Hunting - split from Kukri vs Machette

[drop bear]

Now you're just being silly. This is about like saying "you would have to prove that the Patriots really do want to win the Superbowl".

Nobody goes trophy hunting with the intent of finding a small, scrawny, sickly, weak, mangy specimen.

So you say. You are working on this theory that trophy hunters are not culling or also shooting for meat.

You are working on this theory that females don't have trophies worth keeping.

And working on the theory that killing big males does not reduce the population.

It is not a big ask for some evidence is it?

 

[Dirty Dog]

So you say. You are working on this theory that trophy hunters are not culling or also shooting for meat.

You are working on this theory that females don't have trophies worth keeping.

And working on the theory that killing big males does not reduce the population.

It is not a big ask for some evidence is it?

No. I'm not. I'm working from exactly the position I stated. Trophy hunters are not looking for sickly, weak, mangy, small specimens.



Sent from an old fashioned 300 baud acoustic modem by whistling into the handset. Really.

 

[elder999]

Are we certain that kid isn't just sitting about 20 feet behind the boar in order to, you know, make it look bigger?

Yes, I'm absolutely certain that Jamison Stone shot that 1054 lb. hog in Alabama back in 2007. That's all I'm certain of, though: the exact circumstances of the hunt, and just how "feral" the hog actually was are subjects of some doubt.

 

[drop bear]

No. I'm not. I'm working from exactly the position I stated. Trophy hunters are not looking for sickly, weak, mangy, small specimens.



Sent from an old fashioned 300 baud acoustic modem by whistling into the handset. Really.

Ok but does that relate to whether they help control a feral animal?

 

[Transk53]

Ok but does that relate to whether they help control a feral animal?

Would depend on the animal, or at least what is considered to be an animal, and not a urban pest or suchlike.

 

[drop bear]

Would depend on the animal, or at least what is considered to be an animal, and not a urban pest or suchlike.

So if you could do a culling hunt safari?

Hunt Australia Safaris

 

[drop bear]

No. I'm not. I'm working from exactly the position I stated. Trophy hunters are not looking for sickly, weak, mangy, small specimens.



Sent from an old fashioned 300 baud acoustic modem by whistling into the handset. Really.

apparently they are. Here is a combination full and trophy hunt.

Combination Cull-And-Trophy Hunt by www.huntingreport.com

 

[Transk53]

@drop bear Now you are just being pedantic!

 

[drop bear]

Now you are just being pedantic!

In that i have evidence to support my claim?

Another trophy hunt and cull managing ferals in Australia.

Hunt Down Under in Australia

 

[Dirty Dog]

Ok but does that relate to whether they help control a feral animal?

I suppose in the sense that killing off the finest specimens results in a weaker, sickly, less hardy breed, I suppose that it does. Is it your opinion that we should be trying to ensure that only the poorest genes get passed on?

 

[drop bear]

I suppose in the sense that killing off the finest specimens results in a weaker, sickly, less hardy breed, I suppose that it does. Is it your opinion that we should be trying to ensure that only the poorest genes get passed on?

Makes no real difference Trophy hunters will do culls at the same time. So the point becomes kind of moot.

In that they are looking for sickly week ect.

 

[Blindside]

apparently they are. Here is a combination full and trophy hunt.

Combination Cull-And-Trophy Hunt by www.huntingreport.com[/QUOTE]

So you will notice that it had to define both of the hunt types that will occur. My point has always been that trophy hunting by itself is not a useful method of population control, that is exactly why they have cull hunts. If a trophy hunter also does a cull hunt then they aren't just trophy hunting.

 

[Blindside]

I suppose in the sense that killing off the finest specimens results in a weaker, sickly, less hardy breed, I suppose that it does. Is it your opinion that we should be trying to ensure that only the poorest genes get passed on?

