Gun laws in Australia

[drop bear]

You obviously have no idea what your talking about. So nobody can buy a gun on the street anywhere in Australia huh? BS you have plenty of illegal guns and gangs and drugs and crime just like everywhere else in the world.

I certainly can't.

You are welcome to try. Tell me how you get on.

I am certainly going to suggest it is harder to get a gun here than america.

 

[K-man]

You obviously have no idea what your talking about. So nobody can buy a gun on the street anywhere in Australia huh? BS you have plenty of illegal guns and gangs and drugs and crime just like everywhere else in the world.

Yes we do but I'll lay you London to a brick that it's a lot easier to get a gun illegally in the US than it is here. Drop Bear is right. Criminals are very wary of supplying firearms to people they don't know.

 

[ballen0351]

I certainly can't.

You are welcome to try. Tell me how you get on.

I am certainly going to suggest it is harder to get a gun here than america.

I never said it was or wast harder but your saying it's impossible and your either lying, just dont know any better or well I'm not allowed to say the other option

 

[ballen0351]

Yes we do but I'll lay you London to a brick that it's a lot easier to get a gun illegally in the US than it is here.
Drop Bear is right. Criminals are very wary of supplying firearms to people they don't know.

Are you a criminal? How do you know? For me it's very easy to get an illegal gun here because I know exactly where to go. For a normal non cop or non criminal like say my uncle he would have no clue what to do or where to go. What's easy or hard depends on the person

 

[billc]

Highest Crime Per Capita

1. Washington, D.C.: 1,243.7 violent crimes per 100,000 inhabitants
2. Tennessee: 643.6
3. Nevada: 607.6
4. Alaska: 603.2
5. New Mexico: 559.1
6. South Carolina: 558.8
7. Delaware: 547.4
8. Louisiana: 496.9
9. Florida: 487.1
10. Maryland: 476.8

In case you were wondering, California (423.1), New York (406.8) and Texas (408.6) didn't trail too far behind.
Lowest Crime Per Capita

1. Maine: 122.7
2. Vermont: 142.6
3. New Hampshire: 187.9
4. Virginia: 190.1
5. Wyoming: 201.4
6. Utah: 205.8
7. Idaho: 207.9
8. Kentucky: 222.6
9. Minnesota: 230.9
10. Hawaii: 239.2

Accuracy of Data
Crimes accounted for in the FBI report include murder and nonnegligent manslaughter, forcible rape, robbery, aggravated assault, property crime, burglary, and theft.
But before you pack your knapsack and take off for Maine, remember that the survey only accounts for crimes reported to police. Historically, fewer than half of all crimesare actually reported to police, according to The Associated Press.
It's also worth mentioning that the FBI's crime reporting program is only one of two statistical measures of crime levels issued by the Justice Department. The other measure, the National Crime Victimization Survey, is designed to capture crime data whether it is reported to police or not. That survey is based on interviews of crime victims.
That being said, it seems it's pretty safe to say that we shouldn't prance around at night and keep our doors unlocked in Washington D.C.

...

 

[K-man]

Are you a criminal? How do you know? For me it's very easy to get an illegal gun here because I know exactly where to go. For a normal non cop or non criminal like say my uncle he would have no clue what to do or where to go. What's easy or hard depends on the person

I have many cop friends one of whom was in charge of the area I reside.

 

[billc]

California (423.1), New York (406.8)

They have some of the most restrictive gun laws on the books...and New York used to have "Stop and Frisk," of people suspected of being criminals which scooped up a lot of guns from gang members...that is over now so expect their crime rate to go up...

 

[billc]

and from the gun grabber groups...

These two groups scored states according to their level of nutty gun control...the tighter the controls, the higher the grade they recieved...


Unfortunately, it simply showed that they are more concerned with banning guns than they are stopping murder...


