Atacx gym capoeira: You can fight with it

[ATACX GYM]

If I can take a moment to interject between in the personal sparring, I just wanted to say I enjoyed the videos. Thanks for posting them. I always have high regard for those who are willing to put their technique up for display in front of their piers.

As for the content, in watching the OP's movement, I believe he's quite capable. For now I'll just leave it at that. As for the technique, I feel they're a little more complicated than your average person can or would do in a self defense situation. Pretty hard sell for a 2 minute video. As instructors, we don't teach martial artists, we create them. They must be able to learn what we're teaching. To that end, my own techniques and those that I teach are more basic with less movement. I feel it gives my students a better chance of success. That's in no way to say yours can't be effective, but it does limit your audience simply because your average "joe" doesn't display your level of dexterity. Good stuff though! Again, thank you! When you get a place, maybe I'll come spend an afternoon and show you how an old man does it. If I break a hip doing a cart wheel, it's on you though. :uhyeah:

thank you very much for the intermission, sir...

Perhaps something along the lines of my variants of these Kenpo techs of my Gym might be more your taste?


[video=youtube_share;hPkcflmZLmI]http://youtu.be/hPkcflmZLmI[/video]


[video=youtube_share;6swpRPoq05Q]http://youtu.be/6swpRPoq05Q[/video]

These next 2 vids are about 3 minutes long each,and are parts 2 and 3 of my variants of CAPTURED TWIGS from Kenpo...

[video=youtube_share;xevT5TPfcGE]http://youtu.be/xevT5TPfcGE[/video]


[video=youtube_share;AKAoR0eDa8I]http://youtu.be/AKAoR0eDa8I[/video]

 

[Gemini]

Perhaps something along the lines of my variants of these Kenpo techs of my Gym might be more your taste?

Yes, these are much more similar to the self defense I teach, though of course, the techniques vary somewhat. Similarly, we use the low licks, foot stomp, groin strike and head butt among others. Your locking technique is effective and I like that you stress the clasp on the wrist because it's the foundation of what makes that technique work. Students always want to loose the grip once the movement migrates from defensive to offensive. I also like that you start will more realistic holds, making the technique more believable. Good stuff!

 

[Twin Fist]

Never saw you answer the question Coach. Thats why i asked again. BTW i lived in Long Beach for 5 years. Learned kenpo there.

and again, I am not the one making claims, so trying to deflect to me is a waste of time. BTW- i didnt even get an infraction, much less a threat of a ban. So you just told a lie. And if i got a "whoppin" i didnt notice, so it wasnt very impressive........./roll

but here is the thing RAS

you put stuff out there, you lose the right to complain about people's reaction to it. I told you I thought you had some skill, so you dont have to go trying to convince me how awesome you are. BTW- i am not known for giving out compliments, so you should feel really good that I complimented your skill. Maybe self promotion is the only mode you operate in, i dont know, and i dont care, really, but you dont need to with me. its boring and pointless.

I am not trying to crow about how awesome I am, so I dont have anything TO prove. I am not even teaching right now, since I went back to college to get my nursing degree.

"...and Long Beach rock em sock em ghetto child firepower. You are clearly nowhere near prepared for what I can do and routinely bring"

is that a threat? or are you trying to intimidate me? cuz it isnt working, sorry.

I dont respond to any challenges because I am not 13 and this isnt ancient Japan

Also, they are a violation of the rules here. Challenges and threats are a no no.

Here is the bottom line

You can post vids all day

everyone else gets to comment

those are the ropes, everyone wins

comments are not limited to only those that approve or agree.

if you cant handle disagreement, dont put yourself out there. cuz the thing is, you could say something as obvious as "the sky is blue" someone somewhere will argue with you about how it really isnt. It is the nature of the universe. You, me, no one gets to say people are not allowed to disagree.

you claim this stuff works for real. I disagree.

those are the breaks.

it isnt personal

 

[Twin Fist]

If I had to choose between being a massive commercial success yet catastrophic martial arts failure both technically and as a human being, and being an outstanding martial artist human being father brother son believer in the Creator and friend? Without a doubt, gentle readers, I would choose the latter.

totally agree

 

[ATACX GYM]

Never saw you answer the question Coach. Thats why i asked again. BTW i lived in Long Beach for 5 years. Learned kenpo there.

and again, I am not the one making claims, so trying to deflect to me is a waste of time. BTW- i didnt even get an infraction, much less a threat of a ban. So you just told a lie. And if i got a "whoppin" i didnt notice, so it wasnt very impressive........./roll

but here is the thing RAS

you put stuff out there, you lose the right to complain about people's reaction to it. I told you I thought you had some skill, so you dont have to go trying to convince me how awesome you are. BTW- i am not known for giving out compliments, so you should feel really good that I complimented your skill. Maybe self promotion is the only mode you operate in, i dont know, and i dont care, really, but you dont need to with me. its boring and pointless.