You have to be very specific about the impacts of trophy hunting on populations, specific to species and area, you can't generalize about this. This isn't my area of expertise, but most of the work that has shone the serious impacts of trophy hunting are genetically isolated populations. There are still world record of elk and deer in the US being brought in in recent years despite years of trophy hunting.

 

[Flying Crane]

So you say. You are working on this theory that trophy hunters are not culling or also shooting for meat.

You are working on this theory that females don't have trophies worth keeping.

And working on the theory that killing big males does not reduce the population.

It is not a big ask for some evidence is it?

You have to be very specific about the impacts of trophy hunting on populations, specific to species and area, you can't generalize about this. This isn't my area of expertise, but most of the work that has shone the serious impacts of trophy hunting are genetically isolated populations. There are still world record of elk and deer in the US being brought in in recent years despite years of trophy hunting.

good points. And to my earlier points, I cannot imagine any positive or neutral impact that trophy hunting might have on Big African game like elephants and rhinos, whose populations are threatened. I can't imagine any justification for a cull hunt on those animals. Any deliberate killing of those animals is heinous.

 

[Blindside]

good points. And to my earlier points, I cannot imagine any positive or neutral impact that trophy hunting might have on Big African game like elephants and rhinos, whose populations are threatened. I can't imagine any justification for a cull hunt on those animals. Any deliberate killing of those animals is heinous.

In some areas elephants are overpopulating their habitats, and the last recommendation I heard was actually to remove entire herds at once rather than selectively remove individuals. If you trophy hunt and remove the bull elephant you may wind up with (literally) a bunch of juvenile delinquint junior males who sort of go nuts without the discipline instilled by the bull. Not a fun subject.

Edit: And just to point out that this would be an instance where trophy hunting would not be recommended even if it had no negative impact on the genetic health of the elephant herd.

 

[drop bear]

So you will notice that it had to define both of the hunt types that will occur. My point has always been that trophy hunting by itself is not a useful method of population control, that is exactly why they have cull hunts. If a trophy hunter also does a cull hunt then they aren't just trophy hunting.

I am pretty sure you were suggesting that combining both did not exist at all. Because the big ones were scared away.

That trophy hunts don't control the population. Trophy culls absolutely do.

 

[drop bear]

good points. And to my earlier points, I cannot imagine any positive or neutral impact that trophy hunting might have on Big African game like elephants and rhinos, whose populations are threatened. I can't imagine any justification for a cull hunt on those animals. Any deliberate killing of those animals is heinous.

Africa is a weird one because they have been combating poaching for years. And the methods they have been using are not really working.

They fight gun battles out there and they struggle to get the money and the man power to do that.

The legal hunting farms put money into conservation of the species and the prevention of poaching. So it may be heinous but they are saving the species in a way they have not been able to do otherwise.

It is an awkward one that.

 

[Blindside]

I am pretty sure you were suggesting that combining both did not exist at all. Because the big ones were scared away.

That trophy hunts don't control the population. Trophy culls absolutely do.

Please explain what a trophy cull is.

 

[drop bear]

Please explain what a trophy cull is.

Hunt Down Under in Australia

You go out shoot a heap of animals keep the body parts of the ones you like.

The trophy hunters pay for the cull so they get a trophy and get to shoot a few extra animals. Otherwise wildlife services (the tax payer) foots the bill.

 

[Blindside]

I am pretty sure you were suggesting that combining both did not exist at all. Because the big ones were scared away.

That trophy hunts don't control the population. Trophy culls absolutely do.

Do you hunt?
If you just dropped $12,000 on a hunt for a trophy buff, then you will spend your time pursuing it. Anytime spent doing something else, like stalking a cull animal or dressing it out is time not spent toward the trophy, and you are on a limited time frame with these hunts. Trophy hunters are picky at least the experienced ones are, I have watched guys pass up 8 point bucks in hopes of getting a 10. I suspect most of those culls are taken after the trophy is taken. But it sounds like it is a good program, I hope it works.