Has olympic Taekwondo ruined the reputation of the art?
- Thread starter Mr. President
- Start date
Folks, as amusing as this can be, and as much in favor of education and improved vacabularies as I am, I'd still like to ask that we make an effort to return to the original topic. Thanks.
To a certain extent, this is true of pretty much everything. Kids involved in any sport or art tend to be the pool from which future leaders come. And highlights that none of us "own" any of the arts that we practice, but are merely stewards of it. How the current stewards train kids and teens and what lessons they teach them will have a strong impact on how future stewards care for the arts.
By its nature, internet posters, be they curmudgeons or no, are not developing the art, at least not in their capacity as internet posters. Developing the art is a hands on, in person affair. While we can discuss and debate how the art has developed/is developing in interenet forums, we are not developing the art in the process.
Also, being a curmudgeon does not automatically mean that a person only sees what they do as valid. In fact, some those who are highly critical of the Kukkiwon and the WTF do see validity in things other than what they do; they simply don't care for what the Kukkiwon and the WTF do. And not all of them are curmudgeons. In fact, curmudgeons can be found on both sides of the debate.
Positivity attracts positivity and negativity attracts negativity. Regardless of how one feels about the subject.
I don't mind curmudgeons. I do mind, "agree with me 100% or not at all" and "this is how it is here, so this is how it is everywhere." Though in fairness, that second one is an easy trap to fall into. I try to check myself before saying that something is or is not a certain way categorically based soley on personal experience because different areas have very different dynamics.
And if I were a curmudgeon, I'd say that if you're trying to educate people about curmudgeons, you should at least spell the word right. But I'm not, so I won't.
Well, I have nothing more to add to this topic. In summary, I do not believe that taekwondo in the Olympics has ruined, or otherwise had a negative impact on the repuation of the art as a whole. Anyone who wants greater detail on my answer can go back through the twenty five pages and read my responses.
Good day to all.
Good day to all.
I agree. To this day we get people that come in all the time looking to start a Martial Art and they still call it Karate even though every sign at the school says Taekwondo. If you are doing Taekwondo then you should be focused on your training and what others do should not bother your. I don't care what Kung Fu people are doing nor do I care what Kempo people are doing. It does not affect me. Just as they don't care what Taekwondo people are doing. I also don't care what other Taekwondo people are doing in their schools. People not coming in to join a TKD school has nothing to do with the Olympics but more to do with what they see when looking at the school itself.
tkdwarrior
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In watching recent taekwomdo competitions amd managing the same, I cannot but help notice the deterioration of our techniques and the martial artness of this event that we all love.
May I suggest that a return to some of the old rules be implemented?
May I suggest that a plus factor power point of 2 additional points be given to a competitor who because he/she manages to stagger an opponent because of his/her technique or causes his/her opponent to be knocked down because of his/her technique.
This will return some of the proper execution of techniques and at the same time minimize the "falling down" evasion tactics of many competitors.
Kindly forward my suggestion to whoever may have the power to act on it. Thank you
May I suggest that a return to some of the old rules be implemented?
May I suggest that a plus factor power point of 2 additional points be given to a competitor who because he/she manages to stagger an opponent because of his/her technique or causes his/her opponent to be knocked down because of his/her technique.
This will return some of the proper execution of techniques and at the same time minimize the "falling down" evasion tactics of many competitors.
Kindly forward my suggestion to whoever may have the power to act on it. Thank you
Balrog
Master of Arts
This +1. Very well stated.
dancingalone
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Having run a commercial school for a few years now, I can say anecdotally that Olympic TKD has had NO impact whatsoever on my prospective students when they drop by the school. I've never been asked about whether we offer such programs, and I would bet 8 out of 10 times, the prospect has no idea that TKD even exists as an Olympic sport.
Much ado about nothing IMO. If you like it and want to train it, great. If not fine too. It matters as much to my daily life as does the existence of snowboarding as a Winter Games event.
Much ado about nothing IMO. If you like it and want to train it, great. If not fine too. It matters as much to my daily life as does the existence of snowboarding as a Winter Games event.
I agree that most people don't know that it's an Olympic sport and don't ask about that, but I've found that mentioning that it is can be a selling point, since it shows some legitimacy.
What we do get asked is about whether we do contact sparring on a regular basis, since most non-WTF schools around here don't. They do very occaisional light/no-contact point sparring, if they do any sparring at all.