I am not trying to crow about how awesome I am, so I dont have anything TO prove. I am not even teaching right now, since I went back to college to get my nursing degree.

"...and Long Beach rock em sock em ghetto child firepower. You are clearly nowhere near prepared for what I can do and routinely bring"

is that a threat? or are you trying to intimidate me? cuz it isnt working, sorry.

I dont respond to any challenges because I am not 13 and this isnt ancient Japan

Also, they are a violation of the rules here. Challenges and threats are a no no.

Here is the bottom line

You can post vids all day

everyone else gets to comment

those are the ropes, everyone wins

comments are not limited to only those that approve or agree.

if you cant handle disagreement, dont put yourself out there. cuz the thing is, you could say something as obvious as "the sky is blue" someone somewhere will argue with you about how it really isnt. It is the nature of the universe. You, me, no one gets to say people are not allowed to disagree.

you claim this stuff works for real. I disagree.

those are the breaks.

it isnt personal

John, we all know and you know too that the general tenor of your posts in regards to me have been significantly more abrasive than the more rational, evenly balanced post of yours that I have quoted above. I don't think that I need to leave links to the various disparaging and disrespectful names that you have found it needful to call me without any sort of provocation from me. If your posts were in general of a tone and tenor as the above, we would never have had the kinds of disagreements that we have had in our past. I am quite well known for responding with equanimity and equilibrium to dissenting posts as long as the posts aren't blatantly disrespectful or deliberately belligerent. The threads that I left links to show without a doubt that you have thrown abrasive barbs at me like "poser" and other uncalled for comments when I literally hadn't said nary a word to you nor mentioned your name. Okay we get it John...you don't think capoeira works combatively. Fine. We have 5 centuries of documented history including the entire campaign of the Paraguayan war which absolutely factually shows the opposite. You are still entirely entitled to your opinion, no matter how contrary it is to the historical record. I did note that you acknowledged that I have skill and I thank you for that acknowledgement but I also note that your denigration of my person my opinions and your repeated statements that you dislike me personally far outnumber any even tempered posts or even "compliments" you may have tossed my way...so I tend to think that you're more invested in the latter than the former, since your posts are literally 12 to 1 in favor of the latter visavis the former whenever and wherever I'm concerned.

With that being said, I hope that the kinds of posts that I have quoted above become more typical of your posting. Good luck with your nursing degree and martial journey.

 

[Twin Fist]

my opinion of you has exactly ZERO to do with my opinion of your opinions in matters related to martial arts. It is irrelevant to the discussion at hand. There are people, well known people that I dislike personally. That has nothing to do with my evaluation of their skills. There is a world famous kenpo guy that I had to walk away from when i met him cuz he was an ***.

" We have 5 centuries of documented history including the entire campaign of the Paraguayan war which absolutely factually shows the opposite. You are still entirely entitled to your opinion, no matter how contrary it is to the historical record."

we have centuries of documented evidence that muskets work too. Doesnt make it a good idea to use one today does it? Hell, I can produce documented evidence of bigfoot, but you are still only ever gonna see one on a beef jerky commercial.....documented historical evidence means exactly nothing to me.

you will NEVER convince me that those tricks, and that is all they are, tricks, are viable self defense techniques. I have seen people score in tournament fighting with this stuff, after all, it is un-expected and uncommon
but tournaments aint real

And I dont care what Anderson Silva can do. You aint Anderson Silva and neither am I and neither one of us will ever be that good. And what a professional fighter can do in a contest is irrelevant to self defense for the street were are no rules and the bad guys are never alone.

yes, there are flukes where someone gets caught off guard and gets hit. So dont bother posting all the clips of flukes, accidents and simple good luck

Your claims fly in the face of literally everything ever written about real self defense. Real Self defense can best be summed up as:

KISS

keep it simple, stupid

tricks cant be relied on, handstands are idiocy, and anything that leaves you WIDE OPEN to getting your *** busted, is a very bad idea

In EVERY SINGLE CLIP you posted IF YOU MISS, you will be dead because the trick leaves you WIDE OPEN.