Gun Control Scorecard Deserves Failing Grade | The Daily Caller


Demonstrating the absurdity of LCPGV’s and Brady’s scoring system, the five states that got the anti-gun groups’ highest grade (A-minus) had significantly higher murder rates in 2012, as compared to states that got a grade of “F”. The groups’ “A-minus” states and their murder rates were Maryland (6.3), California (5.0), New Jersey (4.4), Connecticut (4.1), and New York (3.5), for an average rate of 4.7. Meanwhile, Vermont (1.3), Utah (1.8), Idaho (1.8), Maine (1.9), Wyoming (2.4) and Montana (2.7) each got a “F,” for an average rate of 2.0.
The groups have never given a grade to the District of Columbia, the gun control laws of which historically have been the most severe in the nation, and the murder rate of which was, for many years, the highest of any major U.S. city. If they had given the city a grade, it would have had to have been “A” Double Plus Good, which would only have called attention to the laws’ Orwellian fabric.

 

[K-man]

That can also be the chicken and egg situation. Is the crime rate higher because of the gun laws or were the gun laws introduced as a response to higher crime rates?

But according to this list your theory doesn't hold up.

The most dangerous states in America

Tennessee, Nevada, Alaska, Oklahoma, Maryland, Florida, Louisiana, Delaware, South Carolina, and New Mexico are the states with the most violent crime.

So let's look at gun laws ...

10 states with the strictest gun laws | Deseret News

Pennsylvania, Illinois, Rhode Island, Maryland, Hawaii, Connecticut, New York, Massachusetts, New Jersey and California.

Only one State, Maryland, is on both lists. Pennsylvania according to you is a state with lower gun restrictions but according to this list it is in 10th spot on the strictest laws list and none of the states you list as most violent are in the top ten by this list.

Then we can look at gun violence.

States With the Most Gun Violence - 24/7 Wall St.

Georgia, Arkansas, Missouri, New Mexico, South Carolina, Mississippi, Arizona, Alabama, Alaska and Louisiana.

None of the states is on the restricted list and obviously Maryland has reduced the level of violence involving firearms by introducing its laws as it is not in the top ten.

But, Arizona is in your list and is listed top 10 for violence in this list.

What if we look at murder rates?

Murder Rates Nationally and By State | Death Penalty Information Center

Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, Michigan, South Carolina, Missouri, Maryland, Delaware,Tennessee and Arkansas.


In the list of states with the most murders just one of the strictest gun law states appear in the top ten.

And finally to look at the most gun friendly states.

#10 - Wisconsin | 10 states with the most lenient gun laws | Deseret News

Wisconsin, Idaho, Kentucky, Louisiana, Montana, North Dakota, Oklahoma, Arizona, Alaska and Utah.

Three of these in the top ten for murders and four in the top ten for violent crime.

I think these figures show the flaws in the arguement that more guns and less restrictions on firearms reduce the crime rate and vice versa.
:asian:

I forgot to look at gun ownership.

Top 10 states.

Alabama, Alaska, Arkansas, Idaho, Mississippi, Montana, North Dakota, South Dakota, West Virginia and Wyoming.

Four of these states figure in the most violence.

Bottom 10 states.

District of Colombia, California, Connecticut, Hawaii, Illinois, Maryland, Massachusetts, New Jersey, New York and Rhode Island.

None of these states figure in the most violence.

So now we look at the states with least murders.

Hawaii, Idaho, Iowa, Maine, Minnesota, New Hampshire, North Dakota, South Dakota, Vermont and Wyoming.

Three of these have lots of guns, the others are in the main lower than the US average.

Gun violence in the United States by state - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So if more guns equals less crime and less violence why doesn't it show in these figures?

Australian gun laws have achieved several things. We don't have handguns all over the country and we don't have military style weapons. We still have gun crime but at a very low level when compared to the US in general.

 

[ballen0351]

I have many cop friends one of whom was in charge of the area I reside.

And? That makes you an expert now? I bet they know neighborhoods and areas where the black market resides and they can get guns drugs or anything else they want

 

[K-man]

And? That makes you an expert now? I bet they know neighborhoods and areas where the black market resides and they can get guns drugs or anything else they want

No need for snide remarks. I don't claim to be an expert and I wouldn't have the first idea as to how to source drugs or a gun.

