your style

[hamster_kicks]

I picked kenpo because i was always getting pushed around by people and getting made fun of because i couldnt do anything to counter attack, and i come from a sexist family and they are always calling me weak and that i couldnt take on anyone. I aslo started wushu because i saw this video of these tricks and it looked unnatural almost superhuman way cool, also because my friend told me about and then my cuz got into it.

 

[lucifersdad]

i think most people (myself included) start training and keep training in an art for completely differant reasons,
i started wado ryu karate because i saw a demo and thought it looked good, i kept training because i relised the jump spinning kicks i saw in the demo arnt part of the wado syllabus because i was taught other new and interesting ways to break people! and no style is perfect and has all the answers thats why we all use the 2 magic words "cross training",

dont you agree?

 

[Disco]

Please forgive my ignorance on the modern state of the Martial Arts. I'm from the dark ages of the early 60's. I was of the assumption that there were only 2 original styles of karate from Okinawa (Shuri-te and Naha-te) and 3 ryu's (Goju, Shorin and Isshin). Where and when did all these other named styles come from. I have never heard of many of them. Did they originate after WWII when the rest of the world received general knowledge of karate or are they offshoots created by the general explosion of the arts during the 70's? I figured if anybody could answer these questions it would be you. Thanks in advance for any information you can forward.:asian:

 

[RyuShiKan]

Originally posted by lucifersdad
i think most people (myself included) start training and keep training in an art for completely differant reasons,
i started wado ryu karate because i saw a demo and thought it looked good, i kept training because i relised the jump spinning kicks i saw in the demo arnt part of the wado syllabus because i was taught other new and interesting ways to break people! and no style is perfect and has all the answers thats why we all use the 2 magic words "cross training",

dont you agree?

Actually I do not.
I think all styles are either practiced/taught correctly or have gotten screwed up along the way by some person(s).
I think there are no imperfect styles only imperfect practitioners of that style.
This was posted by myself on the thread below.
http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=111019#post111019

I trained in other arts not to become ranked in them but to try and understand how to use my art (Karate) against them.
It was interesting as well as helpful.
I recommend exposing yourself to other arts not necessarily to master them but to prepare yourself against them.

“Know yourself and your enemy and in 100 battles you will be victorious”

Most arts have enough techniques to do a good job of defending yourself it’s just some arts don’t always practice the way they were originally done.
Aikido for example has strikes and yet I have only seen one dojo actually practice them.
Karate has grappling type techniques but hardly anybody in the West knew/practiced them up until the mid 1980’s.

Originally posted by Disco
Please forgive my ignorance on the modern state of the Martial Arts. I'm from the dark ages of the early 60's. I was of the assumption that there were only 2 original styles of karate from Okinawa (Shuri-te and Naha-te) and 3 ryu's (Goju, Shorin and Isshin). Where and when did all these other named styles come from. I have never heard of many of them. Did they originate after WWII when the rest of the world received general knowledge of karate or are they offshoots created by the general explosion of the arts during the 70's? I figured if anybody could answer these questions it would be you. Thanks in advance for any information you can forward.:asian:

There are several schools of thought on this subject.

One school thinks that each kata was it’s own style. Choki Motobu and several others were firm believers in this idea and I have to admit I am too.

For example:
Passai, Kusanku, Niseishi etc were all their own styles.

Many years (100+ years) ago a teacher only knew one maybe two kata.

The second school of thought believes there were originally 3 schools.
Naha, Tomari, and Shuri.

I don’t think this is really accurate for several reasons.
It is known that most people only knew one or two kata and Nahate, Tomarite, and Shurite actually contain several kata belonging to each group which would mean that people from those areas knew more than one or more like 5~10 kata. This Nahate, Tomarite, and Shurite distinction also didn’t come about until about the early 1920’s.
It is my belief that Nahate, Tomarite, and Shurite were more than like politaclly motivated names rather than by the actually types of kata practiced there in.
People claim Nahata is more suited to people of a heavier build and Shurite for people of a lighter build.
To me that sounds ridiculous. Does that mean if I am a person of large build I have to go to Naha to learn Karate that will work for me or the opposite if I am a slight build?
Also since “real” techniques works on anyone regardless of size it shouldn’t matter.
The whole Nahate, Tomarite, and Shurite controversy reminds of the BBQ rivalries in the US where one state claims to have a more “superior” BBQ than the other.

(Side note: Naha and Shuri are so closed together you can’t tell when you have left one and entered the other. Years ago they were more distinctly separated but they were still no more than a mile or two from each other. Okinawa is only 67 miles long and 7 miles wide.)

People also make the erroneous claim that Uechi & Goju are Nahate karate but in fact they are not. They both came from China. Also of note is the Goju practiced/taught by Miyagi Chojun was not the same as practiced by Kiyoda Juhatsu and Higaonna Kanryo.

