Two Taekwondo contestants have altercation before contest

Most likely nothing since USAT is not saying much about it. They tend to cover things up alot.
 
In almost any other sport I can think of you would be gone for a long time if you did that, no questions asked. I remember playing rugby league as a kid and a kid shoved a referee and was banned for life, a player at my brother's soccer club spat on another player and was banned for 2 years, why is tkd so different?
 
mango.man said:
After a bit of digging it has been determined that the suspect in this incident is from "Doral Taekwondo And Family Fitness" in Doral Florida, a suburb of Miami and a USAT registered school. http://www.doral-taekwondo.com/Home_Page.html and he is one of the captains of the school's demo team http://www.doralwolves.com/

I wonder what will come of both the punk and the school with regards to their USAT status?
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This is wrong! That is not the school he goes to. You should check your facts before posting. If you would like to know what school he attends then go to page 33 of the results from Nationals on the USAT home page. Shows who was DQ'ed. Give his name , state and abberviated school name.
 
What I would like to know is U.S.A.T. going to do anything about it? Why have they not been vocal and what is being done to help prevent this kind of action from happening at events?

Does anybody see where this could become a major problem in the sport if the NGB of this country does not step in and fix the bigger problem and that is getting back to the tenets and sportmanship and fair play. I guess for USAT fair play would be one of those words they are not familar with. I would like to see a course that is mandatory for all athlete to take about doing the right thing and how important fair play is and we as Martial sportsmans need to be above and have integrity whether we win or lose.

I have been an advocate of educating our player on the tenets of TKD why is the organization not doing this as well. There events they can make it happen, they can become a vocal voice in the relm of fair play to all the athlete just by being pro-active with education and fair play.
 
terryl965 said:
What I would like to know is U.S.A.T. going to do anything about it? Why have they not been vocal and what is being done to help prevent this kind of action from happening at events?

Does anybody see where this could become a major problem in the sport if the NGB of this country does not step in and fix the bigger problem and that is getting back to the tenets and sportmanship and fair play. I guess for USAT fair play would be one of those words they are not familar with. I would like to see a course that is mandatory for all athlete to take about doing the right thing and how important fair play is and we as Martial sportsmans need to be above and have integrity whether we win or lose.

I have been an advocate of educating our player on the tenets of TKD why is the organization not doing this as well. There events they can make it happen, they can become a vocal voice in the relm of fair play to all the athlete just by being pro-active with education and fair play.
Click to expand...

The Tenets are an ITF General Choi invention; it is not part of Kukki Taekwondo. You will not find them in the Kukkiwon Textbook for example. That doesn't mean that the values that the Tenets try to instill aren't a part of Taekwondo though.

What you are basically saying is that we should move away from the bad aspects of American sport culture and move back towards the positive aspects of Korean culture, politeness and respect being at the top of that. But in my mind, what is going on is a natural progression of the way things have been going for a while now. People want to instill "American" values into American Taekwondo, and they accomplished that by disrespecting their seniors and eliminating them. People cannot and should not be surprised if that sort of thinking filters down to the next generation.
 
puunui said:
The Tenets are an ITF General Choi invention; it is not part of Kukki Taekwondo. You will not find them in the Kukkiwon Textbook for example. That doesn't mean that the values that the Tenets try to instill aren't a part of Taekwondo though.

What you are basically saying is that we should move away from the bad aspects of American sport culture and move back towards the positive aspects of Korean culture, politeness and respect being at the top of that. But in my mind, what is going on is a natural progression of the way things have been going for a while now. People want to instill "American" values into American Taekwondo, and they accomplished that by disrespecting their seniors and eliminating them. People cannot and should not be surprised if that sort of thinking filters down to the next generation.
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but popular legend traces the tenets back to the Hwa Rang .....I think that has the KKW and actually TKD beat by a couple of years.

(not to mention the tenets mirror the warrior's code of just about any armed class throughout history all over the world)
 
puunui said:
People want to instill "American" values into American Taekwondo, and they accomplished that by disrespecting their seniors and eliminating them. People cannot and should not be surprised if that sort of thinking filters down to the next generation.
Click to expand...

I may have read that wrong or not how you meant it. Could you clarify a bit please.

I know if I had conduct like that not only would I be taken to task by my instructors but also by my fellow students, wife, mom/dad, inlaws and even my 10 year old. Right quick and in a hurry.
 
