What do you think about chest gear for sparring?

[Daniel Sullivan]

Yes. I noted in my above post the various sections of the body that were valid point scoring areas and the scores different techniques would receive for successful attacks. Nearly any hand technique is allowed, not just straight punches, and they can attack both the middle section (trunk) and high section (head).

Pax,

Chris

Thanks! I wasn't sure what you meant by high section; thought you'd meant the head, but I wanted to be sure.

 

[searcher]

In my school, I allow the students the option of wearing them during sparring. 90% do not wear them and they deal with the contact better than those who wear them on a regular basis. We train full contact(knockdown style) 85% now in my school, with the other 15% being more of a Kudo/Kakutogi style sparring. Normally the ones wearing the hogu/chest gear are the ones that seem to be getting injured than those who don't. My hypothesis is that the ones not wearing it don't allow themselves to take any unnecessary shots. ie., they block and move much better.

 

[geezer]

We do not use head gear or face masks ...I'm also 33 and work in a professional office environment, which just gives me more motivation to not get hit

True that!

In our style, like many others, we don't stop for points but go in rounds, and often favor flurries (aka "chain-punching" or "straight-blast") to the head. Since the offence is the defense, it only works if you rock your partner a bit. Using headgear makes it easier to safely raise the level of contact to the face without getting too beat up every time. Mouthguards and cups are a good idea too. I'm not so big on the chest guards for sparring, except for certain drills I mentioned, since they just get in the way. But if others want to go full contact, I say great. And better, post some videoclips.

 

[Gemini]

1. If you're going to use on in competition, it makes sense to use one in sparring.
2. If you're going to be a training partner for someone in competition, it also makes sense to use one for your partners benefit.
3. Kids should always use one. (Self explanatory, I hope)
4. If you're going to train in self defense, it not only doesn't help you, it will, in all likelihood, prove detrimental. Spar without it. It's bulky. It offers protection you're not going to have in your daily attire. It will most definitely contort your expectations of taking mid section strikes.

Of course, there are always exceptions to these, but these are the norm.

 

[puunui]

I've never trained in it myself, but I know people that do, and was wondering what are the pros/cons?

Whether you wear one or not during sparring, the hogu or chest protector is an invaluable training tool for both the attacker and wearer. If I could only do one thing in preparation for a sparring tournament under the WTF rules, it would be hogu drills. Having said that, I am surprised how many dojang don't know what hogu drills are and don't utilize it as a basic and essential part of tournament preparation.

 

[Dirty Dog]

1. If you're going to use on in competition, it makes sense to use one in sparring.
2. If you're going to be a training partner for someone in competition, it also makes sense to use one for your partners benefit.

Agreed.

3. Kids should always use one. (Self explanatory, I hope)

Not self-explanatory at all. Kids in our school do not use them, as a rule, any more often than adults. As matter of fact, the only person who routinely wears a hogu is an adult.
We teach control from day one, and kids are expect to demonstrate control when sparring. Do you think kids are more fragile than adults?

4. If you're going to train in self defense, it not only doesn't help you, it will, in all likelihood, prove detrimental. Spar without it. It's bulky. It offers protection you're not going to have in your daily attire. It will most definitely contort your expectations of taking mid section strikes.

Of course, there are always exceptions to these, but these are the norm.

Agreed. We're not a tourney-oriented school, which may have something to do with why we don't generally use hogu.

 

[dancingalone]

Whether you wear one or not during sparring, the hogu or chest protector is an invaluable training tool for both the attacker and wearer. If I could only do one thing in preparation for a sparring tournament under the WTF rules, it would be hogu drills. Having said that, I am surprised how many dojang don't know what hogu drills are and don't utilize it as a basic and essential part of tournament preparation.

I've just discovered them in the last year myself. No surprise there considering my non-KKW TKD roots. Now that I do know about them, I've embraced them wholeheartedly. There's nothing like practicing with a live partner and the hogu provides good feedback with certain techniques like the roundhouse kick.

 

[puunui]

I've just discovered them in the last year myself. No surprise there considering my non-KKW TKD roots. Now that I do know about them, I've embraced them wholeheartedly. There's nothing like practicing with a live partner and the hogu provides good feedback with certain techniques like the roundhouse kick.

I wish we discovered you fifteen years ago. You would be producing national champions and national team members right now. But you're right, there is nothing like it for practicing footwork and kicking against a live target.

 

[Gemini]

Not self-explanatory at all. Kids in our school do not use them, as a rule, any more often than adults. As matter of fact, the only person who routinely wears a hogu is an adult.
We teach control from day one, and kids are expect to demonstrate control when sparring. Do you think kids are more fragile than adults?

Well, we agree on 2 of 3, so that boring. Let's look at this one.

Limiting my response for the purposes of this topic, training pre-teens for competition is fairly one dementional. You wrap them in protective gear and tell them to kick. Obviously, that evolves over time, but again, I'm limiting this to the topic. Training pre-teens for self defense is quite a bit more involved.

I train pre-teens in hogus as a general rule. There are times we do not, but again, it's the rule. As you, I teach control from day one also, but yes, I have found smaller ones take longer to learn control than most adults. (I have had adults that refuse to learn control but that's another topic.).Lastly, yes, I think child (pre-teen) students are certainly more fragile than their adult counterparts. I also believe children's parents are more fragile than the children themselves and appreciate seeing their children introduced to martial sport with protective gear. As for self defense, which is what my school primarily focuses on, whether children wear them or not depends on what they're learning. What I teach small children is very basic but effective as it has more to do with self protection than offensive strikes. They will learn what a strike feels like without a hogu, but they will receive a steady diet of it. Tolerance for receiving strikes needs to be built up over time. At what speed depends on the student. That's one of the advantages of a small school.

If you're experience differs, I'm not that surprised as my experience in teaching is in the low hundreds which I'm sure is considerably less than some here. Maybe over time my experience will teach me different.

 

[Dirty Dog]

Well, we agree on 2 of 3, so that boring. Let's look at this one.

Sorry, didn't mean to bore you. I'll try to be more confrontational. Would it help if I called you names?

Limiting my response for the purposes of this topic, training pre-teens for competition is fairly one dementional. You wrap them in protective gear and tell them to kick. Obviously, that evolves over time, but again, I'm limiting this to the topic. Training pre-teens for self defense is quite a bit more involved.

Agreed. We don't train for competition, so that's not something I consider.

I train pre-teens in hogus as a general rule. There are times we do not, but again, it's the rule. As you, I teach control from day one also, but yes, I have found smaller ones take longer to learn control than most adults. (I have had adults that refuse to learn control but that's another topic.).Lastly, yes, I think child (pre-teen) students are certainly more fragile than their adult counterparts. I also believe children's parents are more fragile than the children themselves and appreciate seeing their children introduced to martial sport with protective gear. As for self defense, which is what my school primarily focuses on, whether children wear them or not depends on what they're learning. What I teach small children is very basic but effective as it has more to do with self protection than offensive strikes. They will learn what a strike feels like without a hogu, but they will receive a steady diet of it. Tolerance for receiving strikes needs to be built up over time. At what speed depends on the student. That's one of the advantages of a small school.

If you're experience differs, I'm not that surprised as my experience in teaching is in the low hundreds which I'm sure is considerably less than some here. Maybe over time my experience will teach me different.

I think the parents are far more fragile than the kids, honestly. And frankly when they're first starting, most kids, especially younger kids, aren't really capable of delivering much power. By the time they learn to generate much power, they've learned control. Obviously there can be exceptions, but if they're delivering power without control, we just pair them up with someone they're not going to hurt.

 

[Gemini]

Sorry, didn't mean to bore you. I'll try to be more confrontational. Would it help if I called you names?

Lol. You didn't bore me. I simply meant being in agreement requires no further discussion. In response to your statement though, there's a lot of space beween boring and confrontational. While I've often found you to be direct or even challenging, I don't recall ever seeing you be confrontational. You demonstrate too much maturity I'm afraid.

I think the parents are far more fragile than the kids, honestly. And frankly when they're first starting, most kids, especially younger kids, aren't really capable of delivering much power. By the time they learn to generate much power, they've learned control. Obviously there can be exceptions, but if they're delivering power without control, we just pair them up with someone they're not going to hurt.

I think for the most part, we share the same over all opinion. I would disagree with learning to demonstate control before power though. I've found the opposite to be true. Students learn power through technique, not strength, which they pick up pretty quickly. While we do control excercises from early on, control seems to always come later. Of course, that could also be related to my teaching methods. As for pairing down, my school is too small to be able to handle such situations as you do. I have to rely on other methods.

 

[RobinTKD]

I've only just discovered Hogu training this week, I absolutely love it. Not just being able to kick my partner full contact, but I took some kind of sadist pleasure in being kicked full contact too, something that hasn't been done to me since playground fights in school.

I think it will become an invaluable training tool, my instructor wants to start teaching me and the other 2 black belts some hogu drills as we meet up and train outside of class, so he wants to set us some stuff to really concentrate on. It's also highlighted the difference between me and our Second Dan. When he does a jump kick, he goes for big height, aims his kick right at your temple. When I do jump kicks, I go for length, try to kick through my opponent, my flexibility does need work, but i can aim at the head with a good side kick or back kick, and spinning or jump variations of both. All the difference means at the minute is that when he puts in a big jump and i counter with a cut kick or back kick, I usually make contact with his groin.

Glenn, is there any books dedicated to hogu training? I know you have an extensive library.

 

[Gnarlie]

I have Sang H Kim's 100 Scoring Techniques DVD which is OK, even if some of the techs are a little outdated now. I have the Lopez DVD's and those are good too, and a bit more up to date, and I find that they clarify footwork quite well.

 

[puunui]

is there any books dedicated to hogu training? I know you have an extensive library.

I would say that video would be a better way to approach it than buying books. You can search youtube and will probably find it. There is a video topic "the art of taekwondo competition" in the taekwondo forum which has some elementary hogu drills in it. There is also an older video by Master Kuk Hyun Chung that is pretty good, given how old it is. I would suggest that you purchase this, if you can't find it for free on youtube:

http://www.amazon.com/Taekwondo-Tra...6QD8/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1333334620&sr=8-1

 

[Stac3y]

For me, it's a necessity. I don't like wearing it, and I wear the lightest, most flexible version I can get (Martial Armor's t-shirt style vest), but I HAVE to wear something. I had 3 dislocated ribs on the right side once, and 2 broken ribs on the left side TWICE in less than a year. Apparently, my ribs are brittle--not really surprising for a 44 year old woman. And I compete a lot.

I have worn hogu a couple of times, but I find them incredibly restrictive and uncomfortable, and I don't like having a big red dot target on my chest.