TKD Mainly a kicking art.

[Manny]

That's the thing I'm hearing these days from MA practicioners to people who do not do any MA. TKD is a good MA but sadly has been oriented to match competitions (tournaments) and olimpic games, afther foot ball soccer I think is the second sport more practiced in the world.

There is really not much to answer to the guys who tell me TKD is a kicking art with almost cero punching,trowing,locking,chocking,submition but I say them that a well placed kick can end the fight very nice jejeje. However same old aswer... but if I grab you what are you gona do? or I can deflect your kick easily and counterpunch you with an elbow... or... whatever.

Manny

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

Unfortunately, Manny, the way that TKD is taught in many dojangs is as primarilly a kicking art. In WTF competition, punches are allowed, but rarely score.

Hand techniques are present, and in fact, predominate most of the poomsae and step sparring, but most dojangs do about 80-90% of their drilling on kicks.

Daniel

 

[BrandonLucas]

Actually, it's not quite like that at our dojang.

We're ITF, and we don't really concentrate on kicks more than punches. We actually drill them equally. In addition to kicks and punches, our instructor drills us on defensive and evasive maneuvers as well.

I think the public's perception of TKD is that it's primarily a kicking art...and to a degree, it is. And this is not a bad thing, necessarily.

Sure, there are going to be the turd-heads that go around saying that if you don't do Muay Thai and BJJ then you're useless. The MMA craze is really spawning alot of these anti-TKD sentiments....mostly because TKD is seen as the kicking art you are referring to. The fact of the matter is, though, that there are many MMAists out there that practice TKD as a striking art to supplement the grappling.

A lot of the quality of TKD is going to vary from dojang to dojang. The problem is that the public doesn't see this; they tend to generalize things, and since Olympic style sparring TKD is the best known to the public, that's what they are going to see.

I was actually wrapped up in alot of these issues not too long ago while we were all having discussions about WTF vs ITF styles. The best advice I was given was to let the public think what they think. Continue to train hard, and let the craptalking go in one ear and out the other. You can't change the public's perception. Accept it.

 

[StuartA]

1. Dont believe the hype

2. Be the change you want to see in the world! (To paraphrase Ghandi)

3. Be true to yourself!

Thats all thats needed!

Stuart

 

[clfsean]

That's the thing I'm hearing these days from MA practicioners to people who do not do any MA. TKD is a good MA but sadly has been oriented to match competitions (tournaments) and olimpic games, afther foot ball soccer I think is the second sport more practiced in the world.

There is really not much to answer to the guys who tell me TKD is a kicking art with almost cero punching,trowing,locking,chocking,submition but I say them that a well placed kick can end the fight very nice jejeje. However same old aswer... but if I grab you what are you gona do? or I can deflect your kick easily and counterpunch you with an elbow... or... whatever.

Manny

Starting off in "old style" TKD (a/k/a Shotokan with better kicking), we had plenty of hands. Now however practicing a CMA that's arm heavy & feet heavy without "kicking" & watching what TKD has transformed into, I have to agree with the people you're talking to. Now, let me say this first... yes, you connect with a well placed kick & you're going to take the fight right out of them. However, once I get inside or outside of your knee moving in, are your hands currently now with TKD the way it is & taught, enough to protect you?

 

[BrandonLucas]

Starting off in "old style" TKD (a/k/a Shotokan with better kicking), we had plenty of hands. Now however practicing a CMA that's arm heavy & feet heavy without "kicking" & watching what TKD has transformed into, I have to agree with the people you're talking to. Now, let me say this first... yes, you connect with a well placed kick & you're going to take the fight right out of them. However, once I get inside or outside of your knee moving in, are your hands currently now with TKD the way it is & taught, enough to protect you?

Again, the answer is going to be different from dojang to dojang on this one...

The techniques that are a part of TKD are plenty to protect yourself with your hands. It all depends on what your instructor teaches...along with your natural ability in a fight.