 

[ballen0351]

I wouldn't have the first idea as to how to source drugs or a gun.

Most people dont. That's the point. Most people here don't either. But I'm sure your less desirable citizens know right where to go

 

[billc]

Here you go...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/16/states-gun-violence_n_3091993.html

Based on data provided by the Center for American Progress, 24/7 Wall St. analyzed the 10 states with the most gun violence. These rankings were based on 10 different criteria, including 2010 firearm homicide deaths per 100,000 people and 2011 firearm-related aggravated assaults. Calculated by the Center, the average rank among all states for each criteria was used to determine the ranking. We also considered data from the FBI’s Uniform Crime Report, such as a state’s crime rate per 100,000 people and property crime rates, as well as the crime rates for large metropolitan areas. Gun laws by state were compiled by the NRA’s Institute for Legislative Action and various news outlets. All data are for the most recent available years.

Sooo...let's start looking for the anti-gun bias and distortions...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Center_for_American_Progress

Its President and chief executive officer is Neera Tanden, who worked for the Obamaand Clinton administrations and for Hillary Clinton’s campaigns.[SUP][6][/SUP] Its first President and chief executive officer was John Podesta, who served as chief of staff to then U.S. President Bill Clinton. Podesta remains with the organization as chairman of the board. The Center for American Progress has a campus outreach group, Campus Progress, and a sister advocacy organization, the Center for American Progress Action Fund. Citing Podesta's influence in the formation of theObama Administration, a November 2008 article in Time stated that "not since the Heritage Foundation helped guide Ronald Reagan's transition in 1981 has a single outside group held so much sway".[SUP][7][/SUP]

 

[billc]

District of Colombia, California, Connecticut, Hawaii, Illinois, Maryland, Massachusetts, New Jersey, New York and Rhode Island.

None of these states figure in the most violence.

District of Colombia...really? Illinois...home of Chiraq...New York...really?

Australian gun laws have achieved several things.

Actually, Australian culture achieved those things, not the gun laws...you are at a violence level around 1950s America...once you have big inner cities, with large and diverse minority communities riddled by drug gangs and children raising children on government welfare...we'll see...

You have guns, you just don't use them...

Death penalty by state...from your sources K-man...

[SIZE=+1]NATIONWIDE MURDER RATES[/SIZE]

---

BY 2012RANK, HIGHEST TO LOWEST
(2010 to 1996 Shown for Comparison)
MURDER RATES PER 100,000 PEOPLE

