Tracy Kenpo

thetruth

Black Belt
Joined
Feb 28, 2006
Messages
555
Reaction score
9
My old Kenpo instructor came via the Tracy system (though he is now with Jeff Speakman) so I am in no way bagging those that are a product of the Tracy system. I saw a video of the Tracy's doing some techniques that my instructor had and quite frankly I wouldn't have received my orange belt doing techniques the way they were. My instructor suggeseted that it was their students that really made the system as they saw the potential in Kenpo and delved further into the art and trained with others. I don't know if this is true but I know what I saw on the video and it was woeful. How did they gain such a following? Was it the direct students of theirs that made the art?



Cheers
Sam:asian:
 

Jim Hanna

Yellow Belt
Joined
May 8, 2006
Messages
55
Reaction score
3
I remember thinking the same thing myself one time after viewing some video of an internationally known American Kenpo master. I was really disappointed in what I saw on video.

That changed when I got a chance to see him move in person and to uke up for him.

I was told, at the time, to not judge a person's kenpo by evaluating "video kenpo".

The purpose of the Tracy videos are to preserve the system. They are done at a certain pace so that the viewer can see what is happening, but only on a basic level. There is so much more going on within the techniques than what is capable of being shown on video.

If you ever get a chance to uke up for some of the old timers like Dave Simmons, you will feel what its really about.

Jim
 

bushidomartialarts

Senior Master
Joined
Mar 5, 2006
Messages
2,668
Reaction score
44
Location
Hillsboro, Oregon
They are done at a certain pace so that the viewer can see what is happening, but only on a basic level.

This is part one of two on why that video received that sort of a reception. I had the same disappointment with my teacher's videos. I even had some trouble at my recent rank test in similar vein: I had to redo several techs because I was doing them at 'teaching speed' rather than 'combat speed'.

Part two might be the age old enmity between Parker and the Tracy bros. I don't know the deal there, but I'd bet a beer one of 'em slept with another's wife. There's just nothing else I can imagine that would keep people spewing this long after the events.

Grain of salt, my friend. Parker vs. Tracy is like Spanish vs. Portugese. Same language spoken by very similar cultures. The difference is emphasis, nothing more.
 

hongkongfooey

Black Belt
Joined
Jun 7, 2005
Messages
625
Reaction score
19
I think that if someone is going to make a video that will showcase their talents, regardless of system or style, please for the love of God do it right. Re shoot 1000 times if you have to. But, don't put out a video that looks like it was made by a 4th grade AV club.
 
OP
T

thetruth

Black Belt
Joined
Feb 28, 2006
Messages
555
Reaction score
9
I think that if someone is going to make a video that will showcase their talents, regardless of system or style, please for the love of God do it right. Re shoot 1000 times if you have to. But, don't put out a video that looks like it was made by a 4th grade AV club.

It wasn't the video that was of poor quality but the kenpo. In my opinion one can look sharp and powerful during a technique even when doing it slowly for demonstration purposes. These guys just didn't.

Cheers
Sammy:asian:
 

hongkongfooey

Black Belt
Joined
Jun 7, 2005
Messages
625
Reaction score
19
It wasn't the video that was of poor quality but the kenpo. In my opinion one can look sharp and powerful during a technique even when doing it slowly for demonstration purposes. These guys just didn't.

Cheers
Sammy:asian:

That is what I was getting at. Why put out a sloppy production when it can be done over if there is a mistake.
 

Karatedrifter7

Purple Belt
Joined
Jun 28, 2007
Messages
302
Reaction score
4
Location
Albuquerque NM.
When you say the Tracy's doing techniques on a video, who exactly do you mean? Al Tracy and his brother? Or Tracy students? Or the Elite Fighters comparison dvd?
I am confused as Confucious say.
 

Touch Of Death

Sr. Grandmaster
MTS Alumni
Joined
May 6, 2003
Messages
11,610
Reaction score
844
Location
Spokane Valley WA
My old Kenpo instructor came via the Tracy system (though he is now with Jeff Speakman) so I am in no way bagging those that are a product of the Tracy system. I saw a video of the Tracy's doing some techniques that my instructor had and quite frankly I wouldn't have received my orange belt doing techniques the way they were. My instructor suggeseted that it was their students that really made the system as they saw the potential in Kenpo and delved further into the art and trained with others. I don't know if this is true but I know what I saw on the video and it was woeful. How did they gain such a following? Was it the direct students of theirs that made the art?



