Self Defence Orientated Martial Artists need weight training?

[Corporal Hicks]

Now,
I was sitting this new gym today trying to get used to all the equipment, and struggling madly to see how I could sort out a routine with everything available! Whereas over in the corner the current playing rubgy team were working out hard, pacing themselves, probably building some serious mass.
It started me thinking about what I do Martial Arts for and why I actually weight train!
Sure to incorporate weight training may make you a more serious Martial Artist, and maybe its now a stable part of being a Martial Artist, but I was thinking to myself, is it truely necessary for a self defence orientated Martial Artist!

Also if you were to do weight training, what kind of routines are you really looking at? Does it depend soley on the art?

Regards

 

[Blindside]

Extra strength won't hurt you. Actually mimicing a rugby players workout would be pretty good, strength training, cardio work, anaerobic work, those guys pretty much need it all.

Though the most important thing for a self-defense based martial artist is simply to aware of the world around you and try to avoid problem areas. Strength training is pretty far down the list of priorities. I would put weapon use (firearms, blade, impact) above strength training.

Lamont

 

[arnisador]

I don't think strength is nearly as important as speed and endurance as far as physical attributes that can be trained go.

But, it sure doesn't hurt!

 

[Solidman82]

I definately wouldn't say strength is a bad thing but too much strength training can slow you down. You pretty much have to have balance in your workouts (as in all things).

 

[7starmantis]

Sure to incorporate weight training may make you a more serious Martial Artist, and maybe its now a stable part of being a Martial Artist, but I was thinking to myself, is it truely necessary for a self defence orientated Martial Artist!

Also if you were to do weight training, what kind of routines are you really looking at? Does it depend soley on the art?

Regards

I dont think I would say training with weights makes you a more serious martial artists or that its a stable (staple?) part of being a MAist. Building mass and building strength are two seperate things. For someone interested purely in self defense I would recommend body weight, anaerobic workouts. There are thousands of different types of body weight workouts; pushups, dips, pullups, crunches, situps, body hops, running, bleachers, etc. More than building mass or lifting weights, this person should be in there fighting. High cardio is the key, very high.

If you must use weights, I would recomend lower weight with higher reps. Of course there are many different ideas to self defense and the style you train will subscribe to one of these. Most CMA dont use muscle strength so heavy weight training to build mass could almost be viewed as a detriment.

7sm

 

[MJS]

Now,
I was sitting this new gym today trying to get used to all the equipment, and struggling madly to see how I could sort out a routine with everything available! Whereas over in the corner the current playing rubgy team were working out hard, pacing themselves, probably building some serious mass.
It started me thinking about what I do Martial Arts for and why I actually weight train!
Sure to incorporate weight training may make you a more serious Martial Artist, and maybe its now a stable part of being a Martial Artist, but I was thinking to myself, is it truely necessary for a self defence orientated Martial Artist!

Also if you were to do weight training, what kind of routines are you really looking at? Does it depend soley on the art?

Regards

Being in shape is certainly a good thing. As it was already mentioned, I wouldn't get to the point where you'd be so bulky that it'd interfere with movement. In addition, having some good cardio is always a plus too!!

As for the weight routine that I do. I break up the parts into 3: chest/triceps, back/biceps, shoulders/legs. I usually alternate between heavy/fewer reps and lighter/more reps. There are many different programs out there. Take a few and find one that suits your needs best.

Mike

 

[Marvin]

Strength is attribute that can and should be developed just like cardio, faster punches etc, just part of general fitness of a MAist. Aside from that, the older we get, we are more prone to little nagging injuries. I think weight training helps to keep the old joints and tendons from spraining and muscles from pulling to easily.

 

[Grenadier]

Self defense techniques are designed to maximize one's leverage, instead of trying to overpower the attacker, since such techniques help maximize the defender's chances of applying their own strength to the best advantage. It's not really about trying to out-muscle the attacker, but instead, really out-smarting him by fighting smarter.

That being said, being in shape, and getting stronger while maintaining flexibility, certainly can't hurt you. It will also give you a bit more margin of error, if your technique isn't quite right, although most folks here would say "then correct the technique!."

 

[Tgace]

Athletic Training...what did the ancient Greeks bas their games on? Warfare and combat skills. Look at what football players, track and field, wrestlers, boxers etc. are doing.

 

[Corporal Hicks]

I was wondering what key components there are involved in a typical self defence situation and one of the components I came up with was the ability to use speed effectively!
That is to either move quickly and avoid or parry or to intiate a block quickly enough to block a hit?
Weight training would aid, if trained correctly in increasing speed? How is this done? Through explosive training?
When it comes to testing strength also, I've found that I follow I really good ab workout and my abs can take hits and feel generally strong, however when It goes to hanging from a bar and trying to do straight leg raises, I cannot do them? Is this due to me not learning the movement, or not having strong enough abs? Or both?
Regards

 

[BlackCatBonz]

you're onto the right idea about training for explosive speed, for my money, its the most important thing.
i always say that timing is more important than speed, but you want you strikes and blocks to be like dynamite.
as far as the leg raises go.....there are a lot more muscles involved in performing them then you might think.
try doing lower impact exercise and working your way up.......dont go crazy at the start.