YEAR	2012	2011	2010	2009	2008	2007	2006	2005	2004	2003	2002	2001	2000	1999	1998	1997	1996
Louisiana	10.8	11.1	11.0	11.8	11.9	14.2	12.4	9.9	12.7	13	13.2	11.2	12.5	10.7	12.8	15.7	17.5
Mississippi	7.4	7.8	6.9	6.6	8.1	7.1	7.7	7.3	7.8	9.3	9.2	9.9	9	7.7	11.4	13.1	11.1
Alabama	7.1	6.2	5.7	6.8	7.6	8.9	8.3	8.2	5.6	6.6	6.8	8.5	7.4	7.9	8.1	9.9	10.4
Michigan	7.0	6.2	5.9	6.2	5.4	6.7	7.1	6.1	6.4	6.1	6.7	6.7	6.7	7	7.3	7.8	7.5
South Carolina	6.9	6.8	5.7	6.7	6.8	8	8.3	7.4	6.9	7.2	7.3	6.3	5.8	6.6	8	8.4	9
Missouri	6.5	6.1	7.0	6.5	7.7	6.5	6.3	6.9	6.2	5	5.8	6.6	6.2	6.6	7.3	7.9	8.1
Maryland	6.3	6.8	7.4	7.7	8.8	9.8	9.7	9.9	9.4	9.5	9.4	8.3	8.1	9	10	9.9	11.6
Delaware	6.2	5.3	5.7	4.6	6.5	4.3	4.9	4.4	2	2.9	3.2	2.9	3.2	3.2	2.8	2.5	4.3
Tennessee	6.0	5.9	5.6	7.4	6.6	6.4	6.8	7.2	5.9	6.8	7.2	7.4	7.2	7.1	8.5	9.5	9.5
Arkansas	5.9	5.4	4.6	6.2	5.7	6.7	7.3	6.7	6.4	6.4	5.2	5.5	6.3	5.6	8	9.9	8.7
Georgia	5.9	5.6	5.7	5.8	6.6	7.5	6.4	6.2	6.9	7.6	7.1	7.1	8	7.5	8.1	7.5	9.5
Illinois	5.8	6.1	5.5	6.0	6.1	5.9	6.1	6	6.1	7.1	7.5	7.9	7.2	7.7	8.4	9.2	10
Oklahoma	5.7	5.6	5.2	6.3	5.8	6.1	5.8	5.3	5.3	5.9	4.7	5.3	5.3	6.9	6.1	6.9	6.8
New Mexico	5.6	7.6	6.8	9.9	7.2	8.2	6.8	7.4	8.9	6	8.2	5.4	7.4	9.8	10.9	7.7	11.5
Arizona	5.5	6.1	6.4	5.8	6.3	7.4	7.5	7.5	7.2	7.9	7.1	7.5	7	8	8.1	8.2	8.5
Pennsylvania	5.4	5.0	5.1	5.3	5.6	5.8	5.9	6.1	5.2	5.3	5.1	5.3	4.9	4.9	5.3	5.9	5.7
Florida	5.2	5.2	5.2	5.5	6.4	6.6	6.2	5	5.4	5.4	5.5	5.3	5.6	6.7	6.5	6.9	7.5
California	5.0	4.8	4.8	5.3	5.8	6.2	6.8	6.9	6.7	6.8	6.8	6.4	6.1	6	6.6	8	9.1
North Carolina	4.9	5.2	5.0	5.2	6.5	6.5	6.1	6.7	6.2	6.1	6.6	6.2	7	7.2	8.1	8.3	8.5
Indiana	4.7	4.7	4.1	4.9	5.1	5.6	5.8	5.7	5.1	5.5	5.9	6.8	5.8	6.6	7.7	7.3	7.2
Kentucky	4.5	3.5	4.3	4.3	4.6	4.8	4	4.6	5.7	4.6	4.5	4.7	4.8	5.4	4.6	5.8	5.9
Nevada	4.5	5.1	5.8	5.9	6.3	7.5	9	8.5	7.4	8.8	8.3	8.5	6.5	9.1	9.7	11.2	13.7
New Jersey	4.4	4.3	4.2	3.7	4.3	4.4	4.9	4.8	4.5	4.7	3.9	4	3.4	3.5	4	4.2	4.2
Texas	4.4	4.4	4.9	5.4	5.6	5.9	5.9	6.2	6.1	6.4	6	6.2	5.9	6.1	6.8	6.8	7.7
Ohio	4.3	4.3	4.2	4.6	4.7	4.5	4.7	5.1	4.5	4.6	4.6	4	3.7	3.5	4	4.7	4.8
Alaska	4.1	4.1	4.3	3.1	4.1	6.4	5.4	4.8	5.6	6	5.1	6.1	4.3	8.6	6.7	8.9	7.4
Connecticut	4.1	3.6	3.7	3.0	3.5	3	3.1	2.9	2.6	3	2.3	3.1	2.9	3.3	4.1	3.8	4.8
North Dakota	4.0	3.5	1.5	1.9	0.5	1.9	1.3	1.1	1.4	1.9	0.8	1.1	0.6	1.6	1.1	0.9	2.2
West Virginia	3.9	4.7	3.1	4.6	3.3	3.5	4.1	4.4	3.7	3.5	3.2	2.2	2.5	4.4	4.3	4.1	3.8
Virginia	3.8	3.8	4.7	4.7	4.7	5.3	5.2	6.1	5.2	5.6	5.3	5.1	5.7	5.7	6.2	7.2	7.5
New York	3.5	3.9	4.5	4.0	4.3	4.2	4.8	4.5	4.6	4.9	4.7	5	5	5	5.1	6	7.4
Rhode Island	3.2	1.9	2.8	3.0	2.8	1.8	2.6	3.2	2.4	2.3	3.8	3.7	4.3	3.6	2.4	2.5	2.5
Colorado	3.1	3.0	2.6	3.2	3.2	3.1	3.3	3.7	4.4	3.9	4	3.6	3.1	4.6	4.6	4	4.7
South Dakota	3.0	2.4	2.8	3.7	3.2	2.1	1.2	2.3	2.3	1.3	1.4	0.9	0.9	2.5	1.4	1.4	1.2
Wisconsin	3.0	2.4	2.7	2.6	2.6	3.3	3	3.5	2.8	3.3	2.8	3.6	3.2	3.4	3.6	4	4.2
Washington	3.0	2.4	2.3	2.9	2.9	2.7	3	3.3	3.1	3	3	3	3.3	3	3.9	4.3	4.6
Kansas	2.9	3.9	3.4	4.4	4	3.9	4.6	3.7	4.5	4.5	2.9	3.4	6.3	6	5.9	6	6.6
Nebraska	2.9	3.7	3.0	2.3	3.8	3.8	2.8	2.5	2.3	3.2	2.8	2.5	3.7	3.6	3.1	3	2.9
Montana	2.7	2.9	2.5	3.3	2.4	1.5	1.8	1.9	3.2	3.3	1.8	3.8	1.8	2.6	4.1	4.8	3.9
Wyoming	2.4	3.2	1.4	2.0	1.9	3.1	1.7	2.7	2.2	2.8	3	1.8	2.4	2.3	4.8	3.5	3.3
Oregon	2.4	2.2	2.5	2.3	2.2	1.9	2.3	2.2	2.5	1.9	2	2.4	2	2.7	3.8	2.9	4
Hawaii	2.1	1.5	1.8	1.8	1.9	1.7	1.6	1.9	2.6	1.7	1.9	2.6	2.9	3.7	2	4	3.4
Maine	1.9	2.0	1.8	2.0	2.4	1.6	1.7	1.4	1.4	1.2	1.1	1.4	1.2	2.2	2	2	2
Massachusetts	1.8	2.8	3.3	2.6	2.6	2.9	2.9	2.7	2.6	2.2	2.7	2.3	2	2	2	1.9	2.6
Idaho	1.8	2.2	1.4	1.6	1.5	3.3	2.5	2.4	2.2	1.8	2.7	2.3	1.2	2	2.9	3.2	3.6
Utah	1.8	1.8	1.9	1.4	1.4	2.2	1.8	2.3	1.9	2.5	2	3	1.9	2.1	3.1	2.4	3.2
Minnesota	1.8	1.4	1.8	1.4	2.1	2.2	2.4	2.2	2.2	2.5	2.2	2.4	3.1	2.8	2.6	2.8	3.6
Iowa	1.5	1.4	1.2	1.3	2.5	1.2	1.8	1.3	1.6	1.6	1.5	1.7	1.6	1.5	1.9	1.8	1.9
Vermont	1.3	1.8	1.1	1.3	2.7	1.9	1.9	1.3	2.6	2.3	2.1	1.1	1.5	2.9	2.6	1.5	1.9
New Hampshire	1.1	1.2	1.0	0.8	1	1.1	1	1.4	1.4	1.4	0.9	1.4	1.8	1.5	1.5	1.4	1.7

