If I were you, I would be considering changing the people that I associate with.
Two Taekwondo contestants have altercation before contest
- Thread starter mango.man
- Start date
If I were you, I would be considering changing the people that I associate with.
Korean culture is exempt, or makes it exempt. I have been to many tournaments in Korea and never once seen a coach or parent arguing about a call. It just doesn't happen. And if those Korean born grandmasters who lost their cool in the US were at an event in Korea, I am sure they would follow the cultural norms in Korea instead of doing what they might do in the US.
To use another example, in Korea, all Taekwondoin receive Kukkiwon poom and dan certification, no exceptions. Someone may come up and argue that that is not true, that their Korean born grandmaster in the US does not issue Kukkiwon dan certificates but instead issues his own dojang certificates with his name and signature on it, that it is Korean culture to do so. But if you look at the reasons why the Korean born grandmaster in the US does it, he might give you a whole bunch of reasons such as he doesn't want to pay the Kukkiwon "tax" for dan certification, that there is no regulation that forces him to issue Kukkiwon certification, that he is living in the US and as an American he can do whatever he wants. These are American attitudes, not Korean cultural ones, which in fact would have him doing something totally different.
I am glad that I missed what you call "some very good entertainment". I don't need to see Coach Woody Hayes punching one of his players either.
troubleenuf
Blue Belt
Sometimes I read what you wright and think that you must live in a vacuum... or at least you live with blinders on and only see what you want to see. Im glad your "Korean born Grandmasters" are perfect. I and obviously others have seen another side of it. Im betting there is more that goes on around you than you are seeing or than you know but no big deal. Keep on playing your Beatles music and put on those rose colored glasses buddy!!!
I see it on the news at least a couple of times each year it seems. Video of oriental politicians fist fighting on the floor of their congress or parliament that is.
I'm not saying that my teachers are perfect. They are human like everyone else. But I will say that I try to aim for the highest expression of whatever martial art that I am studying, and seek out teachers and situations that allow me both see and reach for that highest expression. That's why I choose the teachers that I do, people who tend to be founder types or pioneer types. I purposely and intentionally choose not to experience what you and some others have experienced, because I do not wish to get bogged down arguing about the lowest common denominator. What it really comes down to, again, is the choices that we make. I am happy with my choices and decisions, and if I had to do it all over again, I would do exactly the same thing. I certainly harbor no ill will or hostility towards any of my teachers, Korean born or not. Whether that makes me someone who listens to the Beatles while wearing rose colored glasses is for you to decide. I will say this though, I can see a change as the pioneers retire and/or otherwise leave the movement, replaced by others, who in my opinion, are less capable.
I am I am glad that our Hawaii legacy and history does not include instructors who flip tables, swear, fight with other instructors or cause disruptions at our local tournaments. Perhaps that is one of the reasons why some senior referees at USAT National Events say that Hawaii athletes and coaches are always respectful, polite and well mannered.
There was one Korean born instructor who lived here in the 70's. He was the ITF representative for the state, but he would show up at the state association meetings and argue with the others. One of my teachers said that he pulled a knife once on another instructor at one of the meetings. Some others said that he was involved in protection of some Korean run businesses. They eventually founded him in his car one morning, dead with two taps to the head. He apparently had stepped on the toes of some of the organized crime people here. General Choi replaced him with GM KANG Ik Mu, who left some time in the 80's to go to Texas. GM Kang moved back to Hawaii after the non-Korean head of his organization was murdered while working the drive through window at Jack in the Box.
troubleenuf
Blue Belt
Dont get me wrong. Those days are long gone and good riddance to them. But they did happen and they were a product of the legacy of the times the Koreans that came here grew up in. My instructor grew up right after the Korean war. As he put it Korea was in chaos. Many had fled to the big cities. There were gangs and thugs everywhere. His father put him in TKD so he could survive. I think we forget that the tenants are great to teach and to live by but when you are trying to survive in a war torn country those things go out the window pretty quick (I dont think they taught much of that back then anyway). Anyway, this is way of track from this subject.
I have. More than once unfortunately.
taekwondodo
Green Belt
finally, the correct story:
http://www.mercurynews.com/crime-co...earch-www.mercurynews.com-www.mercurynews.com
http://www.mercurynews.com/crime-co...earch-www.mercurynews.com-www.mercurynews.com
A lot of people confuse the roundhouse kick with a spin hook kick. They hear "roundhouse" and visualize a spin hook kick.
granfire
Sr. Grandmaster
they hear kick and only know round house (thank you Chuck Norris)
I know. Subject specific terms are not a reporters strong suit these days.
In any case, it's not really important if the instep or the heel connected....the distasteful incident is the core of the problem.
Before you posted this someone had already corrected the story having seen it for themselves, the truth was only one competitor was at fault so would you still punish both of them?
granfire
Sr. Grandmaster
I know I am being a jerk here, but collecting a shot to the head without block....
He might have been writing as the other post went up....
It is sad that such occurrences happen, yet they do happen. A combination of blame must go to parents, coaches, participants, and maybe the event organizer and judges.
OK not speaking of TKD but in general.
Many years ago brawls in the ring would happen but that’s just the way tournaments where back then.
If you had a beef with someone you slugged it out in the ring if the two of you still held a grudge it might carry over to the next tournament but was usually finished after that.
Did fights occur out of the ring YEP. I can remember more than a few cases where participants where taken to a back room by their instructors and told to get it out of their system once and for all. Instructors fighting other instructors, yep. The back room was used to discuses many different things from bad scoring to just plain “your an *******, fraud,” etc.
Attitude back then was not so much about sportsmanship but “WIN”, prove to your opponent that you beat him and leave no chance of him disputing it.
Heck I'm not even sure when the sportsmanship came into tournaments.
Now as for today’s competitors: If they have no discipline they need to be banned from further competition ( cursing or getting angry without violence may need other disciplinary action). A coach who has multiple occurrences of their students with disciplinary problems should be barred from bringing students if not barred from all events along with all their students.
OK not speaking of TKD but in general.
Many years ago brawls in the ring would happen but that’s just the way tournaments where back then.
If you had a beef with someone you slugged it out in the ring if the two of you still held a grudge it might carry over to the next tournament but was usually finished after that.
Did fights occur out of the ring YEP. I can remember more than a few cases where participants where taken to a back room by their instructors and told to get it out of their system once and for all. Instructors fighting other instructors, yep. The back room was used to discuses many different things from bad scoring to just plain “your an *******, fraud,” etc.
Attitude back then was not so much about sportsmanship but “WIN”, prove to your opponent that you beat him and leave no chance of him disputing it.
Heck I'm not even sure when the sportsmanship came into tournaments.
Now as for today’s competitors: If they have no discipline they need to be banned from further competition ( cursing or getting angry without violence may need other disciplinary action). A coach who has multiple occurrences of their students with disciplinary problems should be barred from bringing students if not barred from all events along with all their students.
