So what is this world coming to again?...

[Blotan Hunka]

What about the wealthy, educated, white kids that commit these crimes? Who do they have to blame? And whats with these suburban kids emulating, inner city, rap, "gangstas"?

 

[heretic888]

One you did not mention is Hunger at my school we donate our time for the local foor shelter and once a month we hold a food drive for our local food banks

Hunger falls under socioeconomic inequality, actually --- it refers to the gap between the poor and the rich.

This does not change a thing about tv, videos games and other such violent act being in our everyday life/ Please do not try in shadow what is really going on in the world, the facts are every since violent behavior has been glorified the crime rate has jumped/

I think you will find that your "facts" are by in large of your invention.

At what point in recent history do you believe violence was suddenly and spontaneously "glorified"?? From what I can tell, violence has always been glorified. Or, perhaps you are unaware of the number of war movies and Western shoot-em movies from decades ago??

I know exactly what is happening here and I know exactly why people are going after the entertainment industry. Imagine if all this energy was devoted to combatting things like poverty, illiteracy, or war??

Laterz.

 

[Drac]

2) Capital punishment. I have been an advocate for tougher laws since I was old enough to be able..

Anyone against this should work 2 years on the streets in Law Enforcement...That will change your tune very quicky..Many of these juvenile offenders do not fear jail, 3 hots and a cot and the chance to join up with one of the MANY gangs inside..

3) Easy availability of handguns.. Been involved with the permit process for tougher hand gun laws

We need to make the laws tougher for those who carry without the permit..

 

[heretic888]

What about the wealthy, educated, white kids that commit these crimes? Who do they have to blame? And whats with these suburban kids emulating, inner city, rap, "gangstas"?

No idea. I don't have any specific data on that demographic, so I would hesitate to draw any conclusions one way or the other.

However, the five points I mentioned earlier are directly correlated with general violent trends in industrialized nations, just as much as violent media.

Laterz.

 

[Blotan Hunka]

Anyone against this should work 2 years on the streets in Law Enforcement...That will change your tune very quicky..Many of these juvenile offenders do not fear jail, 3 hots and a cot and the chance to join up with one of the MANY gangs inside..



We need to make the laws tougher for those who carry without the permit..

How many criminals face serious time on ANY crime? Im under the impression that most crimes get plead down.

 

[terryl965]

Hunger falls under socioeconomic inequality, actually --- it refers to the gap between the poor and the rich.



I think you will find that your "facts" are by in large of your invention.

At what point in recent history do you believe violence was suddenly and spontaneously "glorified"?? From what I can tell, violence has always been glorified. Or, perhaps you are unaware of the number of war movies and Western shoot-em movies from decades ago??

I know exactly what is happening here and I know exactly why people are going after the entertainment industry. Imagine if all this energy was devoted to combatting things like poverty, illiteracy, or war??

Laterz.

Yes imagine and a nickel will get you nothing, please the old days did not glorified death it had it but did not give the message it does today. I would say you are my age, so lets talk apple to apples ok, in the old days as we call it how much time was spent in front of tv in my household we was always outside playing football or some sport and then caame in ate did our homework had what we called family hour played some board game and then bed, maybe we spent two hours a week watching TV, today kids watch it from the time they get up to the time the go to bed, most childern would rathe rstay inside and watch tv than go outside and play.

We apparntle have different views here and yours and mine have merit and we are both old enough to be able to see past a word or two, we both want the same thing PEACE well we get it probaly not in our lifetime but maybe just maybe our granchildern or great grandchildern will if we keep pushing today for the right solutions.

 

[heretic888]

Anyone against this should work 2 years on the streets in Law Enforcement...That will change your tune very quicky..Many of these juvenile offenders do not fear jail, 3 hots and a cot and the chance to join up with one of the MANY gangs inside..

Socially-sanctioned violence has been shown to correlate with violent behavioral trends among the populace, especially among youths. This includes both capital punishment and war.

When one is deciding whether one is "for" or "against" an issue, it is important to take information like this into account.

We need to make the laws tougher for those who carry without the permit..

Personally, I favor both gun education requirements (similar to how we regulate driver's licenses) and stricter laws for those that break the law.

Laterz.

 

[Drac]

What about the wealthy, educated, white kids that commit these crimes? Who do they have to blame? And whats with these suburban kids emulating, inner city, rap, "gangstas"?

