Bartitsu???

CNida

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I heard mention of this art in an article I read at work a few weeks ago. I since have been unable to locate this article, but I looked up some info on the art a few days ago, and was both somewhat amused yet skeptical at the same time.

Apparently this art is gaining in popularity over the last so-many years. From what I read it just seems to be like some sort of amalgam of a few different martial arts, namely boxing and some CMA's.

Anyone know more about this art called Bartitsu? Admittedly, the only source I have is wikipedia, which I am skeptical of using as a pure source anyway.

From my uneducated perspective it just seems to be an early combination of arts that somewhat resembles modern MMA.

Penny for your thoughts?


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frank raud

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My thoughts. Bartitsu was the original Western mixed martial art. Edward William Barton Wright was a British engineer who spent time in Japan. While there, he learned some jiujutsu. Upon his return to England, he sponsored several Japanese to come over and demonstrate their art in the musical halls of England. To anyone familiar with the history of martial arts in England, the names Uyenishi and Yukio Tani will be familiar. In combination with the Japanese jiu jutsu, he combined Wrestling, Savate, Stick fighting, cane fighting and other arts, making a multi-disciplinary art probably closer to modern JKD than MMA, due to the inclusion of weapons. Bartitsu was mentioned in a Sherlock Holmes novel, which led to modern researcher re-discovering Bartitsu, re-publishing the original articles and info, and attemting to recreate(at least in spirit) the lost art. If you look in the Western arts section of Martialtalk, you will find more detailed info on it.
 
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CNida

CNida

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My thoughts. Bartitsu was the original Western mixed martial art. Edward William Barton Wright was a British engineer who spent time in Japan. While there, he learned some jiujutsu. Upon his return to England, he sponsored several Japanese to come over and demonstrate their art in the musical halls of England. To anyone familiar with the history of martial arts in England, the names Uyenishi and Yukio Tani will be familiar. In combination with the Japanese jiu jutsu, he combined Wrestling, Savate, Stick fighting, cane fighting and other arts, making a multi-disciplinary art probably closer to modern JKD than MMA, due to the inclusion of weapons. Bartitsu was mentioned in a Sherlock Holmes novel, which led to modern researcher re-discovering Bartitsu, re-publishing the original articles and info, and attemting to recreate(at least in spirit) the lost art. If you look in the Western arts section of Martialtalk, you will find more detailed info on it.

Thank you. I should have looked there first before posting!


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lklawson

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I heard mention of this art in an article I read at work a few weeks ago. I since have been unable to locate this article, but I looked up some info on the art a few days ago, and was both somewhat amused yet skeptical at the same time.

Apparently this art is gaining in popularity over the last so-many years. From what I read it just seems to be like some sort of amalgam of a few different martial arts, namely boxing and some CMA's.

Anyone know more about this art called Bartitsu? Admittedly, the only source I have is wikipedia, which I am skeptical of using as a pure source anyway.

From my uneducated perspective it just seems to be an early combination of arts that somewhat resembles modern MMA.
Pretty much like Frank said.

Resource: http://www.bartitsu.org

I practice Bartitsu/teach in my garage Salle. There are two general disciplines within the Bartitsu community. First there's classic Canonical Bartitsu. It focuses on trying to re-create Bartitsu as it existed in the early 20th Century. It relies heavily upon the limited recorded material available about the art along with recombining the original source arts within the general focus of what Barton-Wright wrote about the art, how each was implemented and used, and what the precepts and goals of the art were at the time. A key, yet under stated, part of this is the assumption of late 19th Century and early 20th Century criminal style attacks, which can, sometimes, be somewhat different from modern criminal attacks (and, yet, very often are much the same). This along with an assumption of attire and paraphernalia of a period middle-class gentleman practitioner (which would often include a gentleman's walking stick). It's sort of Martial Archeology.

The second is what is sometimes called Neo-Bartitsu. It is an attempt to accelerate the evolution of classic Bartitsu, if it had survived, into a modern self defense context, similar in general concept to JKD or Krav Maga.

It is sometimes said that "Canonical Bartitsu" is Bartitsu As It Was, and "Neo-Bartitsu" is Bartisu As It Might Have Become.