Cheers
Sam:asian:
Be carefull dimissing other arts. They have different things to work on than you are familiar with, but they are good at what they know.
Sean
 

kidswarrior

Senior Master
Joined
Jan 27, 2007
Messages
2,697
Reaction score
151
Location
California
Be carefull dimissing other arts. They have different things to work on than you are familiar with, but they are good at what they know.
Sean
Well said, Touch of Death. I think we all should be careful with another's reputation. When I can do my own art perfectly, then I guess I'll have the time to evaluate how others are doing in theirs. In the meantime, when I do get a chance to see others perform, I try to learn what I can from it.
 

Sigung86

2nd Black Belt
Joined
Mar 16, 2002
Messages
898
Reaction score
15
Location
Wright City, MO
I have to say a couple of things.

First... One must consider that the Tracy videos were among the first complete system tapes, if not the first put out for public consumption.
As i no longer have access, I don't know about the quality of the new CDs. I will say that for their days (mid to late 80s) they served a purpose very well. Those of us who had them were able to learn from them, or be reminded of what we had already learned.

The early tapes were, essentially, an adventure in capitalism, as well as educational items. I believe that Al Tracy was, and still is, a forward looking business man. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that.
He had an idea, and took a chance that they would not be a loss-leader.

Interestingly, to me, at any rate, the Tracy Tape Series was more widely available, due to my physical location, than the Parker material up until the advent of the internet, and the late 90s and turn of the century.

I'm thinking that some of the comments here are a little rude when you consider that the material was put out for people who had already had training (instructor series, neh?). And that no one else did it for quite a while in the volume that Al Tracy did it. No glitz, no glamour, just the techniques and a lot of information from the man who had the answers.
 

Doc

Senior Master
Joined
May 12, 2002
Messages
4,212
Reaction score
158
Location
Southern California
I have to say a couple of things.

First... One must consider that the Tracy videos were among the first complete system tapes, if not the first put out for public consumption.
As i no longer have access, I don't know about the quality of the new CDs. I will say that for their days (mid to late 80s) they served a purpose very well. Those of us who had them were able to learn from them, or be reminded of what we had already learned.

The early tapes were, essentially, an adventure in capitalism, as well as educational items. I believe that Al Tracy was, and still is, a forward looking business man. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that.
He had an idea, and took a chance that they would not be a loss-leader.

Interestingly, to me, at any rate, the Tracy Tape Series was more widely available, due to my physical location, than the Parker material up until the advent of the internet, and the late 90s and turn of the century.

I'm thinking that some of the comments here are a little rude when you consider that the material was put out for people who had already had training (instructor series, neh?). And that no one else did it for quite a while in the volume that Al Tracy did it. No glitz, no glamour, just the techniques and a lot of information from the man who had the answers.

I concur.
 

KenpoDave

2nd Black Belt
Joined
May 20, 2002
Messages
884
Reaction score
33
Location
Shreveport, LA
I have to say a couple of things.

First... One must consider that the Tracy videos were among the first complete system tapes, if not the first put out for public consumption.
As i no longer have access, I don't know about the quality of the new CDs. I will say that for their days (mid to late 80s) they served a purpose very well. Those of us who had them were able to learn from them, or be reminded of what we had already learned.

The early tapes were, essentially, an adventure in capitalism, as well as educational items. I believe that Al Tracy was, and still is, a forward looking business man. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that.
He had an idea, and took a chance that they would not be a loss-leader.

Interestingly, to me, at any rate, the Tracy Tape Series was more widely available, due to my physical location, than the Parker material up until the advent of the internet, and the late 90s and turn of the century.

I'm thinking that some of the comments here are a little rude when you consider that the material was put out for people who had already had training (instructor series, neh?). And that no one else did it for quite a while in the volume that Al Tracy did it. No glitz, no glamour, just the techniques and a lot of information from the man who had the answers.

Well said.
 
Top