"THE WAy"

[delicate Flower]

The question I pose to the forum is one of great thought and curiosity and am interested in others opions on this issue, in all my studies of Karate-Do, readings, videos, etc... Is it still possible to truly live the way of the Bushi and truly find "THE WAY" thru Martial Arts in this day and age???
I wonder if Miyamto Musashi and other infamous people figured in his/her writings that society would be where it is today, and is it truly possible, short of becoming a monk, to truly live the way????

Way back then, they had to work just as hard for much less then we do (meaning physical ownership of material items), it seems that the only things that got them thru was the belief and the practice of the way.Im sure they appreciated material things more then we do now days, it seems that we are a disposable nation.

So with that being said what are your thoughts out there...............???????

 

[Xue Sheng]

The only thought I have at the moment on this is that the term "the way" is incredibly Taoist and directly related to the book the Tao Te Ching.

And supposedly it is attainable do everyone. However I am willing to say I bet it is a lot easier for a monk.

 

[tshadowchaser]

Way back then, they had to work just as hard for much less then we do (meaning physical ownership of material items),

you have never seen how small my pay check is

I think it is possible today but that it may take someone truly dedicated because of all the distractions that are around today

 

[SFC JeffJ]

The way of a Bushi? I honestly think your best bet would be in the various combat arms corps in the military. Many people today forget a big part of Bushido was being willing to lay down your life for your lord without question.

 

[Fu_Bag]

delicate Flower,

Welcome to MartialTalk.

Interesting question. I probably need to re-read Funakoshi-sensei's "Karate-Do" book but I think that it is possible to incorporate some of the personal qualities of past, and present, martial arts masters into your life. Things like endurance, inner strength, inner peace, humility, respect, appreciation for all things, etc. are easily applied to the modern world. These types of qualities can enable you to more easily survive and endure the daily grind so that you can spend more of your time and energy on the things that are important to you.

For some people, their modern day "Lord" is either a boss, their family, or themselves. There are many people today who are willing to face certain death for any of these three. How many "battles", conflicts, and threats to our personal well-being, or that of our loved ones, do we face on a daily basis? Depending on the types of environments that people have to face to suvive, I think that there are many martial artists who rely on their training to fulfill their "duties" to whatever "Lord" they serve, and then there are those who don't have to deal with people wanting to harm them very often.

I've read something recently that was along the lines of "...the practice of martial arts can enable a person to discover their personal spiritual significance in the Universe...". I think that the same thing could be said about martial arts being a vehicle for finding your personal significance in life. As far as society goes, the more things change, the more they stay the same. Personally, I see the essence of martial arts as being timeless and, therefore, easily applicable to any day and age.

Anywho...... I hope that wasn't too rambling. It kind of turned into one of those "stream of consciousness" kinds of posts.

Respects,


Fu Bag

 

[Kacey]

Do I think it's possible to live according the moral precepts laid out in the past for martial artists? Yes. Do I think it will look the same now as it did then? No.

Like any other moral code, "the way" (or whatever your particular art calls it) is a guideline, which will look different for every person who performs it, based on their own life, their needs, accesses, and so on. "The way" provides a moral guideline not just for the use of the techniques of the art, but for the larger life outside the dojang; however, not every instructor teaches (or was taught) this aspect of the art.

 

[delicate Flower]

Interesting replys, I do agree and think one can live "the way" and I do believe that it helps in all parts of ones life, I know for me my MA has gotton me thru a lot of tough times at work, dealing with difficult situations and life in general and for that I am very thankful.

So do you think the distractions of life are worse now then they were back then, I mean obviously I dont have to worry about my crops for food, (we can got to the big stores and get anything we want if we got the money) or things like that but for them the masters of the times and the people of the time do you suppose there was less distraction and eaiser to live the way??

If any of you are instructors, do you bring this subject up in class??? Do you find any of your students asking about it or is it all just punch, block, kick???

Just wondering about the philosphy in MA now days

 

[Fu_Bag]

delicate Flower,

I think that putting a decent, healthy meal "on the table" is one of those timeless things that people throughout time have had to deal with. For many people, instead of living off of the land, and doing all the work that accompanies it, people go to an office. Back then, I believe they called it "the daily dust". Nowadays, I believe it's called "the daily grind".

I think that the whole point of "The Way" is to allow someone to be unaffected by the daily dust, even if they're covered in it, and remain healthy in body, heart, mind, and spirit, so that they can realize their greatest potential at some point within their lifetime.

I have to agree with Kacey that the application may be similar, but it may appear different due to context.

