most useless

Discussion in 'Tae-Kwon-Do' started by tshadowchaser, Jul 24, 2008.

  1. ralphmcpherson

    ralphmcpherson Senior Master

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    I dont think anything I've learnt is "useless", but I am a believer that there are only so many hours in the day and you are better off spending one solid hour doing two hundred front kicks then spending that hour trying over and over again to perfect a jump spinning hook kick, for example.
     
  2. Balrog

    Balrog Master of Arts

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    Jumping kicks of any kind. They're good for challenging yourself in terms of discipline, etc., but totally worthless for self-defense.
     
  3. Dobbelsteen

    Dobbelsteen White Belt

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    If you are training just to learn how to defend yourself, i guess that would indeed be more effective. But if you enjoy doing more flashy kicks, might as well spend that hour learning that jumped spinning hook kick. If I would spend all my time perfecting just the basic moves I'd probably get bored after a while and find me a more fun sport to do.
     
  4. ralphmcpherson

    ralphmcpherson Senior Master

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    boxers must get really bored then.
     
  5. Dobbelsteen

    Dobbelsteen White Belt

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    Not saying everybody gets bored of it, but that is the reason I don't like boxing so much
     
  6. ralphmcpherson

    ralphmcpherson Senior Master

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    I suppose its each to their own. For me if Im training in a "martial art", then I dedicate 100% of my time to learning to defend myself, thus my original post. If I want to learn to jump around spinning etc I would just do gymnastics. If Martial arts was my full time job then I would probably muck around with some flashy stuff for a bit of fun, but Im self employed, married, two kids and have other hobbies and interests so the time I can invest into martial arts is limited so I tend to focus my time on things that are simple and effective and do them over and over again.
     
  7. Earl Weiss

    Earl Weiss Senior Master

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    About 30 years ago I met an Israeli and asked if he learned the "Martial Art" of Krav Maga in the army. This was long before it was mass marketed and repackaged fr consumers.

    I found his reply quite interesting; "What art? There is no art to kneeing someone in the nuts." Just sayin'.
     
  8. Kung Fu Wang

    Kung Fu Wang Grandmaster

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    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 24, 2014
  9. chrispillertkd

    chrispillertkd Senior Master

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    Yes.

    Pax,

    Chris
     
  10. punisher73

    punisher73 Senior Master

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    My instructor used to help out with store security years ago. He used that kick in that exact scenario, guy was wrestling around with a cop and trying to get his gun out of the holster and was not paying any other attention. Worked very well in that scenario.

    I think all kicks have a time and place.

    As far as the double front kick, that kick was just used by Lyoto Machida in the UFC to KO Randy Couture. Especially using the first as a set up to gain distance and get their attention elsewhere.

    For me, I am not good enough to do the more "exotic" kicks and stick to the low kicks to the legs etc.
     
  11. Kung Fu Wang

    Kung Fu Wang Grandmaster

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    A 45 degree downward flying side kick (aiming at your opponent's knee joint) is a good entering strategy. It will put your opponent in defense mode and that will be safe for you. Any kicks that aiming your opponent's knee joint are good kicks
     
  12. zDom

    zDom Senior Master

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    They are only useless for someone who hasn't trained them well enough to really use them and doesn't understand their art enough to know when to use them.
     
  13. zDom

    zDom Senior Master

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    Similar kick — done with straight leg instead of hooking it — was one several Old Timers in my organization recall seeing the late GM Lee H. Park train regularly — and as part of a combo. My instructor told me of how Park was seen doing the spinning heel kick at the ankle-height followed immediately by a jump spinning heel kick to the head (hitting a speed bag!) immediately into a spinning heel kick at the ankle — etc.

    Asked if he ever used that combination to defend himself, the answer was almost: the first kick (ankle high) hit the attacker so hard the attacker urinated on himself. The second kick was moot as the attacker had hit the ground after his feet were taken out from under him.

    Personally I would probably NEVER use the low spinning heel kick. I suck at it. It wasn't a required kick so I put my time into reps on kicks that were required.

    But a jump front kick? Sure. Maybe even as a first kick. Jump backside? Yep. Be easy to sucker someone into that. And, if I had already stunned someone and was looking for a powerful finish: a jump roundhouse would sure do the trick.

    I have a comfort with a confidence in all of these from decades of training and pressure testing in very hard contact sparring. YMMV.
     
  14. Daniel Sullivan

    Daniel Sullivan Grandmaster

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    I've heard that too. I don't believe it for even a hundredth of a second.
     
  15. zDom

    zDom Senior Master

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    I don't believe the "flying kicks are to dismount folks on horses" thing either.
     
  16. Dinkydoo

    Dinkydoo Purple Belt

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    Heard the same thing.

    I think a jump front kick is quite useful in avoiding a leg sweep because it offers an immediate counter as you evade. Obviously you don't need to jump as high as you would when training the kick!
     
  17. Jaeimseu

    Jaeimseu 3rd Black Belt

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    Yeah, that's an antiquated application of the technique. In modern Taekwondo it's used almost exclusively as a defense against biker gangs.

    Sent from my SHV-E210K using Tapatalk now Free
     
  18. andyjeffries

    andyjeffries Master of Arts

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    rotflmao!
     
  19. Koshiki

    Koshiki Brown Belt

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    As far as jumping kicks, well, as an opener, I think there is some merit to them, for those that can do them well and practice them in actual application. I prefer jumping knee strikes, because I like to be VERY close when sparring. If I can't elbow without moving my feet, I feel too far away! Are they a good go to/self-defense technique? I'd say probably not, at least not for the majority of us!

    One of the very few physical altercations I've has in my short life consisted of this, and nothing but this! It was a situation where, apparently the girl I was hanging out with on our local "celebrate how awesome our town is day", was the girlfriend of this guy with some angsty teenage possessiveness issues. Anyway, he came up to me, his buddies ringed around, and he proceeded to be all big n' scurry n' tuff. (Tricky to do, when your "second in command" is wearing plaid leggings and Hot Topic "combat boots"...) Anyway, it was a generally silly situation which scared the crap out of 15-16 year old me. While he was still posturing, I swept him. He fell hard, and I scampered back to the main street where the cops were. So, if you are ever encircled by angry 15 year olds who've probably never hit anything before, it may be a good option! Otherwise...

    Oooh. Another useless flashy kick story as effective self-defense. Around the same age, I was at a local rock event called "homegrown." I think attendance for the whole day must have been MAXIMUM 200 people... Anyway, my group of friends somehow really angered another group of teens. Throughout the day, they become more and more threatening. Finally, one of my friends noticed that a bunch of them had sort of "mustered" and were heading across the field to where we were, looking kinda angry. He told me to do "fancy Karate stuff." I did a bunch of jump-spinning kicks in series, and tried to look super-cool about it. It worked, the scary guys stopped and turned around. Although we did end up having to book it for our car later that evening anyway...

    So yeah, perhaps flashy kicks have some good uses as fight deterrents, when your would be aggressors are easily intimidated teenagers who are more interested in posturing than actually hitting you. Outside of that, I like my elbows, palms, and low kicks, thank you very much!
     
  20. Earl Weiss

    Earl Weiss Senior Master

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    Jumping kick useless?





    123
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 24, 2014

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