Gun laws in Australia

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PhotonGuy

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From what I know, gun laws in Australia weren't all that restrictive until around the mid 80s when there was a rise in violent crime and again in the 90s with all these high profile murders. I don't know what the crime rate in Australia is now but considering the fact that the country was a prison, Im not all that surprised about the crime.
 

Grenadier

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From what I know, gun laws in Australia weren't all that restrictive until around the mid 80s when there was a rise in violent crime and again in the 90s with all these high profile murders.

You can still get firearms in Australia. If anything, lawful gun ownership is back to same levels as it was before the Port Arthur Massacre.

I don't like the idea that you have to jump through a lot of hoops to be able to lawfully own firearms, and I hope that they can someday reverse this, but in the meantime, it's not nearly as bad as other gun-free "paradises," such as Jamaica...

Of course, this doesn't include the unlawful firearms ownership that seems to be increasing amongst certain factions, but that's a discussion for later.

Regarding crime rates, just a quick comparison:

Australia and United States Compared by Crime: NationMaster.com

It's certainly true that Australia has significantly higher crime rates in certain categories such as burglary, and also true that the US has significantly higher crime rates in certain categories such as murder. At the same time, certain crime rates, such as assaults and rapes, are virtually identical.


I don't know what the crime rate in Australia is now but considering the fact that the country was a prison, Im not all that surprised about the crime.

Broad brush painting isn't going to win the argument here. While it's true that it was once a penal colony, that doesn't apply anymore.

Otherwise, one could apply this kind of bashing to any nation. After all, would it be fair to judge the USA in a similar manner, because President Roosevelt put American citizens in detention camps simply because they had Japanese blood in them?
 

mook jong man

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From what I know, gun laws in Australia weren't all that restrictive until around the mid 80s when there was a rise in violent crime and again in the 90s with all these high profile murders. I don't know what the crime rate in Australia is now but considering the fact that the country was a prison, Im not all that surprised about the crime.

Guess what champ?

Where do you think the English used to send the convicts before they started sending them to Australia?
One guess buddy.......... that's right America.

We got all the good looking ones and you lot got all the crazy ones.
I'm not all that surprised that you have so many serial killers running around , I mean considering you were once a prison colony yourselves.
 

Chris Parker

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From what I know, gun laws in Australia weren't all that restrictive until around the mid 80s when there was a rise in violent crime and again in the 90s with all these high profile murders. I don't know what the crime rate in Australia is now but considering the fact that the country was a prison, Im not all that surprised about the crime.

So, even after our recent PM conversation, you're happy to insult an entire nation? Especially when you begin by saying you don't know what you're talking about in the first place? Really?

I'm going to be a little blunt. You don't know what on earth you're talking about. You don't know what our current laws are, what they were, why and when they changed, what effects the changes had, or anything else… so try to refrain from any labelling of crime or culture here, deal?

Actually, while I'm here, I'm going to ask something… try not to be offended by this, as I'm genuinely asking. Is there something that we should know about you? Is there some form of autism or similar that we're unaware of? You've started a number of threads with a seemingly paranoid psyche behind them (the current one of "speaking your mind", which misses a lot of reality to it, comes to mind), as well as quite a few that show a more fantasy-infused desire for the way you want the world to work, such as asking if things like Force powers from Star Wars are something you could really attain… then there's the lack of any sense of tact that is shown in posts like this. If there is something we should be aware of, please let us know… it'll certainly help in communicating with you… if not, then, well, you might want to think things through before you hit "post"… particularly focusing on whether it's really saying what you want it to, and taking note of how it is likely to be received.

You can still get firearms in Australia. If anything, lawful gun ownership is back to same levels as it was before the Port Arthur Massacre.

I don't like the idea that you have to jump through a lot of hoops to be able to lawfully own firearms, and I hope that they can someday reverse this, but in the meantime, it's not nearly as bad as other gun-free "paradises," such as Jamaica...

To be honest, Grenadier… we'd probably consider such a reversal a major step backwards. On a number of levels. We don't consider that any "freedoms" are being infringed or restricted, and really get quite amused at the argument from our American cousins, when all's said and done…
 

drop bear

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From what I know, gun laws in Australia weren't all that restrictive until around the mid 80s when there was a rise in violent crime and again in the 90s with all these high profile murders. I don't know what the crime rate in Australia is now but considering the fact that the country was a prison, Im not all that surprised about the crime.

