Stance Work & WC Steps

Yoshiyahu

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I was woundering What sorta of Stancework(Steps) Your lineage does.

Over the years from practicing the Wing Chun steps I have discovered alot. For instance every step is a kick and every kick is also a step. But steps can be use to add more power in your hand techniques be it Punch, Wrist lock or throw.

My lineage does what my Sihing calls the Plumflower stance work.

Here are our basic steps:

1.C-Step foward
2.C-Step Bacwards
3.Front Step
4.Back Step
5.Diamond Step (Counter Step)
6.Side Step
7.Body turning(Parallel Stance)

What are some of your steps?
 

Si-Je

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1. basic stance and stepping
2. advance stance and stepping (I like to call it wedge stance cause it works better as a wedge into your opponent's stance)
3. Humbo stepping
4. pivot
5. step and pivot (whatever it's called)
5. a) humbo step and pivot (whatever that's called, lol!)
6. kick and step

I like to teach folks to get very versitile with basic stance asap. To move in all four or more diirections. - I.E. stepping with it at 45 degrees, 90 degrees (foreward, always forward), forward, to both sides, walking and running in basic.

(I used to have the kids put a ball between their knees and have races to see who could get to the wall first without loosing their ball. They loved that one!)

We don't practice stepping backwards, everything is always forward.
 
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Yoshiyahu

Yoshiyahu

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What do you when someone is throwing kicks to fast for you block. Do you stand there? What if the forward pressure is to great?
 

Si-Je

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WC kicks cancel out the opponents kick. using heel kick to stop the execution of the kicking leg or standing leg. Then, later you learn, garn sau to stop the kicker at the first kick, stepping into their stance, throwing them to the ground by going forward.
Humbo stepping with "advance" stance (wedge) into opponent's stance effectively stepping "around" the kicking leg and into the very spot that the attacker is standing in. Taking his space away for more kicking or punching (in most styles) displaceing his structure for further kicking.

See, if you back up, dodge, or block the first kick you give them time, and opportunity to follow up with kick combinations, follow up, and allow them to "reset" for further attack.
stop the first attack, kick, punch, whatever...

Emin tells it best here in #1: He demonstrates humbo step. (steping in a half circular motion as you step forward into opponent in advanced stance, i.e. one foot in front of the other stance.)
More in depth in #3

He shows a couple of closer ranges in the 4th one here:
 
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Yoshiyahu

Yoshiyahu

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Well what if you want to do some kicking to your diaphram or stomach. I love to set up the side kick against them. I like to use evasive techniques to piss my opponent off. I like to trick them by using feints, When they take a weak step in I like to back fist the face or stomp kick the knee or scrape kick the shins. This usually wears them down. With all the constant back fist, Feints, Pak Sau to their gaurds a Pak Gurk to their legs it really gets their goat. Eventually they want to over commit an bridge the gap an go inside. When in clinch I can use chainpunches,Torque punch, Wing Chun C-steps and full front steps for whole body power behind the punch. Palm Strikes to face Ridge hand strikes to neck and throat and also elbows and knees up close an personal. Then when I am able grab the neck an force them down on their stomach so I can stomp.
 

Si-Je

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Sounds groovy to me.
I don't usually like to bait or piss people off anymore in a confrontation. (My natural personality usually takes care of that for me! lol!) I did when I was young and immortal!
Got too many old martial arts and work injuries, popped out a kid, and I'd rather just get it all over with asap.
 
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Yoshiyahu

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Well sense I am smaller guy. I usually try this tactic to wear them down.

When i feel they are sore and fatigued to where they can not use their superior strength to their advantage or the over committ providing me with openings I use my speed and flowing techniques to overwhelm them inside where I can generate the most power!
 

mook jong man

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As Si -Je said you want to be stepping into the attacker , he has a prefered range he wants to fight at which is kicking range any less than that range and he starts to feel uncomfortable .

We want to fight at punching range where we can bring our sticking hands to bear and be able to generate punching power in a small range that he cannot . In my lineage in Sigungs school in Hong Kong they don't get taught any kicking till after four years , they don't have to ,their footwork is so fast they can step into the attacker before his foot is hardly off the ground and be in their face .

