all ma are sport

[Manny]

Reading Terry latest post I start thinking and I enden with this, what is yudo/judo? well as long as I know is the gentle art,Dr.Kano created judo from jujitsu if I recall trying to softhen the jujitsu and thus making judo more sport oriented, so judo could be trained for more people in sporting dojos withpout killing each other, the rest is history judo was the fisrt oriental ma to become a olimpic sport.
What about Karate, Mr.Funakoshi the creator of the sport karate did the same, he gave karate to the masses in a sporty way because before him the only karate fights we know were for honor in a battlefield,but sensei Funakoshi sportized the okinawan karate and invented the Shoto-Kan karate and this is the more practiced karate around the world with very big tournaments.

So we don't have to worry people telling us TKD is a sport and is worthless form SD side, let the people chat, we know our MA can be as efective as any other.

Manny

 

[Xue Sheng]

Read about the early days of Kano Jigoro and Judo and the training and proving (challenge matches) they did. I doubt many of us would survive it today

 

[JWLuiza]

I disagree with your premise. Not all MAs are sport. AFAIK, Koryu Uchinadi is not practiced for sport, nor does it train sport like drills for fighting. MMA is 100% sport oriented, yet has drastic SD benefits. Yes, TKD gets a bad rep as a only a "sport", but that stems from schools who do focus mostly/only on the sport aspects.

Also, I think your statement that TKD can be just as effective as other martial arts misses the point. Each martial art (and the influence of the training methods employed) has its own set of scenarios/skills that it will be effective in neutralizing. While TKD may be effective in SD situations, other martial arts may be more effective or provide effectiveness sooner in a students learning because they may practice a SD mindset more frequently and more intensely than a MA that has a heavy sports focus.

 

[Manny]

I disagree with your premise. Not all MAs are sport. AFAIK, Koryu Uchinadi is not practiced for sport, nor does it train sport like drills for fighting. MMA is 100% sport oriented, yet has drastic SD benefits. Yes, TKD gets a bad rep as a only a "sport", but that stems from schools who do focus mostly/only on the sport aspects.

Also, I think your statement that TKD can be just as effective as other martial arts misses the point. Each martial art (and the influence of the training methods employed) has its own set of scenarios/skills that it will be effective in neutralizing. While TKD may be effective in SD situations, other martial arts may be more effective or provide effectiveness sooner in a students learning because they may practice a SD mindset more frequently and more intensely than a MA that has a heavy sports focus.

Thank you for sharing. For me TKD can be as efective as other MA in SD esenarios, karate can be efective, aikido can be efective,judo can be efective, any MA is better than NO MA, that's what I am talking about it.

Manny

 

[Xue Sheng]

While TKD may be effective in SD situations, other martial arts may be more effective or provide effectiveness sooner in a students learning because they may practice a SD mindset more frequently and more intensely than a MA that has a heavy sports focus.

As did TKD prior to becoming an Olympic sport

 

[JWLuiza]

and some still do, that's why I used the word "may"

 

[granfire]

Well, unless one has a job that brings them in contact with dangerous individuals (or groups) or is outright stupid, the majority of us will never use MA in ernest (and I try to live to be 100 proving this point! )

The question is, how do you train for combat without killing all your troops? I suppose you have to get close enough to the kill, hoping that adrenalin lets you finish the job.

What is the running joke: Judo is Jujitzu you do with friends?

I t is somewhat of an eternal problem.

Then again, there are the clear deviation from Martial Arts that really only a person with blinders on can mistake for anything but sport...(then, even the UFC is not 'combat'. Rolling around on the floor hitting each other in the head is not effective...but you just can't rip another competitior's throat out...or separate him from his eyeballs..)

 

[dianhsuhe]

Manny- Are you contending that all martial arts are sports?

If so, I would have to disagree. Aikido, Aikijutsu and Iaido come to mind as arts that are nowhere near being a sport. Kara-Ho Kempo was also designed with this in mind. "Kara-Ho is to defend yourself in the street FIRST, everything else is second!" (Professor Chow)

Keep in mind the mandate comes not from the style/ system, it comes from the teacher/ practicioner. Your own TKD is a great example. It is famous for being a sport since it is a part of the Olympics, but there are TKD folks who train for absolute street war.

I think both are beneficial but have chosen non-sport as a personal preference.

Take care Manny!

 

[Xue Sheng]

Manny- Are you contending that all martial arts are sports?