Would you be surprised that coming from a prison. We now are in the top ten most livable cities. Top ten in freedom. And one of the least corrupt governments.
 

Dirty Dog

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From what I know, gun laws in Australia weren't all that restrictive until around the mid 80s when there was a rise in violent crime and again in the 90s with all these high profile murders. I don't know what the crime rate in Australia is now but considering the fact that the country was a prison, Im not all that surprised about the crime.

OK... so ONE of the SIX colonies was a penal colony. And the exile of prisoners to Australia ended in the mid-19th Century.

What the hell do you think that has to do with crime rates 150 years later?
 

K-man

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OK... so ONE of the SIX colonies was a penal colony. And the exile of prisoners to Australia ended in the mid-19th Century.

What the hell do you think that has to do with crime rates 150 years later?
Well it's a nice thought but in reality convicts were sent to five colonies. Not so many to Queensland and Victoria but more to New South Wales, Tasmania and Western Australia. And, for what it's worth, one of my forebears was a convict.
:asian:
 

Dirty Dog

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Well it's a nice thought but in reality convicts were sent to five colonies. Not so many to Queensland and Victoria but more to New South Wales, Tasmania and Western Australia. And, for what it's worth, one of my forebears was a convict.
:asian:

OK, so more than one. You live and learn.
I still don't see any connection between criminals being exiled in the 18th Century and crime rates today. It's not like being a bank robber is hereditary.
 

billc

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Gun violence,in Australia is isolated, for now, in their biker gangs and immigrant communities...and there have been public shootings since Port Aurther. another point...Australia didn't have much gun crime to begin with and as has been pointed out, in other threads, New Zealand doesn't have much gun crime either and they didn't increase their gun control.measures...

And another point...America's gun crime rate also dropped significantly even though our gun ownership rate is increasing...we also have a border with an almost failed state, Mexico, and drug gangs and cartels as well as big cities run by democrats are where our gun violence is usually located...in fact...gun violence here can be traced to small, multi block areas in those cities...the rest of the country is good...

And the main reason they don't have mass shootings in Australia...no one has decided,to do them lately...they still have,handguns and long guns...they just haven't had anyone do it lately...

Some,thoughts,on crime stats...

http://www.ncpa.org/sub/dpd/index.php?Article_ID=17847

It is a common fantasy that gun bans make society safer. In 2002 -- five years after enacting its gun ban -- the Australian Bureau of Criminology acknowledged there is no correlation between gun control and the use of firearms in violent crime. In fact, the percent of murders committed with a firearm was the highest it had ever been in 2006 (16.3 percent), says the D.C. Examiner.


Even Australia's Bureau of Crime Statistics and Research acknowledges that the gun ban had no significant impact on the amount of gun-involved crime:


In 2006, assault rose 49.2 percent and robbery 6.2 percent.
Sexual assault -- Australia's equivalent term for rape -- increased 29.9 percent.
Overall, Australia's violent crime rate rose 42.2 percent.
Moreover, Australia and the United States -- where no gun-ban exists -- both experienced similar decreases in murder rates:


Between 1995 and 2007, Australia saw a 31.9 percent decrease; without a gun ban, America's rate dropped 31.7 percent.
During the same time period, all other violent crime indices increased in Australia: assault rose 49.2 percent and robbery 6.2 percent.
Sexual assault -- Australia's equivalent term for rape -- increased 29.9 percent.
Overall, Australia's violent crime rate rose 42.2 percent.
At the same time, U.S. violent crime decreased 31.8 percent: rape dropped 19.2 percent; robbery decreased 33.2 percent; aggravated assault dropped 32.2 percent.
Australian women are now raped over three times as often as American women.

While this doesn't prove that more guns would impact crime rates, it does prove that gun control is a flawed policy. Furthermore, this highlights the most important point: gun banners promote failed policy regardless of the consequences to the people who must live with them, says the Examiner.
 
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PhotonGuy

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So, even after our recent PM conversation, you're happy to insult an entire nation? Especially when you begin by saying you don't know what you're talking about in the first place? Really?

I'm going to be a little blunt. You don't know what on earth you're talking about. You don't know what our current laws are, what they were, why and when they changed, what effects the changes had, or anything else… so try to refrain from any labelling of crime or culture here, deal?

