Klondike93
Master Black Belt
:boing1: :rofl:
you funny!!
:asian:
Chuck
you funny!!
:asian:
Chuck
Re:Parker/Tracy linage
- Thread starter donald
- Start date
...let sleeping dogs lie, stop beating a dead horse....and so on. There will always be people who will not be able to let go the Parker/Tracy debate. It's done, move on!!!
Dennis and Dave, great posts!
Gou, you crack me up.
Don't move or I'll shoot
........^...................................Please don't hurt me!!!
........^.................................................^...................
....:armed:..........................................:waah:
What was that? I didn't hear you.
.............^....................................Come closer so you can
.............^................................................^
.........:armed:...........................................:EG:
...................................!?!argh!?!
....................................:boxing:
................Officer I have no idea what happened,
..............................He just fell down
.....................................:angel:
Dennis and Dave, great posts!
Gou, you crack me up.
Don't move or I'll shoot
........^...................................Please don't hurt me!!!
........^.................................................^...................
....:armed:..........................................:waah:
What was that? I didn't hear you.
.............^....................................Come closer so you can
.............^................................................^
.........:armed:...........................................:EG:
...................................!?!argh!?!
....................................:boxing:
................Officer I have no idea what happened,
..............................He just fell down
.....................................:angel:
Goldendragon7
Grandmaster
Someone has to answer the constant re-occuring questions on the multi million forums that keep popping up everywhere! lol
:armed:
:armed:
Your right. Someone does have to answer that question. It's just that I've heard it so often that it's starting to drive me looney. That gives me an idea, what do you think of a collaboration, yourself, Mr. Simmons, and whoever else, on an article about this subject. I can post it on my site and other sites. Then when the question comes up, we can say; "read this first". Do you think will it help, or is it a pipe dream?
R
Rob_Broad
Guest
Yes there are many similarities in the two styles, but there is just as many differences. The tracy method is more is better, where the parker method became more tailored to fit the individual. The Tracy's had techniques like Crash of the eagle Part 1 and 2 with umpteen variations while the Parker believed in grafting. Neither method is wrong, one just has more ability to be tailored to fit the individual.
Dave Simmons
Green Belt
Normally I think your idea would benefit and perhaps correct the confusion. The Parker vs Tracy issue has reached mythical heights. What I mean is exactly what is truth and fantasy it is hard to tell anymore.
The Kenpo Community must move forward. If people would interact and participate at more gatherings, seminars and informal workout mutual understandings would surface. Those who want to be alone (affiliations) will do it no matter what is done or who is involved.
Al Tracy is actually trying to give back history and knowledge to the Kenpo Community via The Gathering of Eagles. He has told me a number of times that many Kenpo folks just don't care. What he meant is the history of the practitioners struggle what it means to us today and for the future of Kenpo.
No I am not saying Al is the only one but he is not afraid to try. There are others too! Yourself for instance, Dennis Conatsner, Steve LaBounty, Larry Tatum, GM McSweeney(God bless him) Tom Savianno. The key ingredient is, Kenpo and what it means is bigger than all of us combined. There is one statement that I think is the starting point, "Check your Ego's at the door". If we could practice that at all times we could become more understanding.
Peace,
Dave Simmons:asian:
The Kenpo Community must move forward. If people would interact and participate at more gatherings, seminars and informal workout mutual understandings would surface. Those who want to be alone (affiliations) will do it no matter what is done or who is involved.
Al Tracy is actually trying to give back history and knowledge to the Kenpo Community via The Gathering of Eagles. He has told me a number of times that many Kenpo folks just don't care. What he meant is the history of the practitioners struggle what it means to us today and for the future of Kenpo.
No I am not saying Al is the only one but he is not afraid to try. There are others too! Yourself for instance, Dennis Conatsner, Steve LaBounty, Larry Tatum, GM McSweeney(God bless him) Tom Savianno. The key ingredient is, Kenpo and what it means is bigger than all of us combined. There is one statement that I think is the starting point, "Check your Ego's at the door". If we could practice that at all times we could become more understanding.
Peace,
Dave Simmons:asian:
K
Kirk
Guest
What's the story with the sex cult? Why is it avoided so hard
on forums?
on forums?
R
Rob_Broad
Guest
It is not polite to discuss naked grappling.
Goldendragon7
Grandmaster
Originally posted by Kirk
"What's the story with the sex cult? Why is it avoided?"
COME ON..............
