OMG!!! We do 12 the same way.
What's your targets?
We basically use solar plexus / chest. (I can get more specific if you want the pressure point designations!)
SKK Combos and Various Attacks
- Thread starter MJS
- Start date
OMG!!! We do 12 the same way.
What's your targets?
We basically use solar plexus / chest. (I can get more specific if you want the pressure point designations!)
JTKenpo
Purple Belt
David can I ask why you seem to use the solar plexus as the first shot rather than the groin or the knee? Is it your preference, your instructors preference and/or is there a specific reason you are not targeting low? I ask because on your previous posts it seems that you prefer targeting the solar plexus on combos that I have always heard going low to knee or groin.
JTKenpo
Purple Belt
Combo #15
One of my favorite under black techniques. This technique in my opinion is one of those jack of all attacks. Linear attacks we push away getting behind the person, circular attacks we push upward and away to get behind the person, kicks we can deflect and let them pass us so we are behind. The meat of this technique with the palm, rake, elbow and hammer then drop the person on their back just makes me smile.
One of my favorite under black techniques. This technique in my opinion is one of those jack of all attacks. Linear attacks we push away getting behind the person, circular attacks we push upward and away to get behind the person, kicks we can deflect and let them pass us so we are behind. The meat of this technique with the palm, rake, elbow and hammer then drop the person on their back just makes me smile.
Sure
for the knee - the idea is that the knee is a thin target for a linear thrusting or snapping kick from the front, so for #12 for example, kicking the knee in motion is a lot more difficult than the body. In some techs we do kick to the knee but it is not the first kick, or it is in a grappling/grabbing situation (where their movement is limited).Groin vs SP... depends on what you mean by groin. Do you mean a linear kick into the bladder or lower abdomen, or a rising kick into the testicle/perineum? The lower abdomen kick can probably be interchanged with our SP kick, although the reaction of the attacker will be slightly different so that might need to be accounted for in any specific application. Kicking to the "goodies" will have a bigger difference in reaction and that will almost always need to be accounted for in the execution of any specific technique. In order to optimize the ability to respond spontaneously, techniques that use each reaction should be trained.
RevIV
Black Belt
Just back tracking,, combo 12 is def. one of the original New England Combo's. SGM Pesare teaches it as his 2nd one. Found that out yesterday.
Jesse
Jesse
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Jdokan
Black Belt
2nd technique WOW...what a way to challenge the newbie......
Jdokan
Black Belt
My # 12
Still the same concept...Left #2 Sword block Left snap kick ( a penatrating kick as opposed to a kick that drives the person backwards) to the lower triangle. Step down in that foot forward stance, spin into a 180* twist stance (facing the same way they are) while delivering a right spinning sword to their Liver....Right foot rises from the floor delivering a mule kick to the sternum....cross out the same way the kick originated....NO SPIN..go on guard..
We push 12 as being a Tiger technique so the aura of the technique should resemble that..Blocking hands....strike to ribs...guard....
Still the same concept...Left #2 Sword block Left snap kick ( a penatrating kick as opposed to a kick that drives the person backwards) to the lower triangle. Step down in that foot forward stance, spin into a 180* twist stance (facing the same way they are) while delivering a right spinning sword to their Liver....Right foot rises from the floor delivering a mule kick to the sternum....cross out the same way the kick originated....NO SPIN..go on guard..
We push 12 as being a Tiger technique so the aura of the technique should resemble that..Blocking hands....strike to ribs...guard....
JTKenpo
Purple Belt
#12 was once explained to me as #6 left side into #7 (although there is a spin involved). This would very easily translate into no block, although I personally use one.
14 Kempo
Grandmaster
Only difference I see in ours is the end.
- Left front kick to the midsection, land forward (of course this is a gauge step).
- Right spinning back kick to the midsection.
- After the kick, we do not continue the spin back to facing our opponent. We simple walk out, cross and cover.
marlon
Master Black Belt
i teach it the standard way first but do it myself a little differently: eliminate the block offset the jump to move out the way and it is an ok technique. good for checking to see if your in shape. Personally i am not qualified to eliminate any of the core skk curricullum. Plus it is in 3 kata
Respectfully,
marlon
RevIV
Black Belt
Hey Marlon, enough of this "im not qaulified" stuff.... if you do not like it, chuck it.. you are qaulified enough to teach your students in any way you see fit.
Jesse
marlon
Master Black Belt
thanks for the vote of confidence Master Dwire. My thoughts in this area is that as long as i am teaching SKK and not my owen personal system then i will stick to the core curricullum. i will do everything i can to make sure i give effective training with the material. but it is not my system to change, nor am i a master of it. I will always be honest about what i think is good and what i think sucks and why, but i will teach the core stuff as i have learned it. Dropping things has been done too often and too easily in kempo for my tastes. I have not delved so deeply into the material that i feel i can unilaterally decide to drop something because I do not 'get it'. Perhaps one of my students will. I did drop the half moon becuase of the concrete information out there to demonstrate that it was a 'martial art' mistake to use it. I dropped it after discussing it with my teacher and getting his approuval. Some of the material is challenging on many levels and b/c i have not risen to the challenge does not mean that it is not valueable. SKK is not my system, so dropping things is not something i take lightly. to do so would mean that i had exhausted all the knowledge, resources and training necessary to conclude something as not- worth-teaching. from all the combinations i know and forms have (these are the core things in skk imo) cannot say that i have found any that through bettering my training and using the corrections of body alignment and timing, are not worth teaching as legitimate tools for self defense. And, i still have a great deal to learn! I respect other peoples choices in this area, yet my judgement for myself stands as is for now. I am not qualified to eliminate techniques or forms from the core skk system as i know it. ITo be sure there are things outside the core system that i have changed and eliminated as it is my dojo and i am responsible to teach things that wont get people in trouble. I feel good about the changes, i went through a process to do everythign i could to make it work and i checked with my teacher first. before hand. I respect your opinion and your martial art skill and your teaching ability and your drive to improve, master Dwire, and i count you as a friend in the arts, Jesse. we are in different places about this subject though. I hope i can still come and take some privates from you, sometime soon!
