Buying Dan rank over the Internet

[RyuShiKan]

Do you think buying martial arts dan rank over the Internet is a legitimate way to earn rank ?

 

[Mon Mon]

Buying Rank is one thing but having the skill to live up to your rank is another

 

[RyuShiKan]

Originally posted by Mon Mon
Buying Rank is one thing but having the skill to live up to your rank is another

This is true.
However, I am interested in thoughts about buying rank over the Internet from someone you have never trained with.

 

[Matt Stone]

If I study art X, under Teacher A, then I earn what rank Teacher A grants me. If Teacher A refuses to teach me any more, test me any more, then either I am a worthless slug unworthy of further advancement, or my teacher is a worthless slug unworthy of further tuition from me.

I have a few choices. Find out if Teacher B of art X will take me as a student. Or I can go study art Y.

But should I go to Teacher C who teaches art Z and ask him if he will certify/recognize/promote me to the next rank in art X, even though Teacher C has never studied it at all?

And if I do, what does that make me? What does that make Teacher C?

Gambarimasu.
:asian:

 

[RyuShiKan]

Originally posted by Yiliquan1


And if I do, what does that make me? What does that make Teacher C?

It makes you a victim of people claiming to be martial artists when in actuality they are nothing more than dishonest “Dan Salesmen” that cheapen the MA thorugh their practices.

 

[arnisador]

As you asked the question--"buying rank"--the answer is obvious.

What about video evaluation more generally?

 

[RyuShiKan]

Originally posted by arnisador
As you asked the question--"buying rank"--the answer is obvious.

What about video evaluation more generally?

I don’t recommend learning from video and wouldn’t test someone that way either.
What would be on the testing video?
Kata only?
That's not much of a test.
I wouldn’t know how many takes were needed to get the kata right.
What if I wanted to ask a question and wanted an answer right away and didn’t want to give them the time to refer to their notes, the Internet or some book……..

 

[Matt Stone]

If a person were already of high skill, then video exchange between that person and someone either their peer or senior could be a useful tool for training (i.e. correcting minor faults, etc.).

I don't believe, however, that actual training can be effectively achieved via video... Too many little things will be completely missed without a live instructor there to point them out.

Gambarimasu.
:asian:

 

[RyuShiKan]

Originally posted by Yiliquan1
If a person were already of high skill, then video exchange between that person and someone either their peer or senior could be a useful tool for training (i.e. correcting minor faults, etc.).

I don't believe, however, that actual training can be effectively achieved via video... Too many little things will be completely missed without a live instructor there to point them out.

Gambarimasu.
:asian:

I agree.
IF the person has been exposed to the technique/kata in question then video is often a good reference………not a substitute.
However, learning correctly from video is impossible…….who will correct you if you do something wrong? How will you know you are doing anything wrong?

Learning and training requires the guidance and patience of a qualified instructor to actually be there and help you.

 

[Kirk]

Originally posted by RyuShiKan
However, learning correctly from video is impossible……

There are organizations that have video correspondence. You
have a video of the instruction per rank. You film yourself doing
what you've been "taught" via the tape, and they send you back
corrections, on video. Repeat until competency for that rank is
proven.

 

[RyuShiKan]

Originally posted by Kirk
There are organizations that have video correspondence. You
have a video of the instruction per rank. You film yourself doing
what you've been "taught" via the tape, and they send you back
corrections, on video. Repeat until competency for that rank is
proven.

I think it's more effective to have my teacher kicking my *** in person than via my Sony.
I get immediate "feedback" if you know what I mean. Plus my kicking *** is the shortest route to my brain.

 

[Matt Stone]

I disagree with "video teaching." Again, the teacher isn't there to correct what is being learned. Just not effective enough to warrant the effort of making videos, sending them in, waiting for them to be reviewed, getting the tape back, training again...

Gambarimasu.
:asian:

 

[Bob Hubbard]

I can relate to the immediate feedback part. Some arts just require it. Wing Chun for example seems to be very particular on exact positioning, which is hard to tell on a video tape (or book or web site for that matter).

I think its got a place as a learning tool, but not a testing tool. As was said, its too easy to edit things so you only show the best.

I hold several computer certifications....the ones I value are the ones whose tests I took under strict guidelines. The open book exams only tested me on if I could look stuff up. Its not the same.
IMHO.

:asian:

 

[RyuShiKan]

Originally posted by Kaith Rustaz


I hold several computer certifications....the ones I value are the ones whose tests I took under strict guidelines. The open book exams only tested me on if I could look stuff up. Its not the same.
IMHO.

:asian:

God how I only wish I could take a CompTia, CCNA or MCSA exam using an open book!

 

[Kirk]

Originally posted by RyuShiKan
I think it's more effective to have my teacher kicking my *** in person than via my Sony.
I get immediate "feedback" if you know what I mean.

That's how I'd prefer to learn as well. But for those in majorly
rural settings, video correspondence learning is decent to have
available.

 

[RyuShiKan]

Originally posted by Kirk
That's how I'd prefer to learn as well. But for those in majorly
rural settings, video correspondence learning is decent to have
available.

My suggestion to those folks is move to a civilized part of the world

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Originally posted by RyuShiKan
God how I only wish I could take a CompTia, CCNA or MCSA exam using an open book!

Brainbench.com supposed to be as hard...but in reality they are a joke.... I papered a wall with em once....LOL

I took the Win95 MCP before I took A+. I did an NT4 MCP prep test open book....didn't help. heh.

I'm working towards Adobe and Macromedia certs now....there is no place to really train in em locally, and the books/videos don't answer questions while they are on your mind. Same thing in the arts. I've watched some videos, got a ton of books, but without some immediate feedback you just don't know.

Try learning Iaido from a book....you can go thru the motions, but your angles and footwork will be off. Last WC lesson I has (few years back) I was constantly being corrected on posture, positioning, etc.

Medias a good reference, but to learn, you need a teacher.
:asian:

 

[Kirk]

The IKCA is one that a lot of internet friends have commented on what
a great video training course it is. I can't attest to it, since I
haven't studied it, but I've met a lot that have.

The CRAM books are excellent for cert information for testing.
But the MCSE is becoming pretty watered down, at least around
where I live. So many 3 month test passing courses going on,
providing MCSE's that know nothing. It sure decreases the value
of holding the cert.

And I agree .. brainbench is a joke.

 

[RyuShiKan]

I have always been one for "trial by fire" kind of training..........or like Nike says "Just Do It".

When I test my students I want to feel their technique myself and won't pass them unless it works on my.
Basically I am not going to send someone out in the world under the false illusion that his or her technique works unless it really does.
The only way I can ensure quality control is if they crank on me.
That is the main reason for testing them.......it's not about getting a new belt.

 

[Kirk]

Originally posted by RyuShiKan
I have always been one for "trial by fire" kind of training..........or like Nike says "Just Do It".

When I test my students I want to feel their technique myself and won't pass them unless it works on my.
Basically I am not going to send someone out in the world under the false illusion that his or her technique works unless it really does.
The only way I can ensure quality control is if they crank on me.
That is the main reason for testing them.......it's not about getting a new belt.

Definitely not about a new belt for myself. There's been times
that I don't understand certain things, and the only way my
instructor can explain it to me is if I really attack him in the manner
required by the technique. Maybe others don't need that? Some
learn by seeing, some by doing. I personally can't understand
learning it without feeling it, but maybe some can??