So while I know this thread is basically about how WTF sparring isn't serious fighting and looks like tag or whatever, my experience is that when people come in and see the WTF sparring, and especially when they try it during their trial (we have extra gear so they can), they tend to be pretty impressed at the intensity and fun of it, and it's a big selling point for us.
Sure, the WTF rules could probably be improved to make the high-level matches more visually exciting and to make things more realistic. But, you know, I'm still pretty happy with what it on the whole.
Only if you're marketing a sport, rather than a Martial Art...
We've never had anybody (that I am aware of) who cared one way or the other about TKD as an Olympic sport.
We have had people leave because we are upfront about the fact that their 10 year old will not be getting a black belt from us anytime soon.
dancingalone
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Don't think I've had many conversations along that line either. No questions about lineage. Maybe 1 total asking about 'certification', but the person asking that came from another TKD system and thus was pre-sold already into the idea of martial arts certification, which as we know is a very recent phenomenon. While we're on the subject, no newbie to the art has ever asked me to explain the different between our style and other TKD styles, nor asked us if we offered KKW certs or ITF or whatever else is out there.
People care about location, price, time slots, and the training itself. Probably in that order too IMO.
Hmm, guess I was pretty unclear about what I meant by "legitimacy".
What I mean is that, firstly, having TKD sparring be in the Olympics gives what we do more legitimacy to prospective students/parents, because it indicates to them that it's a "real thing" in the sense that it's an internationally organized sport that can can be taken very seriously and done at a very high level of competition.
Also, while WTF sparring is sport, it's also people actually striking each other with some amount of force. Something that, at most of our competitors, never happens. WTF sparring is not as realistic as some types of martial arts sparring, but it's a lot more realistic than kicking a sheet of paper or "kick near your opponent's body and then stop and reset and if you hit them you lose". Which is pretty much the alternative around here, for TKD/TSD/karate type places.
What I mean is that, firstly, having TKD sparring be in the Olympics gives what we do more legitimacy to prospective students/parents, because it indicates to them that it's a "real thing" in the sense that it's an internationally organized sport that can can be taken very seriously and done at a very high level of competition.
Also, while WTF sparring is sport, it's also people actually striking each other with some amount of force. Something that, at most of our competitors, never happens. WTF sparring is not as realistic as some types of martial arts sparring, but it's a lot more realistic than kicking a sheet of paper or "kick near your opponent's body and then stop and reset and if you hit them you lose". Which is pretty much the alternative around here, for TKD/TSD/karate type places.
tkdwarrior
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No it has not but actually made it more popular. What is ruining it is the yearly change of rules that now makes our competitions look like child's play.
Thunder Foot
Brown Belt
I love TKD in the Olympics, but until we get a new set of rules in this sport, it's going to die out and be on the Olympic elimination roster just like wrestling was.
These grazing blows to the head or "whiffed" attacks that are being counted as legitimate points simply must come to a halt. The powers that be should respect that this is a combative art, and award points accordingly. In a perfect world for me, they would adopt more of the Olympic boxing rule set in terms of impact and scoring criteria.
So yes, in my opinion the current rule set as it stands is certainly hurting the essence of TKD after its international recognition in the Olympics.
These grazing blows to the head or "whiffed" attacks that are being counted as legitimate points simply must come to a halt. The powers that be should respect that this is a combative art, and award points accordingly. In a perfect world for me, they would adopt more of the Olympic boxing rule set in terms of impact and scoring criteria.
So yes, in my opinion the current rule set as it stands is certainly hurting the essence of TKD after its international recognition in the Olympics.
Manny
Senior Master
I think is ALL TRUE!!! but that's sport TKD not TRUE TKD! The true TKD is the one the implies many many things not only hovering and hoping like a rabbit and trowing weird kicks to just smack the hogu or just slap the helmet to get points.
Manny
I would say that "TRUE TKD" includes sport TKD. Certainly the sport is only a subset of the art, but it's still true TKD.
Manny
Senior Master
Not necesarily, inside TKD kyorugy is something important but Olimpic/TKD kyougi is not very important, however if your TKD dojang focusses on olimpic jyorugi style then it's super important.
There is a diference beetwen kyorugi and olimpic tkd sparring.
Manny
