The whole McDojo thing!

[thaiboxer]

Originally posted by white dragon

I personally have had kickboxing experience, and maybe that has helped me to know just how getting a blow to the head ISN'T a good thing. I see in another post you mention this yourself

Also as for the dropping the hands bit, you've seen my view on this at: www.martialtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=10435#post10435

i mean all the guys ive had experience with, and even on the movies you see a karate/TKD guy or whatever with their hands down even around their chest area. personally i keep them right in front of my nose, then i can turn the hand and grab punches, i can curl it up to block a snap kick or hook, or i can bring them straight up in front to guard against straight punches.the elbows are tucked into the ribs as well to guard against a rib roundhouse/kick. i definitely wouldnt give any mug a chance to hit me in the head thats for sure.

 

[Datu Tim Hartman]

Originally posted by Dutch



Not everyone can be a brain surgeon. The world needs ditch diggers too.

Dutch,
this is Hartman. Take it easy on the TKD. Not passing judgment on the style, you just need to chill a little. If not I'll come to London and Jap-slap you like I did in Zimbabwe last year!

 

[GouRonin]

Don't you worry about Dutch. I'll deal with him. I don't think he's ready for this jelly...my fists are too bootylicious for the dude.
:shrug:

 

[jeffbeish]

The rank thing is not new. There have been belt sales going on for quite a long time and it will not stop until someone invents a new attraction to market. When I started in Martial Arts it was mysterious and intriguing. It was the “Judo chop” that was whispered about. That was in the early 1950’s when I was caught up in it as well. When I actually began to learn MA I began to understand that it wasn’t magic but hard work. It took me decades of hard work and sweat to understand what it was meant by, “never miss practice.” It means, simply, that you forget after a time and no matter how much rank you had unless you practice to your level you loose it.

I was a yodan Judo for many years when I was offered, for old time sake, rokudan. Hum, that’s a jump and it was expensive. Just think, a red and white belt! Wow. Just think of how many I could impress. I think the person who offered this to me was 1) hard up for cash, 2) getting old and forgetful, and 3) caught up with himself to realize that of all people I could care less about ranks anymore since I had not practiced in so long. So, even though I had not practiced in a long time I did not forget my teachings about humility and respect for the Martial Arts. It is not about rank. I have seen a lot of belt selling over the years and it is easy to get caught up in it.

At any rate it must really hurt when one realizes he or she comes to realize they have been had.

 

[white dragon]

THAIBOXER -

as I've said before, I hate seeing guys do this, and completely agree that it's a really stupid way to fight. Teach them a lesson, smack them in the face a couple of times, that'll soon make them understand why people keep their hands up! Personally, my hand position changes between two different positions, one very similar to yours it seems, and the other with my lead arm out more which is a habbit I think I picked up from JKD. I find I automatically revert back to the first type though whenever I get in close, it also allows me to put elbows in the combinations too.

Renegade -
For a second there I got my hopes up and thought Dutch was in London, England, sadly not it seems.

 

[arnisador]

Thanks for that perspective jeffbeish. It's too easy to think that it's all new, or that it's all associated with one or a few arts.

 

[thaiboxer]

Originally posted by white dragon

THAIBOXER -

as I've said before, I hate seeing guys do this, and completely agree that it's a really stupid way to fight. Teach them a lesson, smack them in the face a couple of times, that'll soon make them understand why people keep their hands up! Personally, my hand position changes between two different positions, one very similar to yours it seems, and the other with my lead arm out more which is a habbit I think I picked up from JKD. I find I automatically revert back to the first type though whenever I get in close, it also allows me to put elbows in the combinations too.

Renegade -
For a second there I got my hopes up and thought Dutch was in London, England, sadly not it seems.

yeah i mean traditional MT have the arms out, makes it easier to grab for grapple, and catching kicks, but it does leave head open, but from most ringfights i see in thailand they just elbow each other anyway, punches dont score many points.
good for you then, thanks for explaining what you do appreciate it, catch you later

 

[jeffbeish]

Originally posted by arnisador

Thanks for that perspective jeffbeish. It's too easy to think that it's all new, or that it's all associated with one or a few arts.

Since I've not be active in Judo for some years now it is hard for me to pipe up on such issues. We always had rank problems and organizational turf wars that broke up many personal friendships. I hated it back then. I was never much for joining organizations, but was a member of the first Air Force Judo Association back in the early 1960's. Before that my sensei just never advised us to join anything. By the end of the 1960's the wars heated up. We had signed up all the military associations and sometime at the end of the 1960's we split off from the Judo Black Belt Federation to form the UJSA. They did likewise and formed the USJF. We had many court battles. It was useless.

It was mainly over money, rank, and who was boss. It still is. The Kodokan licensed me in all but my last rank. Since I ma going over there next week I’ll just stop by, present my Kodokan life membership, and proof of my IJF rank and buy a fancy Kodokan Judo rank license certificate. It’s that simple. It has always been that simple. It is best not to show certificates. I have my first mounted on my playroom wall and I am the only one who sees it. Vanity.

I always told my student that the belt only held up their pants and jacket (Judogi). But, to Americans such talk is out in left field. Now that I am too old to mix it up with the younger Judo people I will just keep quite, except for an occasional patch of 2 cents.

Now, many of my old friends from those days are passed on and making amends will have to wait.

Anyone ever hear of Rick Mertens?

 

[Dutch]

Originally posted by white dragon

For a second there I got my hopes up and thought Dutch was in London, England, sadly not it seems.

No. While I love the Queen and think we need her back I doubt I would fit in over in England as I have straight teeth and I don't talk like an idiot.