Respectfully,
marlon
14 Kempo
Grandmaster
Not that my word means anything, but I have to agree with Marlon on this one. We teach the core curriculum as it is. There are things that we alter or change, but those are called variations or kempo techniques. Not in all cases, but in many cases, people change things because they don't yet understand them. As an example, have any of you ever been shown a technique and after trying it for a while made a statement such as "I'd never do that" ... well, I have and Ive also found that down the road, maybe even a few years down the road, all of a sudden I learned something from someone, or just gained the experience that allowed me to now understand the movement and therefore validated the technique. Again, I'm with Marlon on this one. Another way that we teach is to teach the original method then allow a person, as they gain experience, to modify the movement to work for them ... always encouraging them to teach the original method and allow the person to grow with it under a teacher's guidance. Let me say this, there are things that some can do that I can't and vice versa. There are adjustments I make to fit my body type and stature, that I would never expect a smaller person to do and although I may show my way as a variation, I can't teach persons my way as 'the way' it just doesn't always work ... does for me. Well, I hope my rant (is it a rant?) is understandable!
marlon
Master Black Belt
Of course your words mean something...when you agree with me and especially when you do not. I appreciate your input.
Respectfully,
Marlon
Respectfully,
Marlon
thanks for the vote of confidence Master Dwire. My thoughts in this area is that as long as i am teaching SKK and not my owen personal system then i will stick to the core curricullum. i will do everything i can to make sure i give effective training with the material. but it is not my system to change, nor am i a master of it. I will always be honest about what i think is good and what i think sucks and why, but i will teach the core stuff as i have learned it. Dropping things has been done too often and too easily in kempo for my tastes. I have not delved so deeply into the material that i feel i can unilaterally decide to drop something because I do not 'get it'. Perhaps one of my students will. I did drop the half moon becuase of the concrete information out there to demonstrate that it was a 'martial art' mistake to use it. I dropped it after discussing it with my teacher and getting his approuval. Some of the material is challenging on many levels and b/c i have not risen to the challenge does not mean that it is not valueable. SKK is not my system, so dropping things is not something i take lightly. to do so would mean that i had exhausted all the knowledge, resources and training necessary to conclude something as not- worth-teaching. from all the combinations i know and forms have (these are the core things in skk imo) cannot say that i have found any that through bettering my training and using the corrections of body alignment and timing, are not worth teaching as legitimate tools for self defense. And, i still have a great deal to learn! I respect other peoples choices in this area, yet my judgement for myself stands as is for now. I am not qualified to eliminate techniques or forms from the core skk system as i know it. ITo be sure there are things outside the core system that i have changed and eliminated as it is my dojo and i am responsible to teach things that wont get people in trouble. I feel good about the changes, i went through a process to do everythign i could to make it work and i checked with my teacher first. before hand. I respect your opinion and your martial art skill and your teaching ability and your drive to improve, master Dwire, and i count you as a friend in the arts, Jesse. we are in different places about this subject though. I hope i can still come and take some privates from you, sometime soon!
Respectfully,
marlon
Could you ilaberate on your reasoning for not teaching the half moon.
Thanks
Chris
marlon
Master Black Belt
It was not really my reasoning that did it , sir, rather the weight of truth. see the threads on stepping and skk half moon. If training is truth, if it is dangerous to teach something in effective then you will see that i had no choice if i wanted to maintain my intergity
Respectfully,
marlon
I checked out the other thread on half mooning and now I understand what you are talking about. What I find wrong is doing the techniques against someone throwing a right punch while half mooning in. The techniques should be done off of a right cross, but I am sure of the 101 combinations in SKK a large handful of them wouldnt work without some modifications. How many actually do their combo off a right cross as apposed to right punch while half mooning in.
Chris
14 Kempo
Grandmaster
I actually think this has all been covered before and we may be being set up, but here goes anyway.
If you are advanced and only working your techniques against a right punch using a half-moon, you are stuck in a box. You need to get outside the box. All techniques should be worked off various attacks; left jab, right cross, left/right hook, various grabs, etc. No, they don't all work against every type of attack, but best to know that in the studio. In the street, they throw a right, whether the right foot comes forward or not, you can rest assured that the left is next.
It is my belief that, at least in my school, we work the basic techniques off a half-moon in right punch ... this is in the beginning, for safety reasons. The half-moon in gives a student learning a new technique time to react. The right punch makes the opponent predicatable which can ensure safety of the opponent, and the person performing the technique as well. Once a technique is understood, the student needs to experiment with it off various attacks. What works, what doesn't work, what can be done to make it work. There are other questions that can be asked, but I think most will get the idea.
Biggest message here, at least in my opinion, is get outside the box, use your mind. Your instructor isn't going to be there to shout out numbers at you, even if he/she was, you would probably not hear it during a scuffle and if you did, you wouldn't be able to hear it, process it and react in time.
JMHO