My Sifu was a little less traditional so a typical defence would be if I had no warning I would raise my knee and guard with my knee to my elbow in what we called full guard or hanging horse stance protecting my centerline .

Then I either jam the kick with my heel or it gets deflected off my shin or guard then I can step down and launch my own kick or simply depending on the range step down and start punching . It all depends on how much warning and time you have that dictates the response .
 

Si-Je

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okay. cool, but don't like the waiting 4 years to kick thing. good deal Sifu Fung didn't do that too.
I find it much easier to punch hubbie after I kick him in the knee. (can't reach his face it's a foot above my head! And his arms are almost as long as my leg!)

And, plus, it always seems that big guys always have bad knees. So this has been working pretty well for me so far.

I really, really want to train more leg sensitivity like what I've seen online at some schools. Looks soooo cool! Like rubber legs rolling around a attackers kick, sweep, or whatever. I've done some, but I like to drill.
And the similar looking techniques on the ground with the legs too. Need to get a mat! Mommy's got a bad back!

Most fav. to learn next, is the hook kick used as a "hooking" motion on the attackers kicking leg, with WC side kick follow up on the back leg. Cool, cool. Need to practice that one alot more, it seems more useful to me than just Kicking the opponent's leg with Hook kick.
 

mook jong man

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okay. cool, but don't like the waiting 4 years to kick thing. good deal Sifu Fung didn't do that too.
I find it much easier to punch hubbie after I kick him in the knee. (can't reach his face it's a foot above my head! And his arms are almost as long as my leg!)

And, plus, it always seems that big guys always have bad knees. So this has been working pretty well for me so far.

I really, really want to train more leg sensitivity like what I've seen online at some schools. Looks soooo cool! Like rubber legs rolling around a attackers kick, sweep, or whatever. I've done some, but I like to drill.
And the similar looking techniques on the ground with the legs too. Need to get a mat! Mommy's got a bad back!

Most fav. to learn next, is the hook kick used as a "hooking" motion on the attackers kicking leg, with WC side kick follow up on the back leg. Cool, cool. Need to practice that one alot more, it seems more useful to me than just Kicking the opponent's leg with Hook kick.

I can safely say if Sifu Jim did teach that way to Aussies he probably would have had about 3 students , not enough to even pay the electricity bill on the place lol .

Yes they also so do about 5 or 6 hours of hard chi sau every night and as i said in another thread not many western people would be able to hack that type of training .

Yes the hook kick can be used to deflect a straight kick or roundhouse kick and then WC side kick to knee . Just make sure in the case of the roundhouse you intercept with the shin into the upper inner thigh because it doesn't matter how high they kick that part stays in relatively the same position .

Also try adding a little bit of oomph into it from your hips when raising your hook kick this can disrupt their stance and take them right off their feet with no need for WC sidekick follow up .
Its the little things that make all the difference :)
 
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Yoshiyahu

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Interesting, My Sifu taught me how to fight inside and outside. Alot of Wing Chun fighters can not do this unless they are really big. Or muscular. But I can generate power from long ranges in my kicks or short ranges with my punches. I also have a couple of Hung Gar and Tai Chi hand techniques I use for long range attacks as well along with the long range kicks. I use short range kicks and knees for close distances. I can also switch to boxing if have to in order to confuse my opponent. But I agree with the close distance. My Sifu also taught us how to punish a kick or fist by trapping it with elbow and knee. I haven't practice it much recently so I am not as accurate as I use to be! When i was a teenager I would often trap peoples fist that way or just hurt their attacking hand with a downward elbow. It stop most boxers from throwing body shots. I usually start off non-traditional to feel my opponent out. I adapt to his fighting style an utilize the principles that will best defeat his strategy. If He has a strong outside game. I use evasive tactics to wear him down and make him want to commit because he thinks that I don't know how to defend inside.

Most of the time with TKD guys and some Karate guys. When they see you throw kicks like a Kick boxer they figure you do a Japanese or Thailand Art. So they attempt to go inside an use their power. When they do I utilize the wing chun. On the outside I use basic kick boxing and judo self defense. On inside I use Wing Chin and Chin-na if I can. I also mix up Tai Chi strikes and Hung gar strikes to seriously hurt my opponent as well as confuse him.