 

[Toasty]

Wait you study AT or own a Dragon kenpo school? dragon kenpo - the crap you can get through the mail right? and if you pay enough you can "buy" an instructorship (through hard diligent training in your own home with a VCR!!!) ARE YOU F###ING KIDDING ME!
If in fact this is some local studio that happens to unfortunaly share the same name I wholeheartedly apologize. If in fact you do train in that crap - please do us all a favor and get off line and get to a real MA school & do some real training.

my .02
Rob

 

[Dutch]

Dragon Combat Kenpo is not as easy to get as one might think. You must pay close attention to it's truth as you study the devestating attacks and defences. It's karate for outlaws for a reason. You may think you can defend yourself but really can you do so realistically with your own dangerously obsolete methods?

Many people get trapped into traditional aspects of their art. You can use traditional martial arts, but there are traps that keep 95% of traditional martial arts students from learning even basic practical survival methods, much less combat mastery. The art should serve us and not us serve the art.

Street self defense has changed dramatically over the years due to the influence of drugs, gangs, and a lessening of value of other people's rights.

Along with my other Dragon Kenpo brothers the techniques I teach have no tournament usefulness. They are not about scoring points or impressing judges. They are, almost without exception, illegal in full contact martial arts competition. They are for rendering an attacker unable to continue. Please pay attention to this point: any self-defense style you can spar with is a game or is inneffective!!

The Dragon Kenpo way, however, is the way of never ending learning and discovery. The techniques taught are guides that develop greater skill, not boundaries that none may cross. The traditional arts are in the business of setting limitations. Their primary task is the creation of an imposed order and the production of conformity. There are no rules in total combat, so the Dragon Kenpo way is the path of free expression. The methods taught begin the process of endless discovery. We have only two choices are martial artists and as human beings: To be ordinary or to be explorers. to be followers or leaders. Regardless of who approves.

Our lineage is
James Mitose
KOSHO-RYU KEMPO
William K.S. Chow
CHINESE KARA-HO KENPO
Ed Parker
AMERICAN KENPO
Jay T. Will
AMERICAN KENPO
Ed Hutchison
DRAGON KENPO

We're a valid and more importantly real self defense system. Unlike most of the frauds out there. because we do things differently the rest of the community scoffs at us. We don't care. We're the real thing.

 

[thaiboxer]

Originally posted by Dutch

"Many people get trapped into traditional aspects of their art. You can use traditional martial arts, but there are traps that keep 95% of traditional martial arts students from learning even basic practical survival methods, much less combat mastery. The art should serve us and not us serve the art."

i agree totally here.

"Along with my other Dragon Kenpo brothers the techniques I teach have no tournament usefulness. They are not about scoring points or impressing judges. They are, almost without exception, illegal in full contact martial arts competition. They are for rendering an attacker unable to continue. Please pay attention to this point: any self-defense style you can spar with is a game or is inneffective!!"

hope you werent refering to MT here, we have to hold back somewhat mate, else none of us will be ever training again.

 

[Dutch]

I have to admit that it's hard to be right and not have people understand.

The Australians are a tough people and with the exception that they and the Canadians are too ignorant to know they need the monarchy they are ok people. I suppose that you'd have to be if you're from the land down under as you are decendants of people who were homosexual criminals or for example, like people in Canada who only came from people to dumb to even learn to steal so they got kicked out of England.

You're ok.

 

[white dragon]

Ummm, in this Dragon Kempo, you don't hold the title of "Grand High Wizard" do you? You do realise that martial art students aren't the only ones that go around wearin white a lot of the time, don't you?

 

[Dutch]

If you want to run around in a bedsheet and cheer on some grand high wizard go ahead. It sounds like you're a member of the KKK but that's for you to decide. Myself, I think those guys are kooks and weirdos. I refuse to teach any racist losers my secret Dragon techniques.

 

[Kirk]

Originally Posted By: white dragon
Ummm, in this Dragon Kempo, you don't hold the title of "Grand High Wizard" do you? You do realise that martial art students aren't the only ones that go around wearin white a lot of the time, don't you?

ROFL! I aplaud your wit!

 

[thaiboxer]

Originally posted by Dutch

I have to admit that it's hard to be right and not have people understand.

The Australians are a tough people and with the exception that they and the Canadians are too ignorant to know they need the monarchy they are ok people. I suppose that you'd have to be if you're from the land down under as you are decendants of people who were homosexual criminals or for example, like people in Canada who only came from people to dumb to even learn to steal so they got kicked out of England.

You're ok.

well on the monarchy issue, we still are a monarchy here unfortunately, im a republican. Who needs the bloody queen, she doesnt do anything for us. And in the past all the bloody poms have done is send us to gallipoli and the places they couldnt conquer and waste valuable men. So dont get me started on the flamin monarchy geez. bunch of a$%#holes, who tax the poor people of england more than they have to be, for their own coffers.
dunno about the homo thing mate. im certainly straight as. i wont go there on this issue anyway.
The convicts from england to australia, were predominently people who had minor misdemeanours really (that were big crimes in those days), like stealing a loaf of bread before starvation (where were the monarchy then to feed the poor? lovely bunch arent they), so i dont know whether to take this as an insult or humour.

 

[thaiboxer]

Originally posted by Dutch

If you want to run around in a bedsheet and cheer on some grand high wizard go ahead. It sounds like you're a member of the KKK but that's for you to decide. Myself, I think those guys are kooks and weirdos. I refuse to teach any racist losers my secret Dragon techniques.

what other moves possibly are there? there are only a certain amount of realistic ways you can hurt someone without getting belted yourself first, well against a decent opponent anyway. What secret dragon techniques do you know? cmon suprise me.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

I'm not sure how to take alot of this thread....

 

[jaybacca72]

Dutch, you're a damn nutcase!
:shrug: