Doc_Jude
3rd Black Belt
YOU'VE NEVER SEEN MMA!?! Where do you live, Norway??? :wink2:
Has MMA popularity helped or hurt the MA Community?
- Thread starter kidswarrior
- Start date
YOU'VE NEVER SEEN MMA!?! Where do you live, Norway??? :wink2:
Cirdan
Senior Master
Yeah, and beware or I`ll smite you with the might of Thor!
Actually I got much better things to do with my time.
Doc_Jude
3rd Black Belt
Awww, come on, I'm worth the time to smite. Really.:tantrum:
Cirdan
Senior Master
Smiting is good. I`ll bring my warhammer along next time I am in the neighborhood.
I was just thinking MMA shows are not worth my time to watch when I can work, train, be with my girl or sleep instead.
Doc_Jude
3rd Black Belt
Smiting is good. I`ll bring my warhammer along next time I am in the neighborhood.
I was just thinking MMA shows are not worth my time to watch when I can work, train, be with my girl or sleep instead.
Oh. Well, in that case, you're pretty right on.
chinto
Senior Master
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I think their ego's are usually very large like a professional boxer or any other prize fighters, and things have hurt the perception of the martial arts more then helped... They are prize fighters, and a prize fight is about money and entertainment and not survival.. so I would say hurt it...
pstarr
Master Black Belt
I don't see it as a martial art any more than professional wrestling can be said to be a martial art...
How many MMA fighters do you know? I know most of them in the UK and one from the States and I can put my hand on my heart and say very very few have egos let alone very large ones. Many fighters fight semi pro or amateur so don't get paid. There are very healthy club leagues where again no one gets paid. I would suggest you are basing your views on watching the UFC which has very little to do with grassroots MMA.
As for it not being a martial art, come train with us and see for yourself instead of making sweeping statements that sound condescending and snobbish.
buddah_belly
Yellow Belt
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All I know is that every time a new Steven Seagal movie hits DVD, it's bad for Aikido dojos because you get a new influx of ponytails.
Some people just want to fight...even in TMA we discuss the "real world possibilities" of certain techniques. I can't fault them for that. It's who they are.
Some people just want to fight...even in TMA we discuss the "real world possibilities" of certain techniques. I can't fault them for that. It's who they are.
Xue Sheng
All weight is underside
I have to say based on the few real MMA people I have had a chance to talk with I agree with you.
Also I believe that many MMA people train incredibly hard much the way TMA did in the old days.
Eternal Beginner
Brown Belt
I have to respectfully disagree with you. I train at a gym that offers Muay Thai, BJJ, MMA as well as traditional MA's. The whole "prize fighter" mentality of the large ego and the assumption that it is all "about money and entertainment" is rather dismissive of men (and women) who train very diligently, sincerely and are extremely dedicated.
The fact is, most people who train MMA will never fight in a large event and even if they do it is definitely not about the money because even at the higher levels the payouts are small unless you are one of the few Randy Coutures or Chuck Liddells.
Of course there are fighters with large egos. I think anytime you have any high level athlete who has dedicated their life to a sport and is confident in their ability they will be accused of having "ego". The guys that I have trained with that have fought in the UFC, IFL, and KOTC are the most helpful, accomodating guys who are sincerely interested in making the sport grow. They do that through training others, seminars and making sure even the newest noob that walks through the door is given the opportunity to train without being harmed and encouraged even though they may never want to be a UFC fighter.
I think people who see MMA as harming the public perception of Martial Arts in general are people who don't really know what MMA is or have no experience with the training and methodology behind it. They are all too eager to condemn is as thuggery and "street-fighting" without taking into account the countless hours these competitors put into studying all ranges of combat.
chinto
Senior Master
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could be, all I can say is the few I have personally met who do cage fights and train in MMA in my aria have had large egos .. that is not a huge number and so perhaps I have just had the misfortune to meet ones that were taught the wrong attitude or just had that kind of ego before and kept it.