 

[tshadowchaser]

working the abs helps strengthen the back and legs as well as the area you think you are working.
I would put more emphases on endurance and less on strength but both have there place in the martial arts. A strong leg workout is always good for you but at the same time you want to be able to keep you movement fast when doing martial arts (avoiding and moving in as well as kicking) so you don't want to become slow by over working legs.
make sure no matter what type of workout you do you precede it and follow it with stretching.

 

[skyguy]

My theory is that if everything else is equal (skill and experience)
the stronger guy has a distinct advantage.

I'll take all the advantages I can get, especaially since my skill at this
stage of my training is minimal

I have trained hard with weights for years, and I've already found that at least in grappling, I can best opponants ranked a lot higher than myself just by overpowering them with sheer strength.

As my skill increases I hope to become a formidable opponant by having both skill and strength at my disposal.

 

[BallistikMike]

Strength training definitely has its place in Self-Defense. You could look at your muscle mass as your armor...so to speak.

The main thing is to keep the weight training simple and train core body movements that will help your self-defense training not hinder it.

I would always say the basic routine should consist of 3 main exercises.

1. Ab work. Lots of it. Including your lower back. Lots of twist work also to strengthen the obliques. This is the entire core of your body and should be strong.

2. I would do Dips. Use weights if they get to easy. It does for the upper body what Squats do for the entire body.

3. And of course squats. It works the entire body and also is one hell of a cardio workout.

Abs - 5 x 20 Crunches, 5 x 20 reverse crunches (hyper extensions) , negative plate work (45 lb plate on chest and back down slowly), Standing twists with the 45lb barbell.

Dips - 5 x 10 with weights. Just body until you can complete that

Squats - 1 x 20 or 5 x 5 with heavy wieghts. Or 5 x 10 with moderate weights. I also put weight on the shoulders and work on traditional stance training with an extra 100+ lbs on. Helps keep the feet grounded LOL.

These three alone will make your core body very strong and you can fill in other isolation exercises but they arent necessary.

I hate taking away from my bag work or scenario training train with lots of supplemental training like cardio and weight lifting so I try and combine them into 2 solid workouts per week for about 90 minutes each. The rest is all on drills and scenario training as well as basics.

You punches will hit harder ifyou get your core beyond where it is now. I promise you that.

 

[Jerry]

Is it neccessairy for a self-defense-oriented martial artist to weight train? No it is not. I'd consider time at the gun range more important.

Is it useful for a self-defense-oriented martial artist to increase his strength, endurance, and (to an extent) mass? Yes, it generally is very useful. (though I see no reason that it need be weights; most millitairy exercise routines work without them)

Does the type of training depend solely on the art? No, not solely, but the art can certainly come into play. The mass that helps in sumo will get in your way in a "run and gun" firefight. There will be some universals (endurance good, speed good, strength good), but ideal balances will be affected by a great deal.

 

[Flying Crane]

I used to incorporate a fairly comprehensive weight training program into my routine. Problem was I found it boring, and it sucked up a lot of time that maybe would be better spent practicing my art. I finally compromised and now I do a moderate series of stomach crunches, pushups, and arm curls. Nothing more. It takes little time to do so the boredom aspect is minimized and I am free to spend the time training my art instead.

Could weight training be useful for a self-defense approach to martial arts training? Yes, I think so, but neither do I think it is necessary. Think about how you would like to spend your time. Maybe focusing more on your art will develop better skills, so a need to rely on strength is reduced.

 

[arnisador]

Yeah, the boredom and the time commitment are a definite problem for me with the weights. I'm not happy about how long I have to spend on it--especially since on so many nights I must do it late in the evening, before bed, because of work and the kids.

 

[Flying Crane]

Yeah, the boredom and the time commitment are a definite problem for me with the weights. I'm not happy about how long I have to spend on it--especially since on so many nights I must do it late in the evening, before bed, because of work and the kids.

I always found it hard to sleep if I did weight training just before I go to bed. Body is too tight, can't relax.

 

[arnisador]

It's definitely undesirable. I'd also rather do it during the day when I'm eating than before bed when I'm not. I try to shift as many training days to the weekend as possible--including that I have every 2nd Friday off from work--but, there's only so much one can do!

 

[Flying Crane]

there's only so much one can do!

That is our curse. If only I didn't need to work a job...GO LOTTO!!