And there is a reason that Casa de Kenpo shows the technique at 1/4 speed AND full speed.

save the tales of you fighting off entire schools of grandmasters. Save the stories of your beach rumbles with 123 ninjas. No one wants to hear you crow about how you can make it work cuz of how much of a bad *** you are. This is a martial arts BB, we are all bad asses. lol

oh, and to be fair, I call BS on most style of kung fu too. drunken monkey? pfffft please try that crap on the street.

these systems with the outlandish moves are still great martial arts to learn and study and the techniques build our bodies and the culture is awesome and all sorts of satisfying to study and learn

but

some things just dont work when the **** is real. No matter how much of a bad *** the person doing them is.

 

[Josh Oakley]

You guys might both want to switch to decaf.

Twin Fist, you have been negative from the first post. What was your intent of coming on in the first place? That was rhetorical. Weapon's Law, man. Weapon's Law.

Atacx, the maelstrom of incendiary verbosity was counterproductive to the discussion at hand. In other words, chill out.

Last time I checked, this is a place for FRIENDLY martial arts discussion.

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[Josh Oakley]

WHEATON'S Law. Damn autocorrect.

 

[Twin Fist]

autocorrect sucks

 

[ATACX GYM]

You guys might both want to switch to decaf.

Twin Fist, you have been negative from the first post. What was your intent of coming on in the first place? That was rhetorical. Weapon's Law, man. Weapon's Law.

Atacx, the maelstrom of incendiary verbosity was counterproductive to the discussion at hand. In other words, chill out.

Last time I checked, this is a place for FRIENDLY martial arts discussion.

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Noted...and I don't drink coffee. Lol.

 

[Cyriacus]

I dont really get why Youre argueing with each other - Im pretty sure you two have some background though

Also, Id suggest You need more Caffeine, and not less. Might I also recommend using Two Sugars?

 

[Twin Fist]

I live on cokes, but i cant drink coffee, tears my stomach up too much.

Noted...and I don't drink coffee. Lol.

 

[Josh Oakley]

On the plus side, they make calf coke.

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[Josh Oakley]

Decaf that is

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[jks9199]

Folks, this is getting way to personal and way too heated. Fraudbusting is not tolerated, and some things are getting awful close here. Leave off the personal attacks, stick to facts and the issue. If you can't play nice, go somewhere else.

In sum:

ATTENTION ALL USERS:

Fraudbusting, personal attacks, and challenge posts are forbidden on MartialTalk. Please keep the discussion polite and respectful.

Jim Sheeran
jks9199
MT Assistant Administrator

 

[Josh Oakley]

Ok, now back to the polite and friendly discussion, Atacx, there are a couple of general comments I have on the videos. I would suggest that you evaluate the combos and perhaps build in some redundancy into them. Vid three is a good example of this. Each move requires the prior move work. As you know, in a fight, it it a lot more beneficial to be able to move on to the next thing if the first one doesn't. My two cents.

 

[ATACX GYM]

Thanks for the response. Yeah, maybe a different camera angle might help, because I'm trying to figure how you would jerk him backwards from in front of him. I am sure it's possible, but it seems really unlikely.

I should have been specific on the timing. The knee, kick, or leg check counter while countering the punch. Granted, if you catch me with the punch, or even distract me long enough to hit the groin, there's a VERY high probability that you'll get to the headlock. But, the point of the technique (if I understand right) was if the guy knew how to check a punch. Well let's take it further and say he knows how to check the leg at the same time he checks the punch (not exactly an uncommon tactic in the martial arts.) That's where the ability to pull off the groin shot becomes really doubtful, as well as the subsequent positiva.

Headlock? Which video of mine are you referring to?

 

[Josh Oakley]

The third one. And I meant to say rear naked choke.

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[ATACX GYM]

my opinion of you has exactly ZERO to do with my opinion of your opinions in matters related to martial arts. It is irrelevant to the discussion at hand. There are people, well known people that I dislike personally. That has nothing to do with my evaluation of their skills. There is a world famous kenpo guy that I had to walk away from when i met him cuz he was an ***.