 

[exile]

We teach about 75% hands/25% kicks (and some of those kicks are knee strikes—which are often disguised as the chamber part of a front snap kick). Our SD techs are all hand, forearm strikes and elbow strikes. Palgwe Pal Jang, the most advanced one, contains two, count'em, two kicks and eight elbow strike techs.

Needless to say, we don't orient our curriculum too closely to the WTF scoring system...

 

[zeeberex]

That's the thing I'm hearing these days from MA practicioners to people who do not do any MA. TKD is a good MA but sadly has been oriented to match competitions (tournaments) and olimpic games, afther foot ball soccer I think is the second sport more practiced in the world.

There is really not much to answer to the guys who tell me TKD is a kicking art with almost cero punching,trowing,locking,chocking,submition but I say them that a well placed kick can end the fight very nice jejeje. However same old aswer... but if I grab you what are you gona do? or I can deflect your kick easily and counterpunch you with an elbow... or... whatever.

Manny

blah blah blah, you fight/react the way you're taught and in
McDojang's that's what's taught.

 

[zeeberex]

Actually, it's not quite like that at our dojang.

We're ITF, and we don't really concentrate on kicks more than punches. We actually drill them equally. In addition to kicks and punches, our instructor drills us on defensive and evasive maneuvers as well.

I think the public's perception of TKD is that it's primarily a kicking art...and to a degree, it is. And this is not a bad thing, necessarily.

Sure, there are going to be the turd-heads that go around saying that if you don't do Muay Thai and BJJ then you're useless. The MMA craze is really spawning alot of these anti-TKD sentiments....mostly because TKD is seen as the kicking art you are referring to. The fact of the matter is, though, that there are many MMAists out there that practice TKD as a striking art to supplement the grappling.

A lot of the quality of TKD is going to vary from dojang to dojang. The problem is that the public doesn't see this; they tend to generalize things, and since Olympic style sparring TKD is the best known to the public, that's what they are going to see.

I was actually wrapped up in alot of these issues not too long ago while we were all having discussions about WTF vs ITF styles. The best advice I was given was to let the public think what they think. Continue to train hard, and let the craptalking go in one ear and out the other. You can't change the public's perception. Accept it.

don't blame the MMA'ers they didn't create the limitations in current tkd training methods and they have plenty of flaws of their own

 

[zeeberex]

We teach about 75% hands/25% kicks (and some of those kicks are knee strikes—which are often disguised as the chamber part of a front snap kick). Our SD techs are all hand, forearm strikes and elbow strikes. Palgwe Pal Jang, the most advanced one, contains two, count'em, two kicks and eight elbow strike techs.

Needless to say, we don't orient our curriculum too closely to the WTF scoring system...

So then either you're not paying attention to the whole of SD technique or totally ignoring the grappling/throwing spectrum

 

[clfsean]

Our SD techs are all hand, forearm strikes and elbow strikes.

Better than most then I'd guess...

Palgwe Pal Jang, the most advanced one, contains two, count'em, two kicks and eight elbow strike techs.

I came from the old Pyang-ahns (Pinans) forms. I most I could count the kicks on one hand & have fingers left over. Our kicking came in countless line drills up & down the floor.

Needless to say, we don't orient our curriculum too closely to the WTF scoring system...

Good for you! So in sparring at the dojang, hand techniques are used & stressed appropriately then?

 

[TX_BB]

However same old aswer... but if I grab you what are you gona do?
Manny

Depends: If it's a she and what she looks like? If it's a guy I'd tell him I don't swing that way.

Seriously, the sport is the sport, it just personal preference like the colors blue or green. If they are truly wondering what does a TKD teach about getting a kick grabbed, tell them honestly we don't practice leaving our legs in a position to be grabbed.

 

[BrandonLucas]

don't blame the MMA'ers they didn't create the limitations in current tkd training methods and they have plenty of flaws of their own

Not blaming anyone...just stating facts. There are, in fact, many people who perceive TKD in the aspect of a sport and not a martial art.