I think all and any of the martial arts can attract the person who has an inflated ego and wants boasting/bullying rights over others. One thing I've found is that anyone who says they are a 'cagefighter' very likely isn't as the genuine article will say they are a fighter or they fight MMA. Again as with all martial arts there are going to be the McDojos and the people who instil the wrong attitude. I do hope though you get to meet some of the 'good guys'.
OP
kidswarrior
Senior Master
- Thread Starter
- #74
I have come to believe Tez3, among other posters of similar opinion, is right. I admittedly used to think MMA fighters were all rude and arrogant. But I recently have interacted with two different MMA training studios in the area, which just happen to be back to back on the same lot. One fits the ugly stereotype :whip: but the other, which is also growing like crazy--I've sent some of my students there who realize they don't want to do TMA--is run by some of the most experienced, humble, respectful fight veterans I've met. So of course, all their fighters exhibit the same attitudes. :asian:
Xue Sheng
All weight is underside
I have come to believe Tez3, among other posters of similar opinion, is right. I admittedly used to think MMA fighters were all rude and arrogant. But I recently have interacted with two different MMA training studios in the area, which just happen to be back to back on the same lot. One fits the ugly stereotype :whip: but the other, which is also growing like crazy--I've sent some of my students there who realize they don't want to do TMA--is run by some of the most experienced, humble, respectful fight veterans I've met. So of course, all their fighters exhibit the same attitudes. :asian:
Yup
There is a MMA school near me and the guy that runs it and is the head instructor I have a lot of respect for and if I were younger I'd go train with him. He is just plane fascinated with all things Martial Arts he was asking all sorts of questions about CMA and I was asking all sorts of questions about MMA and it was a great meeting, and his students seem much the same.
But in just about anything that can be classified as a martial art it has been my experience that the real deals tend to be to busy training to give anyone a hard time and the want-to be types tend to try and make up for lack of skill with excessive use of mouth.
Thread necro!!
Well, I voted that it has mostly helped. May seem odd, given that I practice what are considered traditional martial arts, but I feel that it has helped.
Firstly, it has opened a lot of people up to martial arts in general. Boxing and wrestling really did not do that in the same way. MMA has the benefit of being drawn from divergent styles, thus people will want to know, 'where did he learn that move?' or 'what styles did she train in to get that skilled?'
As others have pointed out, it has brought about some needed self examinaiton to the martial arts.
I have not watched a lot of mma, but I have watched some, and as a TMA guy, I really enjoyed examining what was being done on the mat and trying to ID the styles that contributed to a fighter's skills.
In the end, things come along and shake things up. Things improve, then plateau, then another shake up happens. We all look at Judo as a traditional art, but Kano was revolutionary in his day. Bruce Lee shook things up later. Now MMA. Each shake up results in advances and improvements across the arts. Who knows when or what the next one will be, but I look forward to it.
Daniel
Well, I voted that it has mostly helped. May seem odd, given that I practice what are considered traditional martial arts, but I feel that it has helped.
Firstly, it has opened a lot of people up to martial arts in general. Boxing and wrestling really did not do that in the same way. MMA has the benefit of being drawn from divergent styles, thus people will want to know, 'where did he learn that move?' or 'what styles did she train in to get that skilled?'
As others have pointed out, it has brought about some needed self examinaiton to the martial arts.
I have not watched a lot of mma, but I have watched some, and as a TMA guy, I really enjoyed examining what was being done on the mat and trying to ID the styles that contributed to a fighter's skills.
In the end, things come along and shake things up. Things improve, then plateau, then another shake up happens. We all look at Judo as a traditional art, but Kano was revolutionary in his day. Bruce Lee shook things up later. Now MMA. Each shake up results in advances and improvements across the arts. Who knows when or what the next one will be, but I look forward to it.