If so, I would have to disagree. Aikido, Aikijutsu and Iaido come to mind as arts that are nowhere near being a sport. Kara-Ho Kempo was also designed with this in mind. "Kara-Ho is to defend yourself in the street FIRST, everything else is second!" (Professor Chow)

Keep in mind the mandate comes not from the style/ system, it comes from the teacher/ practicioner. Your own TKD is a great example. It is famous for being a sport since it is a part of the Olympics, but there are TKD folks who train for absolute street war.

I think both are beneficial but have chosen non-sport as a personal preference.

Take care Manny!

Neither are most of these

 

[Steve]

I'm not sure that the history of Judo is as you believe. While Kano had intended to simplify jujutsu techniques, I think it was to make it more effective, not softer.

 

[Dave Leverich]

My understanding of it was that so he could do all techniques with intent, without crippling the opponent. IE. Alive style training.

 

[Twin Fist]

MY martial Art isnt a sport manny

maybe yours is, mine isnt

I have to severly dumb mine down to make it usable in tourny's

 

[granfire]

MY martial Art isnt a sport manny

maybe yours is, mine isnt

I have to severly dumb mine down to make it usable in tourny's

Not sure if I should roll my eyes or on the floor, laughing my butt off.

How many people have you killed? I know, the day isn't over yet...

 

[JWLuiza]

Not sure if I should roll my eyes or on the floor, laughing my butt off.

How many people have you killed? I know, the day isn't over yet...

I do know martial arts and MAs that have to "Dumb" down to compete. They only train to incapacitate. They don't claim to do anything special, they just train to kick knees, gouge eyes, and otherwise effectively incapacitate their opponent.

Not my school, but definitely some Bando schools I've seen, and probably others.

 

[granfire]

I do know martial arts and MAs that have to "Dumb" down to compete. They only train to incapacitate. They don't claim to do anything special, they just train to kick knees, gouge eyes, and otherwise effectively incapacitate their opponent.

Not my school, but definitely some Bando schools I've seen, and probably others.

There are stranger things under the sun, no doubt it happens. It's just that Twin Fist's utter humbleness stuck my funny bone!

 

[Manny]

MY martial Art isnt a sport manny

maybe yours is, mine isnt

I have to severly dumb mine down to make it usable in tourny's

My TKD is not sport either, my TKD is for self defense, I am not a competitor, so I try to focus in the MA and SD of TKD. When I was a teen I took TKD classes to learn how to defend myself not to be a sport fighter.

Today the only way I am into sport TKD is as a center or corner referee, and yes even the WTF TKD (all kicking) can be very useful in the streets, however I'am not a fool and know that those flashy jumping high kicks can kill you in street.

Manny

 

[Manny]

Am I buliding the perfect killing machine? or Am I the perfect weapon? NO. The fact is I am not preparing myself to go out the streets and beat a bunch of guys just to see if I am the ultimate warrior. I train in MA cause I love them and to know how to defend myself if need it or have to.

It's true that inside dojo/dojang all is in certain degree under control and the enviroment is friendly and the streets are ugly, no rules, but as I said before, MA is better than NO MA.

I remeber when I did practical shooting with my handguns, I shoot to paper targets (humanoid) under certain degree of stress with timers,range officers and with a set of rules and this is not the streets but I had (and have) the confidence that if I need to use a firearm to defend myself I can do it with sucess cause I am trained in firearams, in the other hand my brother for example who is not up to guns even with one in his hands will be killed easily in the streets.

Manny

 

[Twin Fist]

There are stranger things under the sun, no doubt it happens. It's just that Twin Fist's utter humbleness stuck my funny bone!

i dont care what you think gran, i dont care if you roll your eyes or laugh, or crap your pants, i dont care.

every technique i teach has a throat shot in it, that is NOT a sport


My motto in my school is "dont stop till they drop"

that isnt a sport

my martial art isnt a sport, and has to be dumbed down to be used ina tourny.

 

[Chris Parker]

And, just to add to your growing list, Ninjutsu (and related) have no sporting aspect whatsoever, nor do Koryu systems, Kyudo, although a form of archery, is not a sport, and so on...

Honestly, in my definition, a martial art is not a sport. And a sport is not a martial art. They actually cancel each other out. But that could just be me...

 

[Gorilla]

The effectiveness of a Martial Artist is based on the skill and ability of the individual Martial Artist. No system be it SD or Sport will beat big strong, quick, athletic and skilled.

This is even more true in the so called "streets". Unless you are Bruce Lee. Bigger, stronger, faster wins more times than not! The superior athlete wins most of the time! If they have the nerve to fight.