THOSE are my favorite targets and get no mercy..Living in the "burbs in a $200.000 house and being supported and spoiled by Mommy and Daddy..I get the greatest satisfaction in sending them to Juvenile Court OR even better bringing them home at 2:00am and informing Mommy and Daddy that their little darling was drinking and driving and Dad's brand new BMW has been towed...I will NEVER understand their desire to emulate the innercity kids..They have NO CLUE what those kids go through...Sorry Ranting..

 

[Blotan Hunka]

And how often did you sit in front of a video game killing, bombing and maiming with no real purpose other than the action itself. Literature and entertainment from the "the old days" at least that heros fighting for "truth, justice and the American way". The violence was coulped with some sort of message that had a societal benefit (heroism in defending the homeland, fighting off brigands, defending the weak).Today we have video games where you steal cars, shoot cops and run street gangs. With sound tracks of rappers talking about "ho's, bitches, money and unearned "respect"..."

 

[terryl965]

And how often did you sit in front of a video game killing, bombing and maiming with no real purpose other than the action itself. Literature and entertainment from the "the old days" at least that heros fighting for "truth, justice and the American way". Today we have video games where you steal cars, shoot cops and run street gangs. With sound tracks of rappers talking about "ho's, bitches, money and unearned "respect"..."

I know this is not asking of me but when I sat in front of a video gaqme it was pong a little ball being hit like tennis to each other not much violents there

 

[heretic888]

Yes imagine and a nickel will get you nothing, please the old days did not glorified death it had it but did not give the message it does today.

Really?? As a wannabe social scientist, I'm just not seeing that.

Sure, the faces, the names, and the images have changed. But, the underlying mythos and ethos have not. How long have little boys played with toy guns and simulated "shooting" one another?? How long have there been fictitious dramas depicting the brave hero killing all the bad guys (whether "the Injuns" or "Cobra" or what have you)??

This isn't something in recent history. This is something that has been a part of our culture for a long, long, long time. We have always glorified and lionized violence, particularly within a military context (G.I. Joe, anyone?).

I would say you are my age, so lets talk apple to apples ok, in the old days as we call it how much time was spent in front of tv in my household we was always outside playing football or some sport and then caame in ate did our homework had what we called family hour played some board game and then bed, maybe we spent two hours a week watching TV, today kids watch it from the time they get up to the time the go to bed, most childern would rathe rstay inside and watch tv than go outside and play.

Now you're talking about lifestyle changes, which is an entirely different subject altogether.

We apparntle have different views here and yours and mine have merit and we are both old enough to be able to see past a word or two, we both want the same thing PEACE well we get it probaly not in our lifetime but maybe just maybe our granchildern or great grandchildern will if we keep pushing today for the right solutions.

I believe "the right solutions" are to move away from socially-sanctioned real violence, and not concern ourselves so much with fictional violence.

Laterz.

 

[Blotan Hunka]

I know this is not asking of me but when I sat in front of a video gaqme it was pong a little ball being hit like tennis to each other not much violents there

Same here. My sister letting my 5yo nephew play "Grand Theft Auto" frosts me.

 

[heretic888]

And how often did you sit in front of a video game killing, bombing and maiming with no real purpose other than the action itself. Literature and entertainment from the "the old days" at least that heros fighting for "truth, justice and the American way". The violence was coulped with some sort of message that had a societal benefit (heroism in defending the homeland, fighting off brigands, defending the weak).Today we have video games where you steal cars, shoot cops and run street gangs. With sound tracks of rappers talking about "ho's, bitches, money and unearned "respect"..."

Whether there is a "message" or not has little bearing on behavioral trends. The realism of the violence and the repercussions of the violence do.

This is especially the case among younger children, who often do not have the cognitive faculties to comprehend the "message" in the first place.

Laterz.

 

[heretic888]

Same here. My sister letting my 5yo nephew play "Grand Theft Auto" frosts me.

Well, games like that do have an MA rating, if memory serves....

 

[Blotan Hunka]

THOSE are my favorite targets and get no mercy..Living in the "burbs in a $200.000 house and being supported and spoiled by Mommy and Daddy..I get the greatest satisfaction in sending them to Juvenile Court OR even better bringing them home at 2:00am and informing Mommy and Daddy that their little darling was drinking and driving and Dad's brand new BMW has been towed...I will NEVER understand their desire to emulate the innercity kids..They have NO CLUE what those kids go through...Sorry Ranting..

Is it me or are they all WWE fans too?