Why do you think it's avoided?! Nobody wants to discuss the skeletons in their closet! lol
Would you want to discuss openly your Uncle that has aids or is a swinger on these cannibalistic forums........ lol (Well Gou might like that, heee hee)
:asian:
"What's the story with the sex cult? Why is it avoided?"
COME ON..............
Why do you think it's avoided?! Nobody wants to discuss the skeletons in their closet! lol
Would you want to discuss openly your Uncle that has aids or is a swinger on these cannibalistic forums........ lol (Well Gou might like that, heee hee)
:asian:Dutch
Yellow Belt
Gou would like that alright because he'll sleep with your girlfriend behind your back!
Wil Tracy and his wife had a sex cult. In that if you slept with Wil's wife you were absolved of all your sins. They had it set up like a church. So everyone was banging Wil's wife. They even made the rounds on talk shows talking about it. I think the law caught up with them regarding the money aspect of it because while it's not illegal to have everyone sleep with your wife it is if you do it for money or have your church use funds illegally.
Wil Tracy and his wife had a sex cult. In that if you slept with Wil's wife you were absolved of all your sins. They had it set up like a church. So everyone was banging Wil's wife. They even made the rounds on talk shows talking about it. I think the law caught up with them regarding the money aspect of it because while it's not illegal to have everyone sleep with your wife it is if you do it for money or have your church use funds illegally.
Goldendragon7
Grandmaster
I wonder if they still hold service...... last I heard they were developng new princesses on Egyptian Religion
Dave Simmons
Green Belt
Never have never will. But I find it curious about your roots! What do you advocate? Mail order primary instructions for Black Belt backed up with a certificate. You sir are misleading the uninformed public! I have checked out your site, well let us say BULL@#$% to your BS. Nice photo's with psuedo captions. What I really like the best is the young lady posing as a professional boxer. That's funny the gloves are not sized to her and physically she looks like she hasn't felt one punch in the ring.LOL! Let alone a professional bout.
Bye, Bye, Con Artist!
Dave Simmons
Bye, Bye, Con Artist!
Dave Simmons
Dutch
Yellow Belt
That isn't MY website. If you look at how many people have done Dragon Combat Kenpo though who are professional fighters you'll understand that it is indeed the deadliest form of Kenpo.
Klondike93
Master Black Belt
:drink2tha
That sounds like a hell of a way to teach kenpo. You achieve belt rank by the number of orgasams she has. :rofl: :rofl:
:roflmao:
Chuck
That sounds like a hell of a way to teach kenpo. You achieve belt rank by the number of orgasams she has. :rofl: :rofl:
:roflmao:
Chuck
Dutch
Yellow Belt
Is that a crack? I suppose you think it is funny to have your girlfriend stolen by another man! Some people have no honor!
Goldendragon7
Grandmaster
are you getting in "Dutch" for this! Whoa!:rofl:
Bad website, stock pictures, poorly edited at that. Questionable system, and an interesting grading system.
All in all, This is deteriorating rapidly.....
All in all, This is deteriorating rapidly.....
N
Not Important
Guest
To Quote Golden Dragon:
"You stated............
"I thought the better system would be based on the
abilities of the practitioner rather than the style itself!"
Well, the style doesn't make the man, the man makes the style...... however if you are comparing 2 individuals that study different systems....... then you are comparing apples and tangerines.
While it is true that Al Tracy studied and gained his black belt at the time under the guidance of ED Parker...... he left with what ever knowledge he gained "OF THAT TIME PERIOD". In the last 25
years of Ed Parker's Life ...... dont you think he made several adjustments and advances to HIS
system?!! Oh course he did, NOW was Al Tracy involved in these developments........ Answer ...
NO he was not.
Suffice to say that while the Tracy System is an Ed Parker break~away system with Tracys
modifications.. It certainly is "NOT" I repeat "IS NOT" close to what we have today in the system.
After all we have had 25 good years of adjustments to the system and many new insights, drills,
advanced technique applications and variable expansions of all sorts on all levels.
Al Tracy has done a wonderful job of maintaining what he had 40 years ago with little modification.
He also should be credited with the expansion movement of the Kenpo System throughout the US and
the several portions of the World. This does not however mean that he should be credited as one
who is knowledgeable on the Principles and Concepts and other invaluable material found in the Architecture of the American Kenpo System of Today.
You went on to state.................
"One should be no better than the other since both are of the same lineage and the assumption that
kenpo is based on the study of creative motion."
Yes, the lineage to a point - specifically when the separation happened..... at that point they were more or less of the same mindset.... but as I have stated the Buck Stops here!! Tracy is missing an important 25 years of advanced material that Ed Parker has developed.