My personal focus is more on Canonical Bartitsu because I find it far more interesting than yet another JKD/CQC offering. :)

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
 

PhotonGuy

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I heard mention of this art in an article I read at work a few weeks ago. I since have been unable to locate this article, but I looked up some info on the art a few days ago, and was both somewhat amused yet skeptical at the same time.

Apparently this art is gaining in popularity over the last so-many years. From what I read it just seems to be like some sort of amalgam of a few different martial arts, namely boxing and some CMA's.

Anyone know more about this art called Bartitsu? Admittedly, the only source I have is wikipedia, which I am skeptical of using as a pure source anyway.

From my uneducated perspective it just seems to be an early combination of arts that somewhat resembles modern MMA.

Penny for your thoughts?


____________________________

"A man who has attained mastery of an art reveals it in his every action." - Anonymous

I thought it was some kind of martial art that Sherlock Holmes did. A fictional art that was made up for the character. But perhaps it is, or is based on, a real art.
 

Big Don

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It sounds like the type of self defense practiced by pole dancers and their co-workers...
 

frank raud

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I thought it was some kind of martial art that Sherlock Holmes did. A fictional art that was made up for the character. But perhaps it is, or is based on, a real art.
Sherlock actually practiced Baritsu, a fictional art based on Bartitsu, an actual art.
 

lklawson

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I thought it was some kind of martial art that Sherlock Holmes did. A fictional art that was made up for the character. But perhaps it is, or is based on, a real art.
That's one of the mysteries surrounding it.

The fictional Holmes, through author Conan Doyle, explained how he survived his epic dual-death fight with Moriarty. See, Conan Doyle was tired of writing Holmes and wanted to kill him off. So he did. But the fans spoke and he had to bring Holmes back. He needed a sort of deus ex machina. At the time of his writing Holmes back from the dead, Barton-Wright's "new" martial art was at the height of it's popularity and was receiving a lot of press, some of it quite positive, some of it rather skeptical. So when Conan Doyle revived Holmes, Holmes claimed that it was his knowledge of "Baritsu" the art of "Japanese wrestling." The spelling was different than Barton-Wright's, self-titled Bartitsu. One big question has always been "why?" Some have suggested that it was an accident on Conan Doyle's part. Some that it was a deliberate misspelling in order to avoid legal issues. However, at this point, it seems most likely that Conan Doyle simply swiped the name and (mis)spelling from an earlier article in the London Times. An accidental misspelling but not Conan Doyle's error.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
 

lklawson

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It sounds like the type of self defense practiced by pole dancers and their co-workers...
We'd have a lot more interest in the art if it were so! ;)

But, yes, there have been known to be some snickers when the name is spoken.

Poor Barton-Wright. It wasn't an issue when he made his combined art. Sadly for him, languages evolve.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
 

PhotonGuy

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I always took Sherlock Holmes to be the kind of guy that would outsmart his opponents rather than outfight them, at least as the character was more developed. I know some of the early depictions of Sherlock Holmes had him more action oriented, but then later on he would think instead of act, although he always was a thinker. I do know that Conan Doyle decided to kill him off but people were very upset about it so he brought him back. So I take it that was when Baritsu was first mentioned.
 

jks9199

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I always took Sherlock Holmes to be the kind of guy that would outsmart his opponents rather than outfight them, at least as the character was more developed. I know some of the early depictions of Sherlock Holmes had him more action oriented, but then later on he would think instead of act, although he always was a thinker. I do know that Conan Doyle decided to kill him off but people were very upset about it so he brought him back. So I take it that was when Baritsu was first mentioned.
Holmes was always shown as an active character; in his very first appearance, he was whacking a cadaver to examine post-mortem bruising, and there are many stories where he demonstrates physical skill and prowess.
 

PhotonGuy

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Holmes was always shown as an active character; in his very first appearance, he was whacking a cadaver to examine post-mortem bruising, and there are many stories where he demonstrates physical skill and prowess.

In his early appearances from what I know he was shown to be physical and action oriented and would carry and use a gun. Also, he was supposedly really strong, I think it was once mentioned he could bend a fireplace poker in half. However, from what I heard, he did less of that in later on appearances. I was never a big Sherlock Holmes fan so I could be wrong but that's what I've heard. For instance, he didn't use or carry a gun so much in his later adventures. As for the Baritsu, if it was first mentioned after the story where he was supposedly killed off, that would add a nice twist to his newer stories.
 

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