 

[Blotan Hunka]

I also think its a matter of volume. My grandfather reding a few "violent" books and seeing a few "nickel movies" is far different from kids these days constantly plugged into TV, DVD's, Movies, Internet, Games, IPods, WWE, the News making them think life is hopeless, etc..etc..my kids can read just aout all they wish, at least theres a message in the media.

 

[heretic888]

I also think its a matter of volume. My grandfather reding a few "violent" books and seeing a few "nickel movies" is far different from kids these days constantly plugged into TV, DVD's, Movies, Internet, Games, IPods, WWE, the News making them think life is hopeless, etc..etc..my kids can read just aout all they wish, at least theres a message in the media.

Yes, that is both the advantage and disadvantage of an informational society (as opposed to the previous industrial and agrarian societies).

I believe our culture and ethos are still playing "catch up" to the rapid development we have seen in technology and the socioeconomic base. There seems to be a failure across the board to impose normative regulations on everything from Internet pornographic access to outsourcing cheap child labor overseas. This is akin to giving a tribal-horticultural society access to handguns and automobiles. Very problematic.

Part of the problem seems to be that the two most commonly proposed solutions are that:

1) Everything is fine. This is just freedom of expresson. If you don't like it, tough!!

2) We should go back to a "golden age" when this technology didn't exist. Regression is the answer!!

I consider both of those solutions to be short-sighted and unworkable. The only way we can successfully handle this new technology is to develop our sociocultural insitutions --- everything from education to laws --- to enable us to handle them in a socially appropriate manner.

Laterz.

 

[zDom]

I'd also suggest the work of Lt. Co. David Grossman, particularly his 1999 book Stop Teaching Our Kids to Kill.

I interviewed Lt. Col. Grossman in early September for the Standard Democrat just before he addressed faculty at a local school to pitch a program that seeks to reduce violence in youth.

The full article can be found here:

http://news.mywebpal.com:80/news_tool_v2.cfm?pnpid=865&show=archivedetails&ArchiveID=1211424&om=1


Grossman told me that for children ages 2-3 years old, viewing television and movies increases the chance for attention deficit disorders no matter what they are watching.

Some view “violence as vodka, and non-violent stuff as beer,” according to Grossman, with all TV, movies and video games being harmful to some extent.

He has research the indicates that video, TV and movies -- regardless of content -- stimulates certain areas of the brain while reading stimulates others.

The areas stimulated by reading are those that "make us human," Grossman told me.

I don't think it is any one factor, but one thing seems certain to me:

the combination of parents allowing video games, movies and TV to replace them as parents (which indicates less time spent on loving interaction)

+

extremely high volume of video game, movie, TV viewing

+

reduced time spent reading

+

glorification of violent, criminal lifestyles

+

marginalizing and ridiculing traditional Christian beliefs and values


are all combining to result in a list of bad things in our society including, but not limited to, random acts of violence like the incident that started this thread, school shootings, moral relativism and a lack of respect for human life.

 

[Lisa]

I interviewed Lt. Col. Grossman in early September for the Standard Democrat just before he addressed faculty at a local school to pitch a program that seeks to reduce violence in youth.

The full article can be found here:

http://news.mywebpal.com:80/news_tool_v2.cfm?pnpid=865&show=archivedetails&ArchiveID=1211424&om=1


Grossman told me that for children ages 2-3 years old, viewing television and movies increases the chance for attention deficit disorders no matter what they are watching.

Some view “violence as vodka, and non-violent stuff as beer,” according to Grossman, with all TV, movies and video games being harmful to some extent.

He has research the indicates that video, TV and movies -- regardless of content -- stimulates certain areas of the brain while reading stimulates others.

The areas stimulated by reading are those that "make us human," Grossman told me.

I don't think it is any one factor, but one thing seems certain to me:

the combination of parents allowing video games, movies and TV to replace them as parents (which indicates less time spent on loving interaction)

+

extremely high volume of video game, movie, TV viewing

+

reduced time spent reading

+

glorification of violent, criminal lifestyles

+

marginalizing and ridiculing traditional Christian beliefs and values


are all combining to result in a list of bad things in our society including, but not limited to, random acts of violence like the incident that started this thread, school shootings, moral relativism and a lack of respect for human life.

Well thought post zDom. One question, explain traditional Christiam beliefs please? Are you inferring that if one does not actively attend church we are harming our children or by traditional beliefs are you inferring to love thy neighbour, be a good person, etc.? Curious, thanks.

 

[Blotan Hunka]

Theres "beliefs" and theres "practices". I could care less if somebody attends church, but upholding beliefs like the golden rule and "traditional religious" beliefs are a good thing.