Looking at the table you linked to K-man...murder rates are all down from 1996...in all the states...while gun ownership increased around the country including all of the states having some sort of carry provision for guns...


Looking at the states with the most gun violence...you would have to look at the biggest city in the state...I would imagine...drugs and gangs account for the gun violence...which would mean that those folks aren't allowed to own guns at all...and yet...

Alabama for example...

http://blog.al.com/montgomery/2013/07/what_is_causing_the_spike_in_v.html

MONTGOMERY, Alabama -- Violent crime is on the rise in the city of Montgomery, but no one seems to have a concrete answer as to why.
The city has already recorded more homicides this year than it did in all of 2012 or any year since 2007.
According to the Montgomery Police Department, most of the homicides are related to drug activity, and a criminologist at Auburn University at Montgomery said that makes sense following the country’s recent economic downturn.

 

[drop bear]

Most people dont. That's the point. Most people here don't either. But I'm sure your less desirable citizens know right where to go

Really. How would you know?

 

[ballen0351]

Really. How would you know?

Because most people are not criminals and don't think that way. .oat people I talk to have no idea the crime that goes on blocks from their back yards they believe crime only happens in the big nasty city like Washington DC and Baltimore. When I tell then we just had a homicide two blocks over they are shocked. When I tell then you can buy any drug imaginable from an apartment complex down the street they freak out. When I tell people we bust prostitutes near there favorite restaurant on main street they have no clue.

 

[PhotonGuy]

Highest Crime Per Capita

• Washington, D.C.: 1,243.7 violent crimes per 100,000 inhabitants
• Tennessee: 643.6
• Nevada: 607.6
• Alaska: 603.2
• New Mexico: 559.1
• South Carolina: 558.8
• Delaware: 547.4
• Louisiana: 496.9
• Florida: 487.1
• Maryland: 476.8

In case you were wondering, California (423.1), New York (406.8) and Texas (408.6) didn't trail too far behind.
Lowest Crime Per Capita

• Maine: 122.7
• Vermont: 142.6
• New Hampshire: 187.9
• Virginia: 190.1
• Wyoming: 201.4
• Utah: 205.8
• Idaho: 207.9
• Kentucky: 222.6
• Minnesota: 230.9
• Hawaii: 239.2

Accuracy of Data
Crimes accounted for in the FBI report include murder and nonnegligent manslaughter, forcible rape, robbery, aggravated assault, property crime, burglary, and theft.
But before you pack your knapsack and take off for Maine, remember that the survey only accounts for crimes reported to police. Historically, fewer than half of all crimesare actually reported to police, according to The Associated Press.
It's also worth mentioning that the FBI's crime reporting program is only one of two statistical measures of crime levels issued by the Justice Department. The other measure, the National Crime Victimization Survey, is designed to capture crime data whether it is reported to police or not. That survey is based on interviews of crime victims.
That being said, it seems it's pretty safe to say that we shouldn't prance around at night and keep our doors unlocked in Washington D.C.

There you have it. D.C. is rated as the place with the most crime in the USA and D.C. has the most restrictive gun laws, more restrictive than any state although D.C. is technically not a state. Maine has the lowest crime rate followed by Vermont. Both Maine and Vermont are very gun friendly. In Vermont you can even carry a concealed handgun without a permit.

 

[drop bear]

Because most people are not criminals and don't think that way. .oat people I talk to have no idea the crime that goes on blocks from their back yards they believe crime only happens in the big nasty city like Washington DC and Baltimore. When I tell then we just had a homicide two blocks over they are shocked. When I tell then you can buy any drug imaginable from an apartment complex down the street they freak out. When I tell people we bust prostitutes near there favorite restaurant on main street they have no clue.

Yeah but you don't have the gun laws to put a restriction on sales. So of course you would think it is easier to get.

Our situation is different.

 

[Kurai]

I'll add, that as a Nevada resident some gun laws are at a county level. You have a higher violent crime rate in Clark County (Las Vegas) than other counties in the state. Gun laws are more strict in that particular county than anywhere else in the state.

 

[PhotonGuy]

I'll add, that as a Nevada resident some gun laws are at a county level. You have a higher violent crime rate in Clark County (Las Vegas) than other counties in the state. Gun laws are more strict in that particular county than anywhere else in the state.

Yes I believe Nye county has a lower crime rate than Clark County and Nye county has less restrictive gun laws. Also Las Vegas is located in Clark County and I wouldn't be surprised about Vegas having a higher crime rate, it being a big city and all, and they call it sin city for a reason.