A Sword Art just for me...Iaido?

[Charles Mahan]

Well what you're after just strikes me as odd. I'm a rather simple individual. I wanted to learn Japanese Swordsmanship and lucked out. There was a fantastic instructor who just happened to live in my suburb of a suburb of a suburb of Dallas. If I had wanted to learn meditation, I would have joined the local zen meditation group. If I just wanted to whack stuff with sticks and get a great cardio vascular work out, I coulda joined the local SCA or Amtgard chapter. If I'd wanted swordsmanship with a competitve edge, I'd have joined Kendo. I'm not really interested in making up my own stuff, so if I wanna do something I do it. I don't understand why people insist on making up there own stuff, which is what you are doing, and I'm genuinely curious about what makes people do it when there are usually other options to be had. That's why I was asking. It's not that what you do bothers me really. I don't really care what you do, where you do it, or who you do it with, but I was curious about why you would do what you were talking about.

 

[KenpoEMT]

Well what you're after just strikes me as odd. I'm a rather simple individual.

Okay, I understand this.

...I'm not really interested in making up my own stuff, so if I wanna do something I do it. I don't understand why people insist on making up there own stuff, which is what you are doing,...

Not at all. I'll pick up a good Iaido video and work with a bokken. I am not making anything up.

In meditation classes you don't find the practice of obtaining a form of serenity and then acting violently with an extension of your body. In Iaido you do find this. It interests me. I honestly could not figure out why that bothered you.

and I'm genuinely curious about what makes people do it when there are usually other options to be had. That's why I was asking. It's not that what you do bothers me really. I don't really care what you do, where you do it, or who you do it with, but I was curious about why you would do what you were talking about.

I must have read some animosity into your posts when that wasn't what you intended to communicate.
I am a Kenpoist. I have no problem reaching out and trying to absorb something that may be useful. Iaido is something that I am interested in. At this time I do not have the ability to commute back and forth to OKC; although, a visit to the JSA studio there would be beneficial.

 

[Charles Mahan]

Then why not do it for real? Why play at it? You have access to top notch instruction. How far is it to OKC that commuting is a big problem?

 

[KenpoEMT]

How far is it to OKC that commuting is a big problem?

I'm taking 20 credits this semester in addition to clinicals. Honestly, I don't have the ability to commute to OKC at this time.

 

[arnisador]

If you're happy, enjoy! We all have different goals in studying--all the more so for an art that no longer is of practical import.

Two schools here in Albuquerque teach iaido, and I hope to check them out soon. I have no idea how I'll choose between the styles if the instructors are equally impressive!

 

[Basicman]

I too have the same problem, but even compounded. There nearest anything is 5 hours away from where I live, in the middle of rural Nebraska. Sorry, but I am not going to drive and pay a ton of money just for maybe a few hours of instruction each month. I have taken Korean Sword before. I have no intentions of ever fighting a live opponent. And if I did, I would find it fun to see if what I invented worked. Other than that, sword dueling is not going to come in handy in real life because let's face it, no one walks around anymore challenging each other for a duel. That is my humble opiuon. No insult to anyone who has the time money and motivation and access to instruction to dedicate themselves to the study of their art.

Take care,
John

 

[KenpoEMT]

I have taken Korean Sword before. I have no intentions of ever fighting a live opponent.

Was Shim Soo Do the Korean art that you were studying? I thought Shim Soo Do was interesting. I was surprised to learn that the weapon that is used is very similar to a modern movie sword, the 'ninja-to'.

Other than that, sword dueling is not going to come in handy in real life because let's face it, no one walks around anymore challenging each other for a duel. That is my humble opiuon. No insult to anyone who has the time money and motivation and access to instruction to dedicate themselves to the study of their art.

That's the primary reason that I am not to concerned with ingraining bad habits through media instruction. Anyone who attacks me with a sword is probably a psycho that will spend the rest of his/her life in prison. ...and I doubt that I will have a sword handy in order to defend my self. Guess I'll have to look into the ancient way of defense against lunatic swordsmen: 'Office Chair Do'.

 

[arnisador]

I've heard it said that in the seitei iaido techniques, changes were made to techniques that made them less functional but more aestheticly pleasing. I don't know if this is true!

 

[Swordlady]

Originally Posted by Basicman:
Other than that, sword dueling is not going to come in handy in real life because let's face it, no one walks around anymore challenging each other for a duel. That is my humble opiuon. No insult to anyone who has the time money and motivation and access to instruction to dedicate themselves to the study of their art.

But that's not the point of taking a sword art. People study a sword art for different reasons - none of them with the intent of "real life" dueling (I hope). I study Yagyu Shinkage Ryu, not only because I'm interested in learning Japanese swordsmanship, but also for the self-discipline. It's also interesting to study a fighting system that has been in existence for over 400 years.

If you want to learn *real* swordsmanship, then go to a *real* school. If you are just trying to learn from a book or video, then you aren't studying swordsmanship. You're just playing with swords - and playing with fire if you're using a live blade.