Respects,

Fu Bag

 

[Robert Lee]

First karate was not a do/way in name it was a jutsu art then when the need fell for that intence training way and for the spread of the art. it became Do /way. revised softer less geared for the real selfdefence aspect training. Now you have an extende set to all karate training/ I think this way you speak of is to preserve and spread for all that train a part of the culture and a part of what was. The way is found by each within who they are and how they grow to undersand there self through what they have learned from there training Mearly each way is each person

 

[Xue Sheng]

Many of the martial arts masters of the past only did martial arts.

They had distractions part of which was survival because someone somewhere may have wanted to kill them. So they trained their MA for survival. The Samurai for example accepted death and trained to kill if not they would be killed. But many also practiced Zen as a way of life. But they may have had fewer distractions over all. Face it things were for the most part slower and more quite than they are now

Today few of us rarely practice martial arts and only martial arts. And then there are many more small distractions that are incredibly annoying, and even though they are small they are loud. How many times during meditation, thought or training did Miyamoto Musashi, Kano or Morihei Ueshiba get interrupted by the phone or the car going by with bass blasters or their students cell phone going off?

I have not trained Japanese martial arts for many years and I never taught it. I have been training Chinese martial arts for some time and I use to teach it and no I did not bring any of this up in class. If a student asked I would talk to them briefly after class and point them in the direction of books such as Tao Te Ching, book of the 5 rings, etc. To me this is a self-realization thing and a teacher is only there to open the door that is all. And with an hour for class there is already enough for a student to have to learn and little time for extras. Which brings up another difference, when you trained MA back then you trained for hours at a time with the teacher, not an hour a week

 

[Fu_Bag]

Xue Sheng,

Excellent points! I am compelled to guesstimate an answer to this:

"How many times during meditation, thought or training did Miyamoto Musashi, Kano or Morihei Ueshiba get interrupted by the phone or the car going by with bass blasters or their students cell phone going off?"

My answer would be "only once". After that, people just knew to turn down the bass, and turn off the cell phones, when within earshot of the Master................... There's an excellent "Far Side" cartoon there....


Fu Bag

 

[Xue Sheng]

Xue Sheng,

Excellent points! I am compelled to guesstimate an answer to this:

"How many times during meditation, thought or training did Miyamoto Musashi, Kano or Morihei Ueshiba get interrupted by the phone or the car going by with bass blasters or their students cell phone going off?"

My answer would be "only once". After that, people just knew to turn down the bass, and turn off the cell phones, when within earshot of the Master................... There's an excellent "Far Side" cartoon there....


Fu Bag

LOL

But you know you may be closer correct than you think if the story I read about Sun Lutang (Xingyi, Bagua, Tai Chi master) is true, it is said that in the area he lived people passing through kept quite for fear of bothering him.

 

[Fu_Bag]

Actually, unless I'm remembering this wrong, which is entirely possible, I thought I read a quote from the current Soke of the Bujinkan that went something like "<sigh> It was so much easier when we could just kill the bad students <sigh>". Good times........ Good times....

 

[Brandon Fisher]

Depends on how you look at it. Yes we do not fight for survival everyday of our lives anymore but there are things people fight for every day today just differently. I think the ideals that are taught on Perseverence, Discipline , Faith, Honor, Courage, Honesty, Courtesy, Immobitible Sprit, among others have a very strong place in modern life.

 

[Elayna]

What is "The Way" to you? What do you see it as?
Really look into the way the great masters saw it as. I would suggest not only reading books regarding your own art but also other arts such as Kano, O-Sensei, Hatsumi and others. I believe that once you really look into the asian culture, their people, their frame of mind, and also all the great masters, you might find what your looking for.

Good Luck with your quest.
Dont let the big dogs bother you. The bark is worse then the bite.

 

[delicate Flower]

I believe that once you really look into the asian culture, their people, their frame of mind, and also all the great masters, you might find what your looking for.


I believe a Zen riddle once said, "If you seek, you will not find"

"The Way" to me is a lifestyle a meaning a philosphy a style an ethic, a spirit, I am not a god fearing man, i dont believe in creation, however i know thru my training that there is more than block kick and punch, be it my master or his or etc.. there has to be more to martial arts then block kick and punch there has to be a way.........................

 

[Brandon Fisher]

"The Way" to me is a lifestyle a meaning a philosphy a style an ethic, a spirit, I am not a god fearing man, i dont believe in creation, however i know thru my training that there is more than block kick and punch, be it my master or his or etc.. there has to be more to martial arts then block kick and punch there has to be a way.........................

You got it. I agree with you that there is more then just block kick and punch. It is a lifestyle, one that if you take to it seriously will be part of you until you die. If you study it for a lifetime you will become a better person in my mind. The confidence the training develops in a person is unsurpassed, the discipline is unique in its calmness, the honor that it teaches is great. This is just the tip of the iceberg in my opinion. It truly is a life study. Follow the path and you never know what you will find.