Actually, while I'm here, I'm going to ask something… try not to be offended by this, as I'm genuinely asking. Is there something that we should know about you? Is there some form of autism or similar that we're unaware of? You've started a number of threads with a seemingly paranoid psyche behind them (the current one of "speaking your mind", which misses a lot of reality to it, comes to mind), as well as quite a few that show a more fantasy-infused desire for the way you want the world to work, such as asking if things like Force powers from Star Wars are something you could really attain… then there's the lack of any sense of tact that is shown in posts like this. If there is something we should be aware of, please let us know… it'll certainly help in communicating with you… if not, then, well, you might want to think things through before you hit "post"… particularly focusing on whether it's really saying what you want it to, and taking note of how it is likely to be received.



To be honest, Grenadier… we'd probably consider such a reversal a major step backwards. On a number of levels. We don't consider that any "freedoms" are being infringed or restricted, and really get quite amused at the argument from our American cousins, when all's said and done…


Since you've read my "speak your mind" post than that will tell you why I say what I say. I say what I say because I have a right to. I don't care if I embarrass myself on some internet board. If anything, my "speak your mind," thread is very realistic, in most places in this world you are allowed to speak your mind.
 
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PhotonGuy

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So, even after our recent PM conversation, you're happy to insult an entire nation? Especially when you begin by saying you don't know what you're talking about in the first place? Really?

I'm going to be a little blunt. You don't know what on earth you're talking about. You don't know what our current laws are, what they were, why and when they changed, what effects the changes had, or anything else… so try to refrain from any labelling of crime or culture here, deal?

Actually, while I'm here, I'm going to ask something… try not to be offended by this, as I'm genuinely asking. Is there something that we should know about you? Is there some form of autism or similar that we're unaware of? You've started a number of threads with a seemingly paranoid psyche behind them (the current one of "speaking your mind", which misses a lot of reality to it, comes to mind), as well as quite a few that show a more fantasy-infused desire for the way you want the world to work, such as asking if things like Force powers from Star Wars are something you could really attain… then there's the lack of any sense of tact that is shown in posts like this. If there is something we should be aware of, please let us know… it'll certainly help in communicating with you… if not, then, well, you might want to think things through before you hit "post"… particularly focusing on whether it's really saying what you want it to, and taking note of how it is likely to be received.



To be honest, Grenadier… we'd probably consider such a reversal a major step backwards. On a number of levels. We don't consider that any "freedoms" are being infringed or restricted, and really get quite amused at the argument from our American cousins, when all's said and done…

Furthermore I do find it interesting that you would post on, or even visit a firearms board since you've made it clear that your hoplophobic (gun phobic).
 

Steve

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Furthermore I do find it interesting that you would post on, or even visit a firearms board since you've made it clear that your hoplophobic (gun phobic).
Of all the Australians in this forum, Chris is the guy I'd pick for most likely to own a gun.
 

ballen0351

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Since you've read my "speak your mind" post than that will tell you why I say what I say. I say what I say because I have a right to. I don't care if I embarrass myself on some internet board. If anything, my "speak your mind," thread is very realistic, in most places in this world you are allowed to speak your mind.
Except you have no right to speak your mind on a privately owned forum you might want to remember that
 

K-man

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Since you've read my "speak your mind" post than that will tell you why I say what I say. I say what I say because I have a right to. I don't care if I embarrass myself on some internet board. If anything, my "speak your mind," thread is very realistic, in most places in this world you are allowed to speak your mind.
I beg to disagree. In most places in the world speaking your mind if it is contra to local law or custom will have you incarcerated or killed. We are fortunate to live in countries where free speech is allowed. Don't abuse the right you have been given.
:asian:
 

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Since you've read my "speak your mind" post than that will tell you why I say what I say. I say what I say because I have a right to.

Martialtalk.com does allow quite a bit of leeway when it comes to people discussing heated topics, and people are encouraged to contribute to the discussions if such discussion is productive.

And yes, it does specifically say in the Constitution:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

I am going to give you a friendly reminder, though, that Martialtalk.com and its staff are NOT Congress, and that your First Amendment rights do not apply to a privately owned forum. If you post something that is excessively offensive, and delves into attacks and flame, they can certainly remove such material, or even the user, if things get out of hand.

I don't care if I embarrass myself on some internet board. If anything, my "speak your mind," thread is very realistic, in most places in this world you are allowed to speak your mind.

The forum staff does care, since they are here to help promote the civil discussion of things. Again, while most places in the world do allow you to speak your mind, privately owned forums are not in the category of "most places."
 

