talking about kyorugi

[Manny]

How many of you practice besides WTF/Olimpic Style Sparring (no hands allowed) another kind of sparring like the ITF where hands can be used even to the head/face area? or something else where even in a safely way the use of sweeps and takedowns and pins for example used too.

In my city the TKD dojangs only practice WTF/olimpic saparring and we don't have any ITF dojang.

I am trying (if samboning allows me) to implement in the adult class some kind of ITF sparring using only the helmet,the globes and shin/instep pading plus the mouth piece and and groing cup.

Manny

 

[Markku P]

In the past we also did sparring with kickboxing and freestyle rules, but now only with Olympic rules.

With Hapkido training I use all kind of types of sparring.

 

[Manny]

In the past we also did sparring with kickboxing and freestyle rules, but now only with Olympic rules

Why? why only WTF rules? I think a little kickboxing can be benefical to the studentes too.

Manny

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

How many of you practice besides WTF/Olimpic Style Sparring (no hands allowed) another kind of sparring like the ITF where hands can be used even to the head/face area? or something else where even in a safely way the use of sweeps and takedowns and pins for example used too.

In my city the TKD dojangs only practice WTF/olimpic sparring and we don't have any ITF dojang.

I am trying (if samboning allows me) to implement in the adult class some kind of ITF sparring using only the helmet,the globes and shin/instep pading plus the mouth piece and and groing cup.

Manny

Okay, a couple of things that need to be addressed here.

Firstly, hands are allowed. Techniques are limited to closed fisted strikes to the torso.

Secondly, if you are looking to do this for self defense reasons, keep in mind that General Choi (since you mentioned ITF style sparring) did not consider the sparring to be self defense, but implemented it to foster a spirit of competiton. He considered the hoshinsul to be the SD element, which does not resemble ITF sparring.

Thirdly, and I'm not sure if this has ever come up in conversation with you, but if you are looking for a more free form style of fighting with kicks, punches, throws, sweeps, takedowns, and grabs, you might be served better by going to an MMA gym once or twice a week in addition to your TKD training, or a karate club, which will resemble ITF rules with regards to hands more than WTF rules do.

Lastly, while I don't see anything inherently wrong in what you are looking for, I question whether or not you have the expertise to implement it. Have you learned sweeps, and takedowns and break falling? If you're going to start tossing opponents onto the mat, falling is pretty important. Does your school teach this already? If not, have you learned falling and rolling? And if so, are you proficient enough to teach your students to fall and to roll?

Anytime you change the sparring rules, you need to do more than just change the rules. The students need to be trained to fight in that style, whatever it may be, and someone needs to be able to train them to do so. If nobody in the school presently fights in any style other than WTF, then there really is nobody there qualified to effectively implement it.

Which brings me back to the MMA gym. If this is something that you are looking for for your own personal enrichment (which is what it sounds like), then an MMA gym will likely have people on hand to train you in those areas (boxing coach, judo/BJJ coach, etc.).

Keep in mind that aside from TKD, I do not know your level of training in other areas, so I am erring on the side of caution in my post rather than assuming you to be deficient in any way.

Daniel

 

[Markku P]

Why? why only WTF rules? I think a little kickboxing can be benefical to the studentes too.

Manny

too many accidents and I personally like WTF-Sparring much more! Less pain..!:angel:

 

[chrispillertkd]

Secondly, if you are looking to do this for self defense reasons, keep in mind that General Choi (since you mentioned ITF style sparring) did not consider the sparring to be self defense, but implemented it to foster a spirit of competiton.

Well, not exactly. Each aspect of the Composition of Taekwon-Do is analogous to a soldier's military training. Accordingly, sparring (and Gen. Choi makes no distinction between free-sparring, pre-arranged sparring, foot sparring, semi-free sparring, model sparring or pre-arranged free sparring here) is like "field exercises in simulated combat."

He considered the hoshinsul to be the SD element, which does not resemble ITF sparring.

This is right. I will say that hosinsul resembles sparring in the sense that they both use Taekwon-Do techniques but in hosinsul you are able to use not only kicks and hand techniques but also throws, sweeps, joint locks, etc. Ideally, hosinsul training should start out not slowly but with a partner who cooperates taking falls until the student gets the body mechanics of the technique down and the speed and power can be increased dramatically (otherwise you just get people trying to do skills they've not practiced enough against opponents who are going to be able to use muscle and strength to resist the technique, like being able to ignore a throw by a novice judoka). Taking a fall, of course, becomes a very important skill to have

Pax,

Chris

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

Well, not exactly. Each aspect of the Composition of Taekwon-Do is analogous to a soldier's military training. Accordingly, sparring (and Gen. Choi makes no distinction between free-sparring, pre-arranged sparring, foot sparring, semi-free sparring, model sparring or pre-arranged free sparring here) is like "field exercises in simulated combat."

My thanks for the correction.

Daniel

 

[KarateMomUSA]

Quote:Originally Posted by chrispillertkd
Well, not exactly. Each aspect of the Composition of Taekwon-Do is analogous to a soldier's military training. Accordingly, sparring (and Gen. Choi makes no distinction between free-sparring, pre-arranged sparring, foot sparring, semi-free sparring, model sparring or pre-arranged free sparring here) is like "field exercises in simulated combat."

My thanks for the correction.

Daniel

Yes & the above lists the 6 types of sparring under the ITF system as devised by Gen Choi. However notice that tournament sparring is not listed among the 6 types, as that was considered sport, so it is not part of the sparring, but additional. Now ITF free sparring is where both attacker & defender are free to use all available means to attack & defend. This is like an all out (within safety) anything (almost) goes fighting, sweeps, takedowns, throws, wrestling, puncing, kicking etc.

 

[ralphmcpherson]

Our club generally uses the wtf format but with a heavier emphasis on punching. We do though, also spar using certain 'themes'. Some that come to mind are - punching only, one type of kick only or a set number of punches or kicks per round (for example 30 second rounds where a minimum of 30 punches must be thrown etc).

 

[Dirty Dog]

With the US Olympic Training center less than 50 miles away, you can probably guess what is the most common sparring in this area.
At our school, however, we spar with a more open set of rules. We're not going for knockouts, normally (although individuals have the option of going full out if they want) but it's certainly hands up and used. Basically, don't strike joints or the face (especially with the kids) or the back, but otherwise it's pretty open.