No Kenpo is not based on the study of creative motion....... what is that? Kenpo is based upon
LOGIC. It is the analytical study of motion that is the key as well as the individuals commitment to what is available to him and his personal application of said material.
If you take a putz and put him in the "BEST" system in the world you still have a Great Putz!
If you take a putz and put him in the "WORST" system in the world you still have an Awful Putz!
You take a hard working person that digs and studies, researches and trains guided by a good
instructor and armed with a complete system..... you have a great practitioner. "
I agree with what you say, except for this allows people and people take this to mean that Mr. Parker promoted them to Black Belt............:
Golden Dragon wrote:
"While it is true that Al Tracy studied and gained his black belt at the time under the guidance of ED Parker...... he left with what ever knowledge he gained "OF THAT TIME PERIOD". "
Mr. Tracy was never promoted to more than a Brown Belt by Mr. Parker, he was given a diploma recognizing his rank, which is something else all together. Lots of people got those small little diplomas like that, and that was part of an amends that they were making at one point that was short lived..............
It is a different system that is based on a small part of "what was" American Kenpo at that time in it's life...........
And in most peoples eyes they consider the Tracy's Kenpo a style, not a system.............
Good job Golden Dragon
"You stated............
"I thought the better system would be based on the
abilities of the practitioner rather than the style itself!"
Well, the style doesn't make the man, the man makes the style...... however if you are comparing 2 individuals that study different systems....... then you are comparing apples and tangerines.
While it is true that Al Tracy studied and gained his black belt at the time under the guidance of ED Parker...... he left with what ever knowledge he gained "OF THAT TIME PERIOD". In the last 25
years of Ed Parker's Life ...... dont you think he made several adjustments and advances to HIS
system?!! Oh course he did, NOW was Al Tracy involved in these developments........ Answer ...
NO he was not.
Suffice to say that while the Tracy System is an Ed Parker break~away system with Tracys
modifications.. It certainly is "NOT" I repeat "IS NOT" close to what we have today in the system.
After all we have had 25 good years of adjustments to the system and many new insights, drills,
advanced technique applications and variable expansions of all sorts on all levels.
Al Tracy has done a wonderful job of maintaining what he had 40 years ago with little modification.
He also should be credited with the expansion movement of the Kenpo System throughout the US and
the several portions of the World. This does not however mean that he should be credited as one
who is knowledgeable on the Principles and Concepts and other invaluable material found in the Architecture of the American Kenpo System of Today.
You went on to state.................
"One should be no better than the other since both are of the same lineage and the assumption that
kenpo is based on the study of creative motion."
Yes, the lineage to a point - specifically when the separation happened..... at that point they were more or less of the same mindset.... but as I have stated the Buck Stops here!! Tracy is missing an important 25 years of advanced material that Ed Parker has developed.
No Kenpo is not based on the study of creative motion....... what is that? Kenpo is based upon
LOGIC. It is the analytical study of motion that is the key as well as the individuals commitment to what is available to him and his personal application of said material.
If you take a putz and put him in the "BEST" system in the world you still have a Great Putz!
If you take a putz and put him in the "WORST" system in the world you still have an Awful Putz!
You take a hard working person that digs and studies, researches and trains guided by a good
instructor and armed with a complete system..... you have a great practitioner. "
I agree with what you say, except for this allows people and people take this to mean that Mr. Parker promoted them to Black Belt............:
Golden Dragon wrote:
"While it is true that Al Tracy studied and gained his black belt at the time under the guidance of ED Parker...... he left with what ever knowledge he gained "OF THAT TIME PERIOD". "
Mr. Tracy was never promoted to more than a Brown Belt by Mr. Parker, he was given a diploma recognizing his rank, which is something else all together. Lots of people got those small little diplomas like that, and that was part of an amends that they were making at one point that was short lived..............
It is a different system that is based on a small part of "what was" American Kenpo at that time in it's life...........
And in most peoples eyes they consider the Tracy's Kenpo a style, not a system.............
Good job Golden Dragon
Dutch
Yellow Belt
The website is not mine. It is the national one. The system is only questionable because you do not understand the effectiveness of it. Luckily you study under Tim Hartman in an effective system so that if you ever saw Dragon Kenpo you would immediately see it for what it is.
While some feel that the grading is easy to maintain I am not only a black in Dragin Kenpo I am also a certfied instructor. Which means so much more!
Yes, it IS deteriorating rapidly as these people come to realize that they have been doing busywork all this time.
