am i over looking judo for real self defence?

[Dirty Dog]

Which Katas in TKD are you thinking of, and why was that a reason for you to leave the art?

Ummm... all of them? There are grappling techniques in every tul. It's not uncommon for new students to be unaware of these techniques, but they are certainly there.

 

[elder999]

It's not whether a style has the throwing art or not. It's whether or not that style treats "throwing art" seriously as part of their daily training..

In all seriousness, the rest of your post proves that it's not the style, or whether the style treats throwing seriously, but how seriously the individual practitioner treats throwing.....

I was lucky enough to be doing judo and boxing for most of that time, and wrestling for part of it.....

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

In all seriousness, the rest of your post proves that it's not the style, or whether the style treats throwing seriously, but how seriously the individual practitioner treats throwing.....

I was lucky enough to be doing judo and boxing for most of that time, and wrestling for part of it.....

Agree!

Here is a good example that a WC instructor treats throwing art seriously. He even talks like a Chinese wrestler, "If you go this direction and you 'don't have', you go to the opposite direction". In the grappling art, "don't have" means that your opponent's resistance is so strong to make your move fail. If you apply a different move in the opposite direction, you can borrow his resistance and make your throw "effortless". A pure "striker" just won't be able to say that.

 

[jks9199]

Oh Yeah it's not hard lifting a guy at 220lb or more. Not hard at all.

If you know the technique, and use the proper leverage, it's not hard at all. Then, of course, there are some around who are just plain strong enough to do it by brute force. I was working with a student a couple of weeks back, he got into a position and was trying to take me down, and I just dropped my hips and basically squatted him, then walked across the room.

 

[jks9199]

If they teach the kata, they teach the throws.

Apparently, you weren't listening to what he told you.

Or, perhaps, the answer to our friend Laplace-demon was different from the answer another student might have received. Students often receive the answer they merit...

 

[drop bear]

I can try and strike him? LOl, it's quite a big target for me to miss if I want to strike before a clinch/grappling. That's probably what a striker should, but doesn't do in the match ups I've seen. They think their superior physique against ordinarily built JJ guys will prevail even in the clinch, so there is no urgency on their part. I know better and would act far more aggressively.

is this gi or no gi?

 

[Dirty Dog]

Or, perhaps, the answer to our friend Laplace-demon was different from the answer another student might have received. Students often receive the answer they merit...

There is a lot of truth to this statement. I certainly don't expect a yellow belt to have the same level of understanding of the forms as a black belt.

 

[drop bear]

To a grappler, the closer the distance, the safer it can be. If a grappler uses his "rhino guard" to move in, it will be very difficult for his striker opponent to punch him.

that does sound better than big fist by the way.

 

[Buka]

As for throwing people and having them land on their head, this is me. Fortunately, I have experience breaking fall with my......face.
If a skilled person has tight throws, they'll pretty much plant you anyway they want.

 

[drop bear]

That's not what he said. He claimed the thrown guy will land on his head if it's successful, as if the technique would have anything to do with the guys landing.

I train Taekwon-Do myself.

it will best case.

but even put on their back can finish a fight.

 

[elder999]

Or, perhaps, the answer to our friend Laplace-demon was different from the answer another student might have received. Students often receive the answer they merit...

As I said, then......

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

If you know the technique, and use the proper leverage, it's not hard at all. Then, of course, there are some around who are just plain strong enough to do it by brute force. I was working with a student a couple of weeks back, he got into a position and was trying to take me down, and I just dropped my hips and basically squatted him, then walked across the room.

Agree!

The correct way to use your "body structure" is the key. It's not about arm muscle or brute force. My friend can lift his 300 lb student like this. This is a very unusual throw "块抱别(Kuai Bao Bie) - knee lift, leg block throw", you

- use your knee to lift your opponent up under his hip,
- swing him behind your back, and
- throw him forward above your leg.

If you try this move with your training partner, you will find out soon that your arm muscle and your brute force won't be able to help much in this situation.

 

[Laplace_demon]

is this gi or no gi?

No gi

 

[Laplace_demon]

To a grappler, the closer the distance, the safer it can be. If a grappler uses his "rhino guard" to move in, it will be very difficult for his striker opponent to punch him.

That's why boxing is limited but kickboxing isn't. The grappler must overcome hands and legs. I might use both!

 

[elder999]

That's why boxing is limited but kickboxing isn't. The grappler must overcome hands and legs. I might use both!

Yeah, but you've already said that you won't "grapple," though one has to wonder how a TKD guy is a kickboxer (who grapples from the clinch)....

 

[Laplace_demon]

Yeah, but you've already said that you won't "grapple," though one has to wonder how a TKD guy is a kickboxer (who grapples from the clinch)....

A grappler has to overcome this obstacle before grappling.

 

[elder999]

A grappler has to overcome this obstacle before grappling.

 

[Laplace_demon]

Bodyslam supporters in here, if it's so easy to pull off why not "lift" BJJ guys up in the air and dump them on their head. BJJ training starts at knee level (they rarely train takedowns). Should be an easy win for Judo vs BJJ. Yet BJJ is all we here about, and not Judo.

 

[ballen0351]

Bodyslam supporters in here, if it's so easy to pull off why not "lift" BJJ guys up in the air and dump them on their head.

Its been done

BJJ training starts at knee level (they rarely train takedowns).

Making more sweeping generalizations.

Should be an easy win for Judo vs BJJ. Yet BJJ is all we here about, and not Judo.

Bjj is all you ever hear about where? Last I checked Judo was an Olympic sport and had world wide exposure. Also one of the most popular fighters in MMA right now is Ronda Rousey who is famous for her Judo and shes not even the best Female Judo player.

 

[Laplace_demon]

Its an accurate generalization. BJJ training starts at knee level for most of the training. The current hierachy in Grappling goes BJJ/SW→Wrestling→Judo. Judo is not required for MMA.