" We have 5 centuries of documented history including the entire campaign of the Paraguayan war which absolutely factually shows the opposite. You are still entirely entitled to your opinion, no matter how contrary it is to the historical record."

we have centuries of documented evidence that muskets work too. Doesnt make it a good idea to use one today does it? Hell, I can produce documented evidence of bigfoot, but you are still only ever gonna see one on a beef jerky commercial.....documented historical evidence means exactly nothing to me.

you will NEVER convince me that those tricks, and that is all they are, tricks, are viable self defense techniques. I have seen people score in tournament fighting with this stuff, after all, it is un-expected and uncommon
but tournaments aint real

And I dont care what Anderson Silva can do. You aint Anderson Silva and neither am I and neither one of us will ever be that good. And what a professional fighter can do in a contest is irrelevant to self defense for the street were are no rules and the bad guys are never alone.

yes, there are flukes where someone gets caught off guard and gets hit. So dont bother posting all the clips of flukes, accidents and simple good luck

Your claims fly in the face of literally everything ever written about real self defense. Real Self defense can best be summed up as:

KISS

keep it simple, stupid

tricks cant be relied on, handstands are idiocy, and anything that leaves you WIDE OPEN to getting your *** busted, is a very bad idea

In EVERY SINGLE CLIP you posted IF YOU MISS, you will be dead because the trick leaves you WIDE OPEN.

And there is a reason that Casa de Kenpo shows the technique at 1/4 speed AND full speed.

save the tales of you fighting off entire schools of grandmasters. Save the stories of your beach rumbles with 123 ninjas. No one wants to hear you crow about how you can make it work cuz of how much of a bad *** you are. This is a martial arts BB, we are all bad asses. lol

oh, and to be fair, I call BS on most style of kung fu too. drunken monkey? pfffft please try that crap on the street.

these systems with the outlandish moves are still great martial arts to learn and study and the techniques build our bodies and the culture is awesome and all sorts of satisfying to study and learn

but

some things just dont work when the **** is real. No matter how much of a bad *** the person doing them is.

If capoeira is nothing but tricks? Lotsa people have been getting tricked on battlefields over the last 5 centuries and right now as we post drug cartels are being tricked in the favelas in Brazil; and these drug cartels employ hitmen and tons of bad guys rockin machine guns. Lotsa people have been tricked into defeat right here in the streets of Long Beach CA where I and several of my clients and many other mestres have been tricking people for years and even scores of point fighting MMA bareknuckle karate hardcore Thai Muay Thai international Muay Thai and UFC competetiors and champions like Anderson Silva have been tricking people. Seems like alotta people get tricked right to sleep. But hey...I am not trying to convince you, John. Not my intention when I opened this thread. You don't think capoeira is a viable self-defense method? Fine. Noted. Like I said...the literal documents of history and warfare prove you to be absolutely positively factually wrong...but that has nothing to do with your right to trumpet your opinion [ which by definition isn't factual] as loud as you want. Hell my opinion isn't fact either...in this case, however, my opinion is absolutely in alignment with historical fact. Yours is in diametric opposition to it.

http://www.buzzle.com/articles/capoeira-history.html


"...As a way of rebellion, the slaves began to kill their white masters, and burnt down the plantations that they were working in. In order to prevent arrest, the slaves sought refuge in mountains near the city of Recife, and received great help from the Indians in and around the areas. In their endeavor to flee, they discovered an area that was rich with palms, gave it the name Palmares, and started their own African community there. Thus, the origins of Capoeira began here, where different African tribes came together to share and discover each others rituals. Along with these rituals, martial arts, dance and games, were also introduced, thus, resulting in the creation of Capoeira.

Soon, Capoeira became a way of rebellion, a symbol of freedom, and a trademark of the slave movement in Brazil. Another influence on the history of Capoeira came when Holland attacked Brazil, to take it over from the Portuguese, the Africans further weakened the Portuguese by employing Capoeira against them, which involved surprising and ambushing their opponents with fast movements. These tactics have formed the basis of Capoeira. In essence, Capoeira was a martial art, but the music and dance had been introduced into it to make it appear less violent. The African communities began to impart the knowledge and techniques among their members. This lethal form of attack finally led to the abolition of slavery in the year 1888 in Brazil.