MaxiMe said:
I may have read that wrong or not how you meant it. Could you clarify a bit please. I know if I had conduct like that not only would I be taken to task by my instructors but also by my fellow students, wife, mom/dad, inlaws and even my 10 year old. Right quick and in a hurry.
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And at the same token, if I acted like how some American borns act towards their seniors, especially to Korean borns, I would also be taken to task not only by my instructors, but everyone else in my family as well. Where I come from, you just don't act like that towards seniors, teachers, parents, etc. no matter what you think they did to you. You cannot act one way towards seniors or teachers and then act surprised when similar or worse behavior happens down slope from you. Just something to think about, how the attitude of disrespect festers and grows.
 
puunui said:
What you are basically saying is that we should move away from the bad aspects of American sport culture and move back towards the positive aspects of Korean culture, politeness and respect being at the top of that.
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I think moving towards aspects such as politeness and respect would be an excellent idea, not that it began in Korea. We should also have an eye towards eliminating politics within the arts, unfair or racially discriminatory promotional practices, back door/airport/good-ole-boy promotions, embezzling funds and such things. Then it would all be groovy.
 
puunui said:
Where I come from, you just don't act like that towards seniors, teachers, parents, etc. no matter what you think they did to you.
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This is good upbringing, and has no unique connection to any culture, ethnicity, race, nation, or group. There are good and bad in all. Where I come from, in the rural American midwest, it's like you wrote above, and consistently enforced throughout my youth. But that doesn't mean there are not idiots from where I grew up or where you did. I think Taekwondo is good upbringing, but I agree completely with what you've said before that the choice of master is a vital one. You've commented often about the high quality of your seniors. I wonder if the master of the student accused of assault is surprised by what happened...whether he knew of his student's issues.
 
StudentCarl said:
This is good upbringing, and has no unique connection to any culture, ethnicity, race, nation, or group. There are good and bad in all. Where I come from, in the rural American midwest, it's like you wrote above, and consistently enforced throughout my youth. But that doesn't mean there are not idiots from where I grew up or where you did. I think Taekwondo is good upbringing, but I agree completely with what you've said before that the choice of master is a vital one. You've commented often about the high quality of your seniors. I wonder if the master of the student accused of assault is surprised by what happened...whether he knew of his student's issues.
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Your last sentence is the same thing Ive been wondering about. At our school we dont attend tournaments, but I got to thinking what our GM would do if one of our students did that and I have no doubts that a student with that sort of attitude would be kicked out of the club long before an incident like this would occur. The same could be said for the japanese master at the karate club I trained at. I really have to blame the club for letting a student train there long enough to reach a level where he attends tournaments with an attitude like this. The club should have kicked him out or 'sorted him out' long before it came to this. We have had students who have displayed these sorts of problems in the past, but its amazing how much they cut out the attitude after sparring a couple of 5th or 6th dans with a 'relaxed' ruleset.
 
Glenn can correct me if I'm wrong, but what I believe he is trying to say when bringing "American" into this, is a negative value of instant gratification and the "I deserve..." type attitude. Not that this is a value only Americans have, but it is quite abundant in our society and can be seen in everything from business to the martial arts.

Koreans, or any nation for that matter, do not have a monopoly in good upbringing. In the same sense America, or any other nation, corner the market in bad upbringing and disrespect towards seniors. I believe there is a thread on here already about culture clashes within TKD.
 
granfire said:
but popular legend traces the tenets back to the Hwa Rang .....I think that has the KKW and actually TKD beat by a couple of years.

(not to mention the tenets mirror the warrior's code of just about any armed class throughout history all over the world)
Click to expand...
Though it is still popular to try and link TKD to Hwarang warriors, the truth is that there is no direct connection at all, even through the tenants. If you actually look into the whole Silla dynasty you will find that it was not such a romantic time period as people would have you think.
 
puunui said:
And at the same token, if I acted like how some American borns act towards their seniors, especially to Korean borns, I would also be taken to task not only by my instructors, but everyone else in my family as well. Where I come from, you just don't act like that towards seniors, teachers, parents, etc. no matter what you think they did to you. You cannot act one way towards seniors or teachers and then act surprised when similar or worse behavior happens down slope from you. Just something to think about, how the attitude of disrespect festers and grows.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the clarification, must have been my reading it wrong.
 
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