I have yet to hear of a style that doesn’t have at least one kata from two or more of the so-called Nahate, Tomarite, and Shurite lines.

 

[Tigertron]

Originally posted by Mya Ryu Jitsu
I developed my system due to it's effectiveness against BG's in real world situations.

Take care.

Originally posted by RyuShiKan
What did you develop it from???

Thus far you have yet to answer a single question about who you got your ranks in Pangainoon and "Shuri Te" from.

I'll ask again:

Schultz,

You never did answer my question about who you got your 8th dan from in Pangainoon.
Since it is such a high rank it could only have come from a higher ranked source which would lead us to someone in Okinawa.
I will make it a real simple question so there is no confusion.
Who did you test for 8th dan with?
Since Pangainoon now uses Okinawan Kobudo which system of Okianwan Kobudo do you use?
Also, do you know the name of Pangainoon in Chinese?

You still have yet to supply a list of those names of teachers that teach “Shuri-Te Ryu” down in Okinawa. Who are they?

You mentioned the kata of Pangainoon before.

What are the names of the kata in Pangainoon?

Check this out. Scroll up and look at the original posts. This is weird. Is Mya Ryu Jitsu and Zhao Dai Wei the same person?

 

[A.R.K.]

I would have to reinforce a couple of comments from RyuShiKan...

"People claim Nahata is more suited to people of a heavier build and Shurite for people of a lighter build.
To me that sounds ridiculous. Does that mean if I am a person of large build I have to go to Naha to learn Karate that will work for me or the opposite if I am a slight build?"

One of my first Instructors in Shurite was a fellow Deputy here. He is perhaps a couple of inches taller than me and 100 lbs heavier. I'll ballpark him at 6'2 and close to 300 lbs. And it's not tummy He is an excellent practitioner of Shuri.

People also make the erroneous claim that Uechi & Goju are Nahate karate but in fact they are not. They both came from China.

I did not know that Goju came from China but I am familar with Uechi and Kanbun did travel to the Central Fukien provinence to recieve training for a period of ten years I believe. In fact Uechi-ryu was not named thus until his death in the 40's as an honor and tribute to him by his son Kanie and senior students.

I have yet to hear of a style that doesn’t have at least one kata from two or more of the so-called Nahate, Tomarite, and Shurite lines.

Disco and I have discussed these similarities before and I agree. Slight differences perhaps but many general similarities.

:asian:

 

[A.R.K.]

Tigertron,

Is Mya Ryu Jitsu and Zhao Dai Wei the same person?

Of course we are The name was changed quite some time ago with the assistance of Arnistor in admin. And questions were put to rest quite some time ago as well.

Lets try to keep up shall we :rofl: Or did you have some point?

:asian:

 

[RyuShiKan]

Originally posted by Mya Ryu Jitsu

I did not know that Goju came from China but I am familar with Uechi and Kanbun did travel to the Central Fukien provinence to recieve training for a period of ten years I believe. In fact Uechi-ryu was not named thus until his death in the 40's as an honor and tribute to him by his son Kanie and senior students.

Higaonna Kanryo traveled to Fukien as well and studied under RuRuko (Chinese man's name) and came home with what is now called, by Miyagi Choju lineage folks as, Goju.

 

[RyuShiKan]

Originally posted by Mya Ryu Jitsu
Tigertron,



Of course we are The name was changed quite some time ago with the assistance of Arnistor in admin. And questions were put to rest quite some time ago as well.

Lets try to keep up shall we :rofl: Or did you have some point?

:asian:

Togerton is new, only 19 posts, so I don't think he was around at the time of the name change.

 

[Tigertron]

I was browsing the posts and noticed that the names in RSK's quote is Zhao Dai Wei, but the original post is Mya Ryu Jitsu. That was puzzling to me.

Anyway, do you have an 8th degree in Pangainoon? If so, there is question for you in the Chinese Art section. Someone was looking for info on this Pangainoon.

Originally posted by arnisador
...As to Pangainoon--good luck! I'd start with more Uechi-ryu sites and books. I think the Chinese art is lost and only reconstructed versions through Uechi practitioners is available, but I'm no expert.....

 

[moromoro]

i study eskrima because of family history, i have now been practising for 17years..... also i study for one reason to become a good fighter not to instruct to others.....

thanks

terry

 

[theletch1]

Why I started is not why I stayed. I started after watching my kids train and deciding that I was really enjoying what I saw going on in the adult class when the kids wanted to hang around the school after class and play with the rest of the young-uns. I stayed because I was impressed with the effectiveness of the art and I continue to stay because I am still impressed.

You still haven't explained the "racial affiliation" choice.

 

[moromoro]

what is Pangainoon?????????????????????????????????????????????????