Capoeira soon became a way of life for several Africans in Brazil, even though slavery had been abolished. Capoeristas, or people who performed this art, found jobs as bodyguards, and it became a helpful tool in strengthening the police services, and in other security services. Even so, people remained wary of this art form, and continued to believe it to be a persistent political threat to the country. This led to the establishment of a law to eliminate all Capoeristas from the country. However, this law was met with strong opposition, and finally the ban on Capoeristas was lifted, when Brazil was at war with Paraguay, which was won only due to the efficiency of the army, predominantly comprising blacks, trained in this art form..."

Apparently whole police forces and politicians were tricked into making alliances with, negotiating with, and combatting capoeiristas when all they had to do is listen to opinions like Twin Fist's and they'd speedily realize that they were facing nothing more than insubstantial inconsequential silly tricks.Apparently whole countries have been tricked to death by capoeristas during times of war. Apparently whole armies have been tricked to death by it in failing to enforce slavery for perpetuity. Apparently the country of Brazil was terrified that it too might be tricked into nonexistence if it allowed capoeira and capoeiristas to proliferate while attempting to abuse the Black,mixed race population, and poor classes there. Apparently, Holland and Brazil were each tricked to death and defeat when they clashed with and/or attempted to exploit via alliances of convenience capoeira guerreros. Apparently, the Brazilian army was ably supplemented by capoeiristas with skill enough to trick Paraguay into thinking that it lost a war. Apparently Anderson Silva can trick his way into the UFC Middleweight championship of the world.

http://www.amazon.com/Capoeira-Jogo-Angola-Luanda-Cyberspace/dp/1583941835

"Capoeira evolved as a Brazilian martial art developed initially by that country’s African slaves. Marked by deft, deceptive movements played on the ground or completely inverted, the form started gaining worldwide popularity in the early 20th century, when this second volume of Gerard Taylor’s wide-ranging history begins.

The book opens with a study of the capoeira “Bamba,” Mestre Bimba, who became renowned as a fighting champion in Bahia and opened the first legal academy during the dictatorship of Getulio Vargas..."

Capoeira tricked a dictator that came to power knowing of the successes of capoeira in war. If only Getulio Vargas--by all accounts a hard, sometimes cruel, but very shrewd man--knew he was being tricked! He'd've been more successful.

http://www.amazon.com/Capoeira-Jogo-Angola-Luanda-Cyberspace/dp/1556436017

"...The first in a two-volume series on capoeira, Volume One traces the origins of the popular martial art and dance form from the beginning of the slave trade in the Americas in the 1500s to the early years of the Brazilian Republic in the 20th century. Focusing on the people and events that shaped the art form in Brazil prior to the "academy" period of the last century, Capoeira: The Jogo de Angola from Luanda to Cyberspace explores the subject from many vantage points. Author Gerard Taylor explains how the fighting techniques of African forces laid the groundwork for capoeira movements. He shows how work songs, religion, and various percussive traditions and instruments shaped capoeira music over the years. Drawing on archival sources and historical accounts, the book paints a vivid picture of capoeira’s dramatic evolution from the sugar plantations of Pernambuco through the brutal backstreets of Rio and the Minas Gerais goldmines on its way to becoming a world-class practice..."

http://www.amazon.com/Learning-Capoeira-Lessons-Cunning-Afro-Brazilian/dp/0195176979


"...Learning Capoeira: Lessons in Cunning from an Afro-Brazilian Art is a provocative look at capoeira, a demanding acrobatic art that combines dance, ritual, music, and fighting style. First created by slaves, freemen, and gang members, capoeira is a study in contrasts that integrates African-descended rhythms and flowing dance steps with hard lessons from the street. According to veteran teachers, capoeira will transform novices, instilling in them a sense of malicia, or “cunning,” and changing how they walk, hear, and interact.Learning Capoeira is an ethnographic study based on author Greg Downey’s extensive research about capoeira and more than ten years of apprenticeship. It looks at lessons from traditional capoeira teachers in Salvador, Brazil, capturing the spoken and unspoken ways in which they pass on the art to future generations. Downey explores how bodily training can affect players’ perceptions and social interactions, both within the circular roda, the “ring” where the game takes place, as well as outside it, in their daily lives. He brings together an experience-centered, phenomenological analysis of the art with recent discoveries in psychology and the neurosciences about the effects of physical education on perception..."


Oh no! Capoeira is tricking droves of highly intellegent, well learned scholars who've minutely studied its background! Oh no say it ain't so, Joe!

