a stable connection to the Earth, while others consider it to be the manifestation of Qi which helps with self-healing. Now, we could sit here and argue all day and night about which is the correct definition of "internal power" but at the end of it all, you have to decide for yourself what it means and apply it in training. So my question to you is, based on what you have experienced, what is "internal power" to you?

Now, reading what you've written so far it sounds like you are talking about "internal power" in terms of overcoming and controlling a larger opponent. As Tony Dismukes said, this is just a case of using the laws of physics and bio-mechanics to your advantage, and is seen in many different Martial Arts at a high level. Granted, some arts use it more than others and "internal chinese arts" specialise in such techniques, but it certainly isn't unique to them at all.

The basic principle behind it is that if you offer no resistance, a stronger opponent cannot overwhelm you with pure force, because muscles can only contract against resistance. Imagine you are pushing against a closed door with all your strength and then the door suddenly swings open. What happens? You have suddenly lost all the resistance and fall forwards, losing your balance and control.

 

[Dudi Nisan]

So far, I don't see an explanation or meaningful definition. Many of your descriptions above end up semantically null; he's falling but not falling, etc.

My apologies. I understand that it is new, hard too accept and understand. It is also hard for Liu's Chinese students( even though they get the explanations in their mother tongue). I'll try to provide more information in future posts.

this is just a case of using the laws of physics and bio-mechanics to your advantage

Exactly. I think that in my very first post I stated that it won't make you an immortal, nor is it required of you to become an immortal in order to develop this power. Nonetheless, it is a unique ability.

The only difference between Tony's and mine's is that I am giving a specific example, of someone who had achieved it and teaching it. And that is the whole point--to share with you my own experience(I am not interested in conducting a general discussion on the potential of physics and bio-mechanics, but I am not against it either).

and is seen in many different Martial Arts at a high level

It might be. But again, this is just a general statement. I give you a specific example. I believe that other people in other martial arts had/have this ability too. But I only know of Liu Kangyi.

 

[Midnight-shadow]

Exactly. I think that in my very first post I stated that it won't make you an immortal, nor is it required of you to become an immortal in order to develop this power. Nonetheless, it is a unique ability.

The only difference between Tony's and mine's is that I am giving a specific example, of someone who had achieved it and teaching it. And that is the whole point--to share with you my own experience(I am not interested in conducting a general discussion on the potential of physics and bio-mechanics, but I am not against it either).

It might be. But again, this is just a general statement. I give you a specific example. I believe that other people in other martial arts had/have this ability too. But I only know of Liu Kangyi.

This guy teaches almost identical processes, under a different name (he calls it the "Ngo Dac Na" system). When he teaches he talks about the transfer of energy, but it is essentially the same thing as what you are describing. All you are doing is redirecting your opponent's energy to either send it away from you or send it back to them. And again, this isn't some mystical power but purely a matter of physics and bio-mechanics. In fact, many people use these principles every day without even realising it. When football players pass the ball from one person to another they hardly ever stop the ball moving completely before passing it on, and instead they redirect the ball's energy, changing the ball's direction while still keeping it moving. Granted this is a very simple example, but the principle between redirecting a ball and redirecting someone's punch is the same.

It's great that you have discovered this and seen it in action, as it forms the basis of many things we humans are able to do, just don't be under the illusion that it is something only achievable through training with your instructor. Now I feel like the jerk who told a child that Father Christmas doesn't exist.....

 

[Dudi Nisan]

This guy teaches almost identical processes

Can you vouch for that guy?

I can vouch for Liu Kangyi.

 

[Midnight-shadow]

Can you vouch for that guy?

I can vouch for Liu Kangyi.

In as much as he appears to be legit from the way he explains what is happening and demonstrates it on a video.

 

[Juany118]

My apologies. I understand that it is new, hard too accept and understand. It is also hard for Liu's Chinese students( even though they get the explanations in their mother tongue). I'll try to provide more information in future posts.



Exactly. I think that in my very first post I stated that it won't make you an immortal, nor is it required of you to become an immortal in order to develop this power. Nonetheless, it is a unique ability.

The only difference between Tony's and mine's is that I am giving a specific example, of someone who had achieved it and teaching it. And that is the whole point--to share with you my own experience(I am not interested in conducting a general discussion on the potential of physics and bio-mechanics, but I am not against it either).



It might be. But again, this is just a general statement. I give you a specific example. I believe that other people in other martial arts had/have this ability too. But I only know of Liu Kangyi.

The same principles you describe are at the heart of Aikido. In Aikido they also call it Ki. They even have a few throws they refer to as "breath throws" that are described as follows...

As your enemy attacks inhale, absorbing their Ki, then as you initiate the throw exhale and use their Ki to power the throw. The thing is what you are doing with your breathing has nothing to do with absorbing their Ki. The throw happens because of physics and biomechanics. Your breathing is part of the biomechanical half of the equation. You inhale with the attack so you can exhale with the throw. You exhale with the throw so your diaphragm is relaxed allowing for more fluid and wider ranged movement of your torso as the throw is executed. The same can be seen in the "Ki principle" of ukemi (being thrown.) The breathing isn't about maintaining a flow of Ki through your body, as the teaching says. It's because if you hold your breath while being thrown, again your diaphragm is "bound up" if you are inhaling or holding your breath. This makes you less relaxed and limber and so you must absorb more impact with raw muscle rather than simply flowing with the throw. This not only risks injury but also exhausts you faster. Again though not Ki, biomechanics.

 

[Dudi Nisan]

The same principles you describe are at the heart of Aikido

The difference is that I am not only "describing." As I said, and say again, I have personal, hands-on, experience.

aikido theory might be similar, or even identical, but that is just theory. You can explain the same phenomenon differently or similarly, but what I want to tell you here, based on EXPERINCE (and not something I read, or watched on YouTube and so on), is that this phenomenon exists. There is such a thing as internal power. How do I know? Because I felt it!