I have utmost respect for MMAists. Their training, by the definition of the term "mixed martial art", is as dangerous if not more dangerous than many TMA's out there.

What art do you practice?

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

Actually, it's not quite like that at our dojang.

We're ITF, and we don't really concentrate on kicks more than punches. We actually drill them equally. In addition to kicks and punches, our instructor drills us on defensive and evasive maneuvers as well.

There is an ITF dojang near me, and it is one of the only ones near me that I have not had a chance to visit as of yet.

But I'd venture that nationaly, most taekwondo dojangs are not ITF, but Kukkiwon/WTF followed by ATA.

Daniel

 

[BrandonLucas]

So then either you're not paying attention to the whole of SD technique or totally ignoring the grappling/throwing spectrum

There is another thread on this forum dedicated to grappling/throwing techniques in TKD. I suggest you read that first before replying regarding the SD aspects regarding grappling/throwing.

In a nutshell, though, many instructors do not teach those methods. Since TKD is primarily a striking art, the emphasis on instruction in most dojangs is the striking aspect of the art.

 

[BrandonLucas]

There is an ITF dojang near me, and it is one of the only ones near me that I have not had a chance to visit as of yet.

But I'd venture that nationaly, most taekwondo dojangs are not ITF, but Kukkiwon/WTF followed by ATA.

Daniel

Not sure about the numbers, but I have a feeling you're correct.

 

[BrandonLucas]

blah blah blah, you fight/react the way you're taught and in
McDojang's that's what's taught.

Actually, if you're going that route with it, you're taught that at any dojang...not mcdojang's...at least, if your dojang is worth its salt....

 

[Kwanjang]

Since Tae Kwon Do loosely translated to english means:

Kick (Tae) Punch (Kwon) Way (Do)

There is, at least at my dojang a heavy emphasis on kicks. However, since CDK TKD is a martial art, I include; hand combo's, elbow strikes, knee strikes, wrist locks, chokes and take downs.

That said, I often say, confidence is not knowing how to kick or punch. But when to kick or when to punch.

 

[Sylo]

don't blame the MMA'ers they didn't create the limitations in current tkd training methods and they have plenty of flaws of their own

He's not blaming the MMAer's from where I sit. I believe he is talking about MMA's rise to the media that has garnered attention from the martial arts "outsiders". The ones who don't really have any interest in martial arts otehr than watching MMA on Spike. The school I used to go to had them sign up in droves. The armchair martial artist. He sees what these guy on tv, and he thinks to himself "Man I want to do that, because thats REAL fighting". He's never even had any inkling to study a traditional martial art, because of the stigma regarding it. UFC has gotten to nearly the same popularity as football. You don't need any background in traditional martial arts to compete in MMA. So alot of the MMA fighters skip them all together.
There are plenty of MMA fighters with very strong traditional backgrounds, who wouldn't be the fighters they are without it. The average "Joe" is going to see TKD as the stuff they see on TV.. The triple spin jump kicks, etc. I'd say TKD and Muay Thai are "heavily" kicking based.. but not total. I don't blame MMA for these generalizations. I blame media. Just like with XMA, just like with the Olympics. Just because its on TV must mean its ALL like that. If they don't use it in MMA it must not be effective?
A quick scour of youtube will find you several people who are versed in TKD who do very well in MMA. Thats not soley what they train in, but Muay Thai fighters don't just train in Muay Thai either. The MMA artist.. is not to blame.. the media that creates these "wanna be's" is. Its a double edged sword. It brings more people to the martial arts.. but are those the kind of people we want?

 

[Sylo]

So then either you're not paying attention to the whole of SD technique or totally ignoring the grappling/throwing spectrum

Honestly. This whole "you gotta learn how to wrassle in order to be a good fighter" argument is kind of stale. You've got primarily striking arts..and primary grappling arts...

if you want to be good at both, you either.. find an art that teaches you both, or learn 2 different arts..

problem solved.