Now if its just a sparring match. Thats another story. If I am sparring with a friend I don't use outside boxing as much. I try to charge the center and take advantage. An show him his openings. I feel for his openings an then strike high an kick low. I try different wrist locks while kicking the body or legs. etc. I use jut sao to take him off his foundation. Or I use pak sau to disrupt his guards. Some times I use an Axe kick to rake down the guards. Axe kick is from the tiger crane of course. But its useful especially if fighting a boxer who has his guards in front of him. Usually a hard kick with a tennis shoe to wrist is what you need to make him keep his hands down or closer to his body. Where he has less time to react or slap box your hands down.

As Si -Je said you want to be stepping into the attacker , he has a prefered range he wants to fight at which is kicking range any less than that range and he starts to feel uncomfortable .

We want to fight at punching range where we can bring our sticking hands to bear and be able to generate punching power in a small range that he cannot . In my lineage in Sigungs school in Hong Kong they don't get taught any kicking till after four years , they don't have to ,their footwork is so fast they can step into the attacker before his foot is hardly off the ground and be in their face .

My Sifu was a little less traditional so a typical defence would be if I had no warning I would raise my knee and guard with my knee to my elbow in what we called full guard or hanging horse stance protecting my centerline .

Then I either jam the kick with my heel or it gets deflected off my shin or guard then I can step down and launch my own kick or simply depending on the range step down and start punching . It all depends on how much warning and time you have that dictates the response .
 

Si-Je

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When i was a teenager I would often trap peoples fist that way or just hurt their attacking hand with a downward elbow. It stop most boxers from throwing body shots. I usually start off non-traditional to feel my opponent out. I adapt to his fighting style an utilize the principles that will best defeat his strategy. If He has a strong outside game. I use evasive tactics to wear him down and make him want to commit because he thinks that I don't know how to defend inside..

Good mindset! With boxer's I usually end up stepping on their foot. (I hate having to chase an opponent!)

Most of the time with TKD guys and some Karate guys. When they see you throw kicks like a Kick boxer they figure you do a Japanese or Thailand Art. So they attempt to go inside an use their power. When they do I utilize the wing chun. .

With these guys I've found that simple heel kicking their kicking attack really freaks them out. Espectially when you just stand there in basic, not bouncing around. They think your not ready, or not agressive enough to react and usually come in hard to end you. Again, it's fun to pop up that heel kick right in the gut, they hardly ever see it coming and fall for it almost everytime.
Then, they start moving around you at a distance when they figure they can't just come straight into you. But, since I'm not moving around alot they assume that I can't turn when the try to flank me. Had one girl feint, and as I stepped in with heel kick dodge to my side. It was a big surprise to her when my heel kick turned into a side kick in midair with a pivot to catch her in the gut again.

But, I'm pretty simple with sparring and defense. Whatever elese happens is up to my body, it sorta takes a mind of it's own when I'm not paying attention to it.
 
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Yoshiyahu

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Si-Je mind of its own when sparring sounds like Wu Wei. You are sparring with out trying too. Thats great. Keep up what you doing.
 

mook jong man

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That is the great thing about Wing Chun attacks and defences they are non - committed and can be interrupted and converted into something else in the blink of an eye.
 
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Yoshiyahu

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I totally agree, Non-committed an can switch and flow the next attack or defense.


That is the great thing about Wing Chun attacks and defences they are non - committed and can be interrupted and converted into something else in the blink of an eye.
 

Si-Je

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I tell hubbie that Wing Chun is like a cheap date, easy, cheap, and with no commitment. lol!
 
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Yoshiyahu

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No No don't say that. Even a cheap date can turn into a committment especially if you father a child. Opps now your committed. Lol...
Atleast for eightyears you are.


I tell hubbie that Wing Chun is like a cheap date, easy, cheap, and with no commitment. lol!
 

Si-Je

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No No don't say that. Even a cheap date can turn into a committment especially if you father a child. Opps now your committed. Lol...
Atleast for eightyears you are.


lol!
Thus, being so un-committed, once committed the commitment is more solid and binding. lol!
Maybe I should be committed!

Anyways, I just like having fun with the training. Makes me learn more.
 
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Yoshiyahu

Yoshiyahu

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lol, I think Wing Chun is alot of fun. I guess it has to grown on you though. Not everyone can have a love for gung fu!
 

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