Chris Parker

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Since you've read my "speak your mind" post than that will tell you why I say what I say. I say what I say because I have a right to. I don't care if I embarrass myself on some internet board. If anything, my "speak your mind," thread is very realistic, in most places in this world you are allowed to speak your mind.

No, reading your thread told me that you don't seem able to comprehend social cues, consequences, or differentiate contexts. It is not realistic (the way you present your argument there, or here), nor is it accurate.

Furthermore I do find it interesting that you would post on, or even visit a firearms board since you've made it clear that your hoplophobic (gun phobic).

Please. For one thing, the reason I posted on this thread is due to your completely ludicrous comments on Australian gun laws and culture, as well as a massive slur on the populace here. You're right in that I'd normally leave this area alone, as it's more commonly populated by people who are of the "guns are good, everyone should have 10!" ideology, which I don't agree with, but have no issue with others beliefs on. I'm hardly "hoplophobic" (some information for you… it's not a real phobia, it's a term coined by someone who was very pro-gun, but had no real understanding of psychology, no training thereof, and just wanted a way to label those who went against his beliefs), as the term is designed to infer someone who has an unrealistic/irrational fear of gadgets, most specifically firearms, which is far from the case with myself. I have no love of guns, but that's hardly the same thing (oh, and for the record, I'd actually consider myself an amateur hoplologist… if you want a new term to look up…).

Of all the Australians in this forum, Chris is the guy I'd pick for most likely to own a gun.

Nah, give me a sword, any day… which, for the record, has about the same amount of restrictions/hoops to jump through to get the licence for as firearms here (specifically Victoria… the laws change from state to state).

Except you have no right to speak your mind on a privately owned forum you might want to remember that

I beg to disagree. In most places in the world speaking your mind if it is contra to local law or custom will have you incarcerated or killed. We are fortunate to live in countries where free speech is allowed. Don't abuse the right you have been given.
:asian:

Martialtalk.com does allow quite a bit of leeway when it comes to people discussing heated topics, and people are encouraged to contribute to the discussions if such discussion is productive.

And yes, it does specifically say in the Constitution:



I am going to give you a friendly reminder, though, that Martialtalk.com and its staff are NOT Congress, and that your First Amendment rights do not apply to a privately owned forum. If you post something that is excessively offensive, and delves into attacks and flame, they can certainly remove such material, or even the user, if things get out of hand.



The forum staff does care, since they are here to help promote the civil discussion of things. Again, while most places in the world do allow you to speak your mind, privately owned forums are not in the category of "most places."

With these three quotes, thank you gents, that's precisely what I was meaning when I mentioned to PhotonGuy that his other thread is not realistic. PhotonGuy, listen to them.
 
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PhotonGuy

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Martialtalk.com does allow quite a bit of leeway when it comes to people discussing heated topics, and people are encouraged to contribute to the discussions if such discussion is productive.

And yes, it does specifically say in the Constitution:



I am going to give you a friendly reminder, though, that Martialtalk.com and its staff are NOT Congress, and that your First Amendment rights do not apply to a privately owned forum. If you post something that is excessively offensive, and delves into attacks and flame, they can certainly remove such material, or even the user, if things get out of hand.



The forum staff does care, since they are here to help promote the civil discussion of things. Again, while most places in the world do allow you to speak your mind, privately owned forums are not in the category of "most places."

As Martialtalk.com is a privately owned board they do have the right to censor certain stuff and the forum rules state what you can and can't say here. Some of the rules say that you can't use profanity or post links to porn or post inappropriate pictures or advertise or post any kind of derogatory comments about a race or ethnicity. As it is, I don't post those kinds of things anyway. In the USA though you are allowed to state your opinion and that is how the country is run and how it evolves, people state their opinion and that influences laws that are passed or repealed. Some people's opinions you might say are absurd but people do have a right to say what's on their mind, as absurd as it might be.
 
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PhotonGuy

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Guess what champ?

Where do you think the English used to send the convicts before they started sending them to Australia?
One guess buddy.......... that's right America.

We got all the good looking ones and you lot got all the crazy ones.
I'm not all that surprised that you have so many serial killers running around , I mean considering you were once a prison colony yourselves.

The English might've sent some convicts to America but most of the people coming to America from England and other places in Europe were settlers looking for a better life. That is what most of the modern day white American population is descended from.
 
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