Specific forms by organization!!!

Xue Sheng

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I was reading another thread in the TKD section and I came across a reference to KKW forms. This hit me as kind of odd but then I have been out of TKD for many many years and I do not even remember what organization I was in if I was in any at al (I will see if I can find out). It was pre-Olympic TKD just to give you an idea of how long ago it was.

Do different TKD organizations have different forms?

Are those form possibly their property if you will?

Meaning if you are not in that org and do their form you are in trouble.
 

hkfuie

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I don't think they own the forms in that way. If so, I am in big trouble.
 

bluekey88

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Different orgs have different forms sets. KKW uses the taeguk set, although slome KKW schools still do the older Palgwe forms. ITF and ITF affiliated schools do the Chang H'on set. There are also some schools that follow closer to atangf soo do curriuclkum that do the old Shotokan style forms (PInan/heian). None of the orgs have trademarked their forms in anyway...however, if you do ITF forms at a KKW event that is not an OPEN tournwey...they won't be recognized.

The ATA is the only exception. They have their own set of forms. As I understand it, these forms are trademarked. ATA only ocmpetes in house against other ATA schools. I know of no case where someone has done ATA forms that was not affilitated with ATA and was then sued, but the posisbility is out there.

Peace,
Erik
 

Jphtkd

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There was a lawsuit, between H.U. Lee and his brother Gee Ho Lee, who left ATA and began "Taekwondo America" (I believe). When he split, he continued to teach the songahm forms and a legal battle ensued. They had created the forms together, but since he was under the employment of the ATA, and they had the legal rights to the patterns, Taekwondo America was forced to stop using them. I am not entirely sure the org. was Taekwondo America, it all happened in the early 90's.
 
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dancingalone

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Lots of TKD orgs have their own forms, some are supplementary but some are meant to replace the older forms entirely.

Global TKD Federation has some new forms created by their GM (deceased) who was one of General Choi's top lieutenants.

The ATA replaced the ITF forms entirely with their own Songahm forms.

The ITA modified the ITF forms to fit their own spin on things. Supposedly they can now be performed in a smaller area which cynically makes dojo-packing easier to do. :)

The Universal TKD Federation created a system of forms meant to unify both ITF and KKW schools. Their forms as I understand it almagamated movements and principles from both camps.

Some GM in the midwest USA ? area created some supplementary forms called 'Choong Sil' to be used in addition to the ITF forms.

Anyway, there's really too many to keep up with. I have a preference for the old Japanese curriculum like the Pyung Ahn (Pinan/Heian) and Chulgi (Tekki, Naihanchi) patterns myself.

By the way, to my knowledge only the Songahm forms are copyrighted at this time. I heard there was an effort for the ITA to follow suit, but who knows? I would think their forms being a derivative of General Choi's would not qualify for copyright protection, but I'm no lawyer.
 

WMKS Shogun

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How can someone own a form?

I think it follows along the lines of choreographed dances. Choreographers can copyright some of their dances, which keeps others from using them in performances, etc. It basically becomes like any other work of art. Take music for example: How many times has someone sued someone else over copyright infringement by stealing melodies or sound clips or whatnot? (All too often. But hey, if I spent my life creating something only to have someone else rip me off and try to make money off my hard work, I would be upset too).
 

granfire

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I think it follows along the lines of choreographed dances. Choreographers can copyright some of their dances, which keeps others from using them in performances, etc. It basically becomes like any other work of art. Take music for example: How many times has someone sued someone else over copyright infringement by stealing melodies or sound clips or whatnot? (All too often. But hey, if I spent my life creating something only to have someone else rip me off and try to make money off my hard work, I would be upset too).


yep, that's pretty much it. The forms did not come from the divine enlightenment of the great Praying Mantis, some dude thought them up.

back in the day it did not matter too much but these days everything is all about money.

So you change up something (I am sure there is a set percentage in copyright law) and you can claim it as your own - thus copyright it and protect it. I am hoping it's a concern for the development of the Art, but in reality, $$ might be the gravitating factor.

Copyright laws are pretty old..Igor Stravinsky used a tune he thought was an old folksong in one of his works. Upon being served, he changed the score around and prohibited the performance of the original piece - he was also cheap! ;)
 
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