Waitaminnit you mean slavers have been noting that capoeira has been around tricking them into letting Africans free by thinking that Africans were beating them up killing them escaping and burning down plantations freeing enslaved workers at goldmines from over 600 years ago to now? That's a whole lotta tricking going on. I bet that the people who were tricked wished they had a Twin Fist around them to let them know that they weren't really getting beat up killed outsmarted outfought and outmanuevered, they were merely being tricked. Just don't believe the trick and you'll be alive not outsmarted you won the fight you weren't outmanuevered you won the war. Don't believe the trick and you're fine.

To be crystal clear? I provide this information as a means of informing most of the martial arts world which has almost no idea of the actual history and efficacy of capoeira. I am not looking to engage or seeking to sway persuade or argue with Twin Fist regarding this matter. One of the senior capoeiristas on this site informed me that it's his opinion that the elder masters of capoeira wouldn't want the knowledge of its devastating effectiveness to become public knowledge, and I agreed. During the time of the Elder Mestres of Capoeira, capoeiristas were literally fighting to survive a brutal enslaving oppressing regime.

Many of us know of the illustrious histories of our choses Oriental and Occidental martial arts and have become better human beings for it. We have dedicated significant portions of our lives to it. We should also know something similar of capoeira; we should know that it is literally and without a doubt the most documented martial art delivery the oppressed from the oppressors, the enslaved from the enslavers, and bringing joy love and spirituality to all people of all races creeds nationalities genders age groups and more. Or else we can find ourselves at the mercy of people who know nothing but think that they do. We may find ourselves denied of a truly magnificent and perhaps life altering experience and joy. We may find that if we listen to the naysayers and the ignorant and believe their inanity, if we buy their snake oil, if we credit their untruths? We will certainly discover that we have been lied to and that we have been...tricked. And we never had the chance to experience the truth of capoeira.

 

[Josh Oakley]

Pro tip: you would be better off focusing on the technical aspects of the capoeira videos you posted, and saving the history for a thread on the history of capoeira.

Reasoning: whether it worked in the past or not, what matters is whether and HOW it can be used to fight.

The history is fascinating, and a worthy topic. But in the context of this thread, it is actually a non-sequitor. "YOU can fight with it". Well, none of us have ever been slaves, none of us have fought in a rebellion, and most of us don't live in and have never been to Brazil.

In the context of this thread, it is the employment of the historicists fallacy.

So far you have had two people critique your videos as having a basic problem of each move being essential to the success of the next move. And since you have been in a fight or two, you know that it IS a problem.

I am no expert capoeirista, but one thing I learned in the roda is that being able to switch gears and and abandon a plan is essential. In addition, to stack assaults in a way that the opponent has a very slim chance of success against you no matter WHAT he tries is a fundamental aspect of capoiera.

Capoeira is deception. True. But it is not JUST deception. It is not meant merely to DECEIVE the opponent, but to overwhelm them as well. And you COULD be making these arguments and getting into the technical descriptions of WHY the techniques you posted would work.

But instead, you talk about Capoeira history.

And trust me, I am fascinated by capoiera history. But it won't help you win over anyone. It won't help you establish the central point that YOU CAN FIGHT WITH CAPOEIRA... at least not convincingly.

But you COULD. If you focus on the technical aspects. And frankly, you are going to have to give some ground on this topic. Any combination that absolutely requires the success if each preceding attack to be able to pull off each subsequent attack is DEEPLY flawed, both from the standpoint of Self Defense in general, and capoeira in specific.

Capoeira has no specific combination cannon, though there are mestres that will have a fondness for certain combs. And this is because capoeira is fluid in its approach.

Your combos have a lot of good going for them. But they CAN be better. And I know you can take a straightforward, reasoned critique, because you have done so before.

Now as far as the videos themselves, you need more camera angles, and you need to show the move at full speed, or as close enough to full speed for the viewer to get the idea of the move. And show in a little bit more detail what you can do with the combo, how you can modify it, at each point where the technique could fail. And the reason to do this is: that's in capoeira as well!

Hell, you could probably win over even a guy like Twin Fist if you show how a capoeirista deals with getting his arm kicked out from under him when attempting a handstand kick. And as a bonus, showing that kick full speed can demonstrate just how little time there is to actually attempt such a thing in the first place.

Seriously, if you focus on THOSE aspects, you will be more effective in your delivery.

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