 

[Basicman]

The sword art I studied was Haedong Gumdo. I respectfully disagree that unless you study a formalized sword art, you are "playing" with a sword. While the pictures from that gentleman's accident are terrible and he had a good outcome, IMO those types of accidents are in the minority. Look at how many blades are sold in the US and probably the percentage injured is very small. I am a Paramedic, believe me, if the number of mortal wounds were high with swords, it would be reported in our trade journals. And it isn't. I am not saying that swords are toys, I feel they need the same respect as any weapon. But there is nothing magical or mystical about a sword. I enjoy the workout I get from using a sword.

I undertsand there are many reasons for studying the traditional arts or the through a traditional school, but I feel it is not the only way. A journey has many roads to its conclusion.

 

[Charles Mahan]

I've heard it said that in the seitei iaido techniques, changes were made to techniques that made them less functional but more aestheticly pleasing. I don't know if this is true!

Ok, Take this with a grain of salt. I'm not a kendo guy, nor do I play one on TV.

The Seitei waza were originally drawn from several different koryu sword styles. As a result the original waza chosen, when lumped together, were disjointed and seperate from each other. These waza were modified slightly here and there, not for aesthetic reasons, but to accomplish a number of goals. The first was to tie the various waza together so that they seem more integrated. That doesn't mean that combat effective principles were lost necessarily, but they were changed out in favor of others. This also served to seperate them from their parent koryu so that the kendo renmei would not be seen as trying to teach koryu principles outside the auspices of the original ryu-ha. So the net i that they are stilll reasonably thought out and effective if performed well, but somewhat different from the original waza in places.

Perhaps a kendo exponent will come along and expand on what i'm saying, but that's what i've gathered from a few years of forum hopping and speaking with various JSA folks in and out of the Kendo renmei.

 

[Makalakumu]

This has been a very interesting thread. I am glad to see that so many people favor proper education when handling a deadly weapon. I wonder if everyone feels the same about firearms?

I'm starting a thread about this in the firearm forum.

Firearm Education

 

[arnisador]

Thanks Mr. Mahan. That makes sense!

 

[pgsmith]

I respectfully disagree that unless you study a formalized sword art, you are "playing" with a sword.

Personally, I don't see how you could possibly disagree with that statement. If you are making up your own stuff, and using your sword for a workout, you are not studying swordsmanship. The techniques and teaching methods of the Japanese sword were created back in a time when the sword was actually used. If you aren't doing these techniques or learning in the proscribed teaching methodology, you have no idea whether what you are doing is real or crap. Since you are just guessing at what is essentially a life or death art, you aren't truly practicing, you're just playing. Don't get me wrong. I don't think there's anything wrong with that as long as you're careful. Swords are fun, and not everyone wishes to dedicate themselves as much as necessary in order to properly learn. That's cool, and I understand it. I just object to people trying to delude themselves into thinking they truly are "training" in sword arts just because it sounds more macho than playing.

While the pictures from that gentleman's accident are terrible and he had a good outcome, IMO those types of accidents are in the minority. Look at how many blades are sold in the US and probably the percentage injured is very small. I am a Paramedic, believe me, if the number of mortal wounds were high with swords, it would be reported in our trade journals. And it isn't. I am not saying that swords are toys, I feel they need the same respect as any weapon. But there is nothing magical or mystical about a sword. I enjoy the workout I get from using a sword.

Yes, the injuries are in the minority. However, they can be terrible. We don't have a high profile lobby like the NRA to object if politicians decide to use swords as a rallying point to garner votes. If more people start getting hurt or killed with swords, and they tell the media that they "train" in Japanese swordsmanship, then the media will make no distinction between proper training and people playing. If swords get banned, how can those of us in legitimate dojo make a case for allowing us our swords for training when it's considered exactly the same as every Joe and Bob playing with their sword in their own backyard? That's one of the problems facing some in Australia at the moment. That's why you'll always find those that train under a qualified instructor object when people try and say they are teaching themselves iaido.

Paul Smith

 

[Swordlady]

While the pictures from that gentleman's accident are terrible and he had a good outcome, IMO those types of accidents are in the minority. Look at how many blades are sold in the US and probably the percentage injured is very small.

Although those injuries may be in the minority (at least compared to the number of firearm accidents), many of those injuries could have been avoided with proper training. Same with many firearm injuries. Swords and firearms are not playthings. They were created with the intent of maiming or killing another human being, and should be treated with the utmost respect.

 

[KenpoEMT]

I don't think that anyone here believes that a sharped sword is a plaything.

 

[arnisador]

I'm fine with a dull blade. I have no desire to actually cut anything--there's just something Jungian (or, I'm sure some would say, Freudian) about a sword.

 

[pgsmith]

... there's just something Jungian (or, I'm sure some would say, Freudian) about a sword.

That's the truth! Hmmmm ... both schools I practice require longer than normal swords.

 

[arnisador]

Compensation!

 

[pgsmith]

Compensation!

Bwahahahahahahahaha ... wait .... that's not funny!


But I've been told that I swing my sword really well! Ok, I'm lying. I just got bitched out this last weekend for being too tense!