Daniel
WhiteLotus
White Belt
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I think it has generally hurt the community. The MMA fights or the so called, "Ultimate Fighter Fights" are a sport fighting and not a combative fighting. They are mostly structured by complex rules and guidelines that make many traditional fighting techniques not allowed. So really it tends to drift away from traditional martial arts. Also in many of these fights it seems as if the more complex techniques of some styles are stripped away for the simple and basic moves in the ring. I also see very little blocking and stances are usually weak. this implies that such fighting is the way to go, but in the street and reality it is not.
Nolerama
Master Black Belt
I came from a TMA background, and went into MMA.
I've been exposed to a lot of ideas from a lot of different arts and use MMA as the vehicle in which to apply functional MA technique in a competitive setting.
In response to White Lotus: While I like the competitive format that MMA offers, it does put into harsh realization that there are SD aspects not readily trained for in MMA competition. However, anyone training in MMA knows for sure that there are tech applicable to SD, in conjunction with MMA-competition. I'm skeptical of anyone saying that hurts the MA community. I think physical ability, knowlege of functional technique, and competitive edge are desired traits in all forms of combat.
Take those three traits back to a TMA school, and you have yourself a very knowlegeable, functional martial artist within that art.
There was a time that I swore off TKD, saying it wouldn't help in any way, shape or form. I abhorred aikido because it just didn't seem real to me. I didn't believe in ninjitsu because I grew up believing that ninjas simply didn't exist.
After a few years in MMA, there's a ton of concepts taken from those arts, and found in the most peculiar places. I have grown (with the help of many folks here at MT) to appreciate an aspect of what makes the MAs great: it's diversity. Think of each MA as a book. There's an entire library out there to figure out the best way to subdue your opponent, win a fight, or get out of a possibly sticky situation.
MMA is a medium in which each fighter formulates their own strategy with their own technique from varied arts. Personally, I think it's a major boost in MA interest.
I've been exposed to a lot of ideas from a lot of different arts and use MMA as the vehicle in which to apply functional MA technique in a competitive setting.
In response to White Lotus: While I like the competitive format that MMA offers, it does put into harsh realization that there are SD aspects not readily trained for in MMA competition. However, anyone training in MMA knows for sure that there are tech applicable to SD, in conjunction with MMA-competition. I'm skeptical of anyone saying that hurts the MA community. I think physical ability, knowlege of functional technique, and competitive edge are desired traits in all forms of combat.
Take those three traits back to a TMA school, and you have yourself a very knowlegeable, functional martial artist within that art.
There was a time that I swore off TKD, saying it wouldn't help in any way, shape or form. I abhorred aikido because it just didn't seem real to me. I didn't believe in ninjitsu because I grew up believing that ninjas simply didn't exist.
After a few years in MMA, there's a ton of concepts taken from those arts, and found in the most peculiar places. I have grown (with the help of many folks here at MT) to appreciate an aspect of what makes the MAs great: it's diversity. Think of each MA as a book. There's an entire library out there to figure out the best way to subdue your opponent, win a fight, or get out of a possibly sticky situation.
MMA is a medium in which each fighter formulates their own strategy with their own technique from varied arts. Personally, I think it's a major boost in MA interest.
blindsage
Master of Arts
It moves away from Traditional MAs? Like Muay Thai, Boxing, Jiu Jitsu, Greco-Roman Wrestling, Sambo, Kyokushinkai Karate, Judo?
While I do agree with much of what you say and feel that you said it well, I disagree with your conclusion that it has generally hurt the MA community. To a great extent, it seems to be slowly (or not so slowly) replacing wrestling. I do not hear teens talk about wrestlers anymore; UFC fighters are the talk of teens from what I have seen. And each of those fighters have techniques in their repitiore drawn from the classical martial arts.
Also, I think that in terms of traditional grappling arts, it has been a huge boon. Traditional western grappling has had little exposure, as the WWE/F and the WCW have been action oriented soap operas for longer than some UFC fans have been alive.
Yes, MMA drifts away from traditional martial arts in a variety of ways. But it never claimed to be traditional and it is a sport. But it still has the ability to lead people back to the donor arts, which are mostly traditional.
Daniel