 

[A.R.K.]

moromoro,

Pangainoon is a Chinese system from the Central Fukien providence. It incorporates the Dragon, Tiger and Crane techniques. Pangainoon means 'Half hard/Half soft'. It has many of the linear blocks, strikes and kicks normally associated with many other systems as well as circular [Wa uke] blocking technique. It has three kata [although Ryu believes the number is four]. Sanchin is the bread & butter kata so to speak. Kanbun Uechi often stated "To know Sanchin is to know karate". Sanchin Kata in the old system took ten years to master according to Kanbun.

What is today known as Uechi-ryu Karate Do comes from Pangainoon through Kanbun Uechi circa 1897. This was my first structured exposure to Karate.

:asian:

 

[moromoro]

thanks
have you serious karate practitioners also practice certain arts of kung fu to go to the roots of the system?????

 

[A.R.K.]

Yes, many do.

:asian:

 

[RyuShiKan]

Originally posted by Mya Ryu Jitsu
It has three kata [although Ryu believes the number is four].

No Ryu doesn’t “believe” there is four kata he “knows” it, as would you if your 8th dan in Pangainoon was a legit. You would think that someone with such a high rank would know something so basic about the style they claim to have legit rank in.

The Pangainoon kata are:

1. Sanchin
2. Seisan
3. Sanseryu
4. Suparinpe

Any one that doesn’t believe this can check several references……..the easiest would be to check Mark Bishop’s Book called Okinawan Karate Teachers, Style, and their Secret Techniques on page 42, last paragraph.

 

[A.R.K.]

My 8th is as legit as whatever you claim to have...

And ALL of my references as well as multiple websites list THREE kata for Pangainoon. Specifically Uechi ryu Karate Do by Matteson. If your book differs...so? Kanbun Uechi brought back three kata and only three and never made reference to any others. Which is one of the reasons Kanie felt the need to create five more. Since Kanbun studied for ten years and then received permission to teach in China he probably would have been aware of another kata. Anyway it's a mute point....Sanchin kata is the heart and soul kata of the system. This point is reinforced into every Pangainoon and Uechi practioner worldwide.

Since I know there are only three kata in Pangainoon based on information provided by Kanbun as well as other resources I did you the courtesy of stating that your opinion differed in a kind way. If you took it any other way...you are in error.

 

[RyuShiKan]

Originally posted by Mya Ryu Jitsu


My 8th is as legit as whatever you claim to have...

Yeah right……..:rofl:
We have been down this road before…..or have you forgotten.
How many pages on this BBs did we have to go through before you answered from whom and from which organization you got your 8th dan :rofl: …….oh wait…..you still haven’t answered that one have you………
I find it very odd that you claim rank in an Okinawan style and to date have yet to be graded by anyone/organization in Okinawa and yet you claim a higher rank than most of the people that would be grading you. I would love for you to go to the Pangainoon Honbu in Okinawa and claim an 8th dan in their style and see what they say.

Originally posted by Mya Ryu Jitsu
And ALL of my references as well as multiple websites list THREE kata for Pangainoon. Specifically Uechi ryu Karate Do by Matteson. If your book differs...so? Kanbun Uechi brought back three kata and only three and never made reference to any others. Which is one of the reasons Kanie felt the need to create five more. Since Kanbun studied for ten years and then received permission to teach in China he probably would have been aware of another kata. Anyway it's a mute point....Sanchin kata is the heart and soul kata of the system. This point is reinforced into every Pangainoon and Uechi practioner worldwide.

Since I know there are only three kata in Pangainoon based on information provided by Kanbun as well as other resources I did you the courtesy of stating that your opinion differed in a kind way. If you took it any other way...you are in error.

As stated many times previously.
Uechi Kanbun didn’t have time to learn the 4th kata from his teacher Shi Shu Wa.

 

[A.R.K.]

Whatever

Sounds like someone pee'd in your wheaties so your looking to rehash old issues.

I have an 8th Dan in Pangainoon. It was awarded by by Sensei in Pangainoon. It is recognized by my current Sensei and several organizations. It is real and valid to me and my peers. It is real and valid to my associates. It is real and valid to the organizations I wish to associate with. I have the knowledge and skill of this system and have used it in real life on-duty.

If you don't like it...I don't care.

If you don't recognize it...I don't care.

I'm not at all concerned with your opinions in regard to me nor am I impressed with your 'book' education. I don't recall seeking your approval. Nor do I or anyone here have to answer to you. I have posted more about myself here than most.

You have absolutely no firsthand knowledge about me, therefore any negative remarks or slanders you make are without basis in fact. They are only your opinion, and one that cannot be backed up with fact.

Go ahead and try to go the slander route again...and get suspended again. You remember that don't you? You know, where you ran off at the mouth about me being someone else...and I wasn't. You remember...when you publically apologized to me here for your unkind words and